Could we see enhanced fequencies on the Hertford East branch?

[cle]

Moderator note: Split from https://www.railforums.co.uk/threads/hertford-east-branch-platform-extension-updates.229607/

Great news. Will there ever be anything in the way of duplication to enhance frequency? I could see it having 4tph (either route, or 2 slow and 2 fast).

 

[TheHSRailFan]

Great news. Will there ever be anything in the way of duplication to enhance frequency? I could see it having 4tph (either route, or 2 slow and 2 fast).

Unfortunately not, The section at ware, where the track goes into a single track for the station(because of a listed building next to the line as well as other problems) and also the frequency of trains on the West Anglia are issues that would be needed to be overcome.

 

[47421]

The 2016 Franchise Agreement specified increase from 2 to 3 TPH off peak to Hertford WEF May 2019. No increase in peak service specified. There was also specified a recast West Anglia timetable from May 2020 with various enhancements (extra TPH from Camb etc) but that never happened. No scope for fasts as Hertfords provide much of the service at Lea Valley stations, which are already poorly served compared with the parallel Overground service via Seven Sisters.

Once all the 317s are gone there should be some scope for speeding services up, but seems timtable will only be updated at same time as East Coast timetable is, as that affects KX - Cambridge which affects all of West Anglia. (GA have never consulted on any new WA timetable, and the GE consultation for Dec 2021 recast was quietly forgotten for reasons never made clear AFAIK)

10 car 720 will of course be a big uplift in capacity, but unless timetable shifts peak extras from Stratford to Liv St, the Stratfords will be 5 car for forseeable future as platforms 11 and 12 at Stratford are 5car 720 max and apparently no plans to extend them.

 

[Shwam3]

10 car 720 will of course be a big uplift in capacity, but unless timetable shifts peak extras from Stratford to Liv St, the Stratfords will be 5 car for forseeable future as platforms 11 and 12 at Stratford are 5car 720 max and apparently no plans to extend them.

There are definite plans to extend Stratford platform 11 to 10 car and move a signal on platform 12 (provision to extend the platform to 10 car later on).

 

[cle]

The 2016 Franchise Agreement specified increase from 2 to 3 TPH off peak to Hertford WEF May 2019. No increase in peak service specified. There was also specified a recast West Anglia timetable from May 2020 with various enhancements (extra TPH from Camb etc) but that never happened. No scope for fasts as Hertfords provide much of the service at Lea Valley stations, which are already poorly served compared with the parallel Overground service via Seven Sisters.

Once all the 317s are gone there should be some scope for speeding services up, but seems timtable will only be updated at same time as East Coast timetable is, as that affects KX - Cambridge which affects all of West Anglia. (GA have never consulted on any new WA timetable, and the GE consultation for Dec 2021 recast was quietly forgotten for reasons never made clear AFAIK)

10 car 720 will of course be a big uplift in capacity, but unless timetable shifts peak extras from Stratford to Liv St, the Stratfords will be 5 car for forseeable future as platforms 11 and 12 at Stratford are 5car 720 max and apparently no plans to extend them.

Ahh yes, I remember there was a third Cambridge which was a fast pattern (fast from Tottenham to Audley End possibly?) that never happened.

I wonder if there could ever be an even outer pattern, maintaining the Harlow and Bish intervals, like -
00 Stansted
10 Cambridge
20 Stansted
30 Cambridge
40 Stansted
50 Cambridge

As i think 3tph to Stansted fast should be ok. With a slow or two in there also to Stratford - and 1-2tph to Cambridge

 

[Bald Rick]

I wonder if there could ever be an even outer pattern, maintaining the Harlow and Bish intervals, like -
00 Stansted
10 Cambridge
20 Stansted
30 Cambridge
40 Stansted
50 Cambridge

That pattern wouldn’t work; unless you didn’t want to serve many of the Lea Valley stations. Also the smaller stations north 9f Broxbourne would have to be skip stopped.

 

[Alfie1014]

That pattern wouldn’t work; unless you didn’t want to serve many of the Lea Valley stations. Also the smaller stations north 9f Broxbourne would have to be skip stopped.

Agreed that’s why the Cambs and Hertfords are flighted behind the quarter hourly Stansteds (in normal times), plus the LO services operate at 15 minute intervals which aren’t obviously compatible with a 20 minute cycle either.

 

[jopsuk]

of course dealing with most of this would be one of the benefits of Crossrail 2 (currently very much on hold/in the deep freeze), which would deliver ~20tph to the lea valley stations (which the last time I saw, included 4tph Stratford services)

 

[EllieAquitrain]

of course dealing with most of this would be one of the benefits of Crossrail 2 (currently very much on hold/in the deep freeze), which would deliver ~20tph to the lea valley stations (which the last time I saw, included 4tph Stratford services)

Would CR2 really put 20tph on Lea Valley? Surely that leaves barely anything for the New Southgate branch.

 

[jopsuk]

Would CR2 really put 20tph on Lea Valley? Surely that leaves barely anything for the New Southgate branch.

no, sorry, got that wrong- it would be 14-16tph at the intermediate Lea Valley stations, of which 10-12tph would be Crossrail 2 and 4tph Stratford to ??? services. Tottenham Hale was down as 27tph of which 15tph would be CR2.

 

[mr_moo]

There are definite plans to extend Stratford platform 11 to 10 car and move a signal on platform 12 (provision to extend the platform to 10 car later on).

Confirmed - Plat 11 is definately being extended at the country end (obviously!), including moving the signal.
Platform 12 is not currently planned for extension - the majority of the services use P11 to reverse as they are Stratford teminators, hence the need for that one but not P12.

It creates an interesting issue as the new platform extends onto the HS1 bridge so some interesting construction interface, plus it moves the train starting point closer to the OLE neutral section, which will probably need to be moved.