Can one claim delay repay if the delay were due to misinformation?

[ChessTiger]

I live in South Wales, and caught a Transport for Wales train up to Wilmslow.
The train was clearly labelled ‘Manchester Piccadilly’.
When I arrived at Crewe, they decided to make the carriage I was in form part of the Holyhead train, which would go off in a different direction. No announcement was made on the train regarding this, and by the time I realised what had happened, it was too late to disembark.
consequently I went out of my way to Chester, then back to Crewe, to catch another train to Wilmslow.
I was 2 hours late as a result of this.
While the correct carriages of my original train would have got me to Wilmslow on time, or just a few minutes late, the lack of information delayed me two hours.
Are occurrences like this common, and does this delay through their lack of communication/negligence qualify for delay-repay?

 

[AlterEgo]

It does qualify as a reason although you may have trouble in convincing them there was misinformation. If there are other people in the same position, which there no doubt would be if there really was no announcement, this would help your case.

 

[Andy Pacer]

I'd guess this may be one that the automated systems will reject, so be prepared to appeal.

 

[Dai Corner]

This reminds me of an incident I witnessed last week.

There were replacement buses running between Severn Tunnel Junction and Gloucester via Caldicot, Chepstow and Lydney. There were no TfW staff at Chepstow, just a NR employee or contractor controlling access to the ticket machine on the platform.

A fellow passenger asked the bus driver if he was going to Gloucester and was told that he was, but would be going to STJ first. The passenger was welcome to board and go along for the ride. On the way to STJ we passed another rail replacement coach which would have got to Gloucester an hour before ours and the passenger could have caught if he'd waited at Chepstow.

I wonder if the Gloucester-bound passenger claimed Delay Replay and how he would have got on?

 

[ChessTiger]

I'd guess this may be one that the automated systems will reject, so be prepared to appeal.

It’s a shame that the delay repay form does not allow the client to provide further information like this. Though I guess most cases are simple and factual (was that train an hour late?…)

The rail operator must know that they diverted carriages on that particular train. Hopefully this is unusual, and it should be well communicated.

I am sure we were not the only ones caught out by this, so as you say, it would be helpful if more people who were caught out come forward.

 

[Bletchleyite]

Are occurrences like this common

Yes. TfW is utterly, utterly awful at properly informing about portion working. Other TOCs manage it fine, too.

If it was unexpected (and I don't think there's a planned portion working of that nature) then the guard really should come through doing a full ticket check and making sure everyone is in the right bit. But even for planned ones it's bad. Their station PIS (an older system) doesn't do it properly, and the on-train ones don't work half the time, yet they're too lazy to have old style window stickers to make up for it. I'd certainly attempt a claim to make a point that they need to get it right.

 

[WesternLancer]

It’s a shame that the delay repay form does not allow the client to provide further information like this. Though I guess most cases are simple and factual (was that train an hour late?…)

The rail operator must know that they diverted carriages on that particular train. Hopefully this is unusual, and it should be well communicated.

I am sure we were not the only ones caught out by this, so as you say, it would be helpful if more people who were caught out come forward.

either go down D-R route and Appeal when needed (help and advice here if required along the way of that process) - and / or complain to TfW customer services and ask them for compensation in line with the D-R calculated entitlement.

 

[185]

In fairness to TfW's staff, the PA systems are utterly terrible on most of their stock for guards making manual announcements.

There probably was an announcement, but since their automated recorded rubbish went in, all their stock now has crackly, quiet manual PA announcements.

 

[Watershed]

I live in South Wales, and caught a Transport for Wales train up to Wilmslow.
The train was clearly labelled ‘Manchester Piccadilly’.
When I arrived at Crewe, they decided to make the carriage I was in form part of the Holyhead train, which would go off in a different direction. No announcement was made on the train regarding this, and by the time I realised what had happened, it was too late to disembark.
consequently I went out of my way to Chester, then back to Crewe, to catch another train to Wilmslow.
I was 2 hours late as a result of this.
While the correct carriages of my original train would have got me to Wilmslow on time, or just a few minutes late, the lack of information delayed me two hours.
Are occurrences like this common, and does this delay through their lack of communication/negligence qualify for delay-repay?

Did the announcements at your origin station indicate you should board any particular part of the train? Or announcements onboard?

If neither, then you would have a claim. But as others have said, it's likely to be rejected initially as the train will (presumably) have arrived on time - albeit without you onboard!

Logs are held of which train has worked which service so it shouldn't be too hard for TfW to verify the basics of your account. But they will obviously be unable to verify whether or not announcements were made.

 

[1955LR]

I live in South Wales, and caught a Transport for Wales train up to Wilmslow.
The train was clearly labelled ‘Manchester Piccadilly’.

A similar situation occurs on trains on the Cambrian Coast which usually have Aberystwyth as the destination at Shrewsbury , although half of the train often heads for Pwllheli at Machynlleth . The station announcements at Shrewsbury advise which portion is applicable . I have known the order being reversed when in transit and everybody has had to swap over . Passengers not familiar with the split often are confused or unaware as to whether they are in the correct half as the onboard announcements are often unintelligible, due to distortion or low volume . On the plus side every time when I have travelled ,( about 5 times a year for the 10 years) staff when checking tickets will advise if you are in the wrong half and come again through the train when approaching Machynlleth informing which half to occupy. Even during Covid restrictions they did pass through advising of the split , but not checking/selling tickets etc.

 

[Deafdoggie]

A similar situation occurs on trains on the Cambrian Coast which usually have Aberystwyth as the destination at Shrewsbury , although half of the train often heads for Pwllheli at Machynlleth . The station announcements at Shrewsbury advise which portion is applicable . I have known the order being reversed when in transit and everybody has had to swap over . Passengers not familiar with the split often are confused or unaware as to whether they are in the correct half as the onboard announcements are often unintelligible, due to distortion or low volume . On the plus side every time when I have travelled ,( about 5 times a year for the 10 years) staff when checking tickets will advise if you are in the wrong half and come again through the train when approaching Machynlleth informing which half to occupy. Even during Covid restrictions they did pass through advising of the split , but not checking/selling tickets etc.

Aberystwyth is always the front train at Machynlleth. The whole train reverses direction in Shrewsbury if coming from Birmingham. So it's the rear train for Aberystwyth on departure from Birmingham but the front train on departure from Shrewsbury even though it's the same train.

 

[sd0733]

I live in South Wales, and caught a Transport for Wales train up to Wilmslow.
The train was clearly labelled ‘Manchester Piccadilly’.
When I arrived at Crewe, they decided to make the carriage I was in form part of the Holyhead train, which would go off in a different direction.

Was this by any chance the train on a Sunday which arrives Wilmslow around 1500? If so it's actually booked to do that. There are no through coaches from beyond Cardiff to Manchester even though its advertised as a Manchester service.

 

[swt_passenger]

Was this by any chance the train on a Sunday which arrives Wilmslow around 1500? If so it's actually booked to do that. There are no through coaches from beyond Cardiff to Manchester even though its advertised as a Manchester service.

Just to confirm, here it is on RTT for this Sunday, which shows coaches to be added at Cardiff and a split at Crewe. Looks as though it operated just as shown in this schedule:

Realtime Trains | 1W09 1032 Swansea to Manchester Piccadilly | 07/08/2022

Real-time train running information for 1W09 1032 departure from Swansea to Manchester Piccadilly on 07/08/2022. From Realtime Trains, an independent source of train running info for Great Britain.

www.realtimetrains.co.uk

 

[sd0733]

Just to confirm, here it is on RTT for this Sunday, which shows coaches to be added at Cardiff and a split at Crewe. Looks as though it operated just as shown in this schedule:

Realtime Trains | 1W09 1032 Swansea to Manchester Piccadilly | 07/08/2022

Real-time train running information for 1W09 1032 departure from Swansea to Manchester Piccadilly on 07/08/2022. From Realtime Trains, an independent source of train running info for Great Britain.

www.realtimetrains.co.uk

Had a feeling it would be that one. The split at Crewe is always a nightmare, really from Swansea it should be advertised as a Holyhead service seeing as that's where those coaches go!

 

[yorkie]

Definitely put in a claim, but perahps do it it via email rather than use the standard form. Let us know how you get on.