Difference in fares Oyster v contactless credit card. Is one better than the other?

[jrh2254]

I have only ever used Oyster but a recent journey experience has caused me to rethink.
I travelled from London St Pancras to Gatwick and notice I was charged £16.50 for the journey on a Friday morning (peak) at 9.10am
I now realise that had I waited until 9.30am it would have been £9 ! and had my senior railcard been applied correctly only £5.95!

So I have concluded that as Oyster is the only way in which a railcard can be applied (I think?) I should stick with Oyster?

Thank you.

 

[[.n]]

Firstly there is always the option in the example given of paper tickets / etickets to which a railcard can be applied - and paper tickets might still be better - e.g. season tickets

For "contactless" (in the wider sense, tap a card sense) - AFAIK it boils down to this [and only talking about TFL(ish) areas]

A Contactless debit card / phone payment is accepted everywhere [whereas there a few places Oyster isn't valid] - so in most cases this is the better choice - as it currently also does capping better over the course of a week

However if you have a railcard this can only be applied to an Oystercard - so in this scenario this is the better option (unless in a non-oyster card area)

 

[jon81uk]

The fare on contactless and Oyster will be the same. But you can add a railcard to Oyster and get the 30% off off-peak fares.

 

[James H]

The Oyster / contactless area is now bigger than the area where TfL’s fares apply, so some longer journeys outside Greater London will be cheaper with a paper ticket.

 

[Haywain]

I travelled from London St Pancras to Gatwick and notice I was charged £16.50 for the journey on a Friday morning (peak) at 9.10am
I now realise that had I waited until 9.30am it would have been £9 ! and had my senior railcard been applied correctly only £5.95!

It's complicated. For that journey, travelling at Peak time, it would have been cheaper to buy a paper ticket. An Anytime Day Single routed 'not underground' costs £12.90. But after 09:30 it's cheaper to use Oyster with a railcard discount applied, when the Pay As You Go fare is £5.95.

So I have concluded that as Oyster is the only way in which a railcard can be applied (I think?) I should stick with Oyster?

The railcard discount can also be applied to paper tickets and, occasionally, earlier than the Oyster Off Peak fares apply. Particularly for journeys using National Rail services, do your research first top avoid getting caught out. And remember that with Oyster there is also an afternoon peak from 1600 to 1900 when railcard discounts will not be applied. And then there's capping...

 

[Watershed]

Yes, Oyster is the only way you can obtain a Railcard discount on TfL PAYG fares. There are suggestions that Railcard discounts might be coming to contactless in the future, but I'll believe it when I see it.

Incidentally, 'splitting' at East Croydon (touching out and back in) can save you quite a bit on this journey, particularly in the context of starting just before the Off-Peak window begins. If you're positioned well (on 12 coach services you want coach 9 of 12) and do it quickly (onto the footbridge, out at the gateline and back in) you can sometimes even stay on the same train. If not, it's unlikely to cost you more than 5 or 10 minutes until the next one. Given the saving available, I'd say it's worth it if you're not in a hurry. Departing St Pancras at 09:10 it would have cost you £5.70 + £3.50 = £9.20 in total.

 

[Haywain]

There are suggestions that Railcard discounts might be coming to contactless in the future, but I'll believe it when I see it.

Project Oval phase 2. Allegedly.

 

[SAPhil]

Yes, Oyster is the only way you can obtain a Railcard discount on TfL PAYG fares. There are suggestions that Railcard discounts might be coming to contactless in the future, but I'll believe it when I see it.

Not necessarily! If you have a keygo card with a railcard added to it then in certain circumstances you do get a railcard discount applied to a contactless fare.

 

[Haywain]

Not necessarily! If you have a keygo card with a railcard added to it then in certain circumstances you do get a railcard discount applied to a contactless fare.

I think that would be a discount applied to a fare paid by what is effectively account based ticketing, rather than a contactless fare. KeyGo appears to use paper ticket fares rather than PAYG fares.

 

[SAPhil]

I think that would be a discount applied to a fare paid by what is effectively account based ticketing, rather than a contactless fare. KeyGo appears to use paper ticket fares rather than PAYG fares.

Not so! Earlier this year I had to get to St Pancras early in the morning, so caught a train at St Albans before 6:30am. The fare I was charged was an off-peak fare with a senior railcard discount - approx 5.70 as I recall. Even in the peak hours, the single fare on Keygo is the contactless and not the paper ticket price (obviously without a discount). Keygo claims to always give you the cheapest fare and most of the time on Thameslink appears to do so - much to my surprise!

 

[Haywain]

Not so! Earlier this year I had to get to St Pancras early in the morning, so caught a train at St Albans before 6:30am. The fare I was charged was an off-peak fare with a senior railcard discount - approx 5.70 as I recall. Even in the peak hours, the single fare on Keygo is the contactless and not the paper ticket price (obviously without a discount). Keygo claims to always give you the cheapest fare and most of the time on Thameslink appears to do so - much to my surprise!

That’s really good to know. I might feel the need to get KeyGo myself soon.

 

[miklcct]

Not so! Earlier this year I had to get to St Pancras early in the morning, so caught a train at St Albans before 6:30am. The fare I was charged was an off-peak fare with a senior railcard discount - approx 5.70 as I recall. Even in the peak hours, the single fare on Keygo is the contactless and not the paper ticket price (obviously without a discount). Keygo claims to always give you the cheapest fare and most of the time on Thameslink appears to do so - much to my surprise!

If so does it mean that I, as a 26-30 Railcard holder, can use KeyGo to take advantage of National Railcard discount on PAYG fares on contactless-only routes, such as Cricklewood - St Albans?

 

[Richardr]

If so does it mean that I, as a 26-30 Railcard holder, can use KeyGo to take advantage of National Railcard discount on PAYG fares on contactless-only routes, such as Cricklewood - St Albans?

See https://www.thameslinkrailway.com/help-and-support/contact-us/faqs/keygo

The following can be added:

16-17 Saver
16-25 Railcard
25-30 Railcard
Senior Railcard
HM Forces Railcard
Annual Goldcard
Network Railcard
Disabled Persons Railcard*
Jobcentre Plus Discount Card

 

[paul1609]

If so does it mean that I, as a 26-30 Railcard holder, can use KeyGo to take advantage of National Railcard discount on PAYG fares on contactless-only routes, such as Cricklewood - St Albans?

Believe that the Keygo contactless price match only applies to journeys wholly in Zone 1 to 6 so no it wouldnt apply on a journey to st albans

 

[Haywain]

Believe that the Keygo contactless price match only applies to journeys wholly in Zone 1 to 6 so no it wouldnt apply on a journey to st albans

On the contrary, the 'best fare' commitment suggests that you can't be worse off using KeyGo and there's a good chance of being better off. As there are contactless fares from Cricklewood to St Albans then even if a discount isn't applied the worst that can happen is to be charged the discounted paper ticket fare.

Note that I have not used KeyGo and this is based on what I have read up over the last few hours.

 

[paul1609]

Ive never really used mine where contactless fares exist but the website says;
What will I be charged using keyGo?
At the end of the day, we analyse all your entry and exit taps and apply the most appropriate fare for the journeys you made. The fare will be based upon the ticket types available that day and the time you travelled on our services, we will then charge you the best available ticket(s) for your journeys.
Ticket types include:

Anytime	Off-Peak	Super Off-Peak
Day Single	Day Single	Day Single
Day Return	Day Return	Day Return
One Day Travelcard	One Day Travelcard	One Day Travelcard

Plus, for journeys wholly within the London Zones 1-6 area, will be charged the appropriate Pay As You Go fare, subject to the relevant Daily Cap charge.
If you have a Railcard added to your online account, the Railcard discount will be applied to relevant journeys.

If you have a child key card, child fares will be charged.
Fares will be standard class only.

 

[Richardr]

There is contactless, as in using credit cards, and KeyGo. KeyGo uses the Thameslink fare structure, and gives the best fare from that. Credit Card contactless uses the TfL fare structure, and that is a different fare structure, for example it doesn't include returns. What it means is that there are certain journeys where the credit card contactless through TfL can be cheaper, e.g. some single fares where a return isn't required, mostly they are similar, but at weekends KeyGo is somewhat cheaper for returns. I haven't got any discount card, so can't comment on whether that changes the picture.

In my experience, KeyGo has an advantage of automatically recognizing delay repay.

 

[SAPhil]

As I mentioned earlier KeyGo doesn't always use the Thameslink fare structure. To elaborate further, if you are making a return journey - either peak or off peak then it will use the Thameslink fares. If you are making a single journey, it will use the cheapest option which on weekdays is usually the tfl contactless fare. For six months until I retired I was paying the tfl contactless fare in the morning peak but the senior railcard discounted thameslink fare for the evening peak. If I worked late and returned home after the evening peak I was charged the tfl contactless off-peak fare with a senior railcard discount as well!

Here is my journey history for 17 October showing two single journeys both using the contactless fare structure.

 

[Richardr]

As I mentioned earlier KeyGo doesn't always use the Thameslink fare structure. To elaborate further, if you are making a return journey - either peak or off peak then it will use the Thameslink fares. If you are making a single journey, it will use the cheapest option which on weekdays is usually the tfl contactless fare.

Ignore what I wrote - you are right.

 

[silvercar]

Can I tag my question on to this thread please. A friend has just reached 60 and has a senior rail card. He needs to travel peak morning time ELS (tfl zone 6) to ZFD (tfl zone 1) on Thameslink. He previously used contactless card, but now he has a SRC, he is using a contactless in the morning as his SRC isn't valid before 10am and buying a ticket off peak for his return journey. Is there any cheaper way? I have suggested using an oyster card to save the hassle, but is that the cheapest solution? I don't know how Keygo would price the journey.

 

[SAPhil]

From Elstree KeyGo cost would be exactly the same as Oyster. Either card saves the hassle of buying the return ticket. Oyster is probably more flexible. Certainly if I commuted from there, it's what I would use!

 

[Haywain]

Can I tag my question on to this thread please. A friend has just reached 60 and has a senior rail card. He needs to travel peak morning time ELS (tfl zone 6) to ZFD (tfl zone 1) on Thameslink. He previously used contactless card, but now he has a SRC, he is using a contactless in the morning as his SRC isn't valid before 10am and buying a ticket off peak for his return journey. Is there any cheaper way? I have suggested using an oyster card to save the hassle, but is that the cheapest solution? I don't know how Keygo would price the journey.

Elstree (ELS) to Farringdon (ZFD). Please note forum rules on use of codes.

 

[Watershed]

Can I tag my question on to this thread please. A friend has just reached 60 and has a senior rail card. He needs to travel peak morning time ELS (tfl zone 6) to ZFD (tfl zone 1) on Thameslink. He previously used contactless card, but now he has a SRC, he is using a contactless in the morning as his SRC isn't valid before 10am and buying a ticket off peak for his return journey. Is there any cheaper way? I have suggested using an oyster card to save the hassle, but is that the cheapest solution? I don't know how Keygo would price the journey.

Using a Senior Railcard discounted Oyster card won't offer any saving over contactless if travelling in the peaks, as the discount only applies to Off-Peak Oyster fares - albeit journeys in the evening peak still count towards the daily Off-Peak cap.

If your friend never uses anything other than Thameslink services on their commute, they would be well advised to use KeyGo PAYG and add their Senior Railcard there. This offers the benefit of charging either the Oyster or paper fare (whichever is cheaper), with the relevant discount applied.

 

[SAPhil]

Using a Senior Railcard discounted Oyster card won't offer any saving over contactless if travelling in the peaks, as the discount only applies to Off-Peak Oyster fares - albeit journeys in the evening peak still count towards the daily Off-Peak cap.

If your friend never uses anything other than Thameslink services on their commute, they would be well advised to use KeyGo PAYG and add their Senior Railcard there. This offers the benefit of charging either the Oyster or paper fare (whichever is cheaper), with the relevant discount applied.

You are correct, I had forgotten that Oyster doesn't apply the discount in the evening peak whilst keygo does. I think the trick is to get both cards and use whichever one is most useful on a given day!

 

[Haywain]

I think the trick is to get both cards and use whichever one is most useful on a given day!

The only benefit of Oyster is for journeys that go off the Thameslink/GTR network, or to use on days when other journeys are made within London and capping will apply. For the Elstree to Farringdon journey alone it offers no benefit at all.

 

[SAPhil]

That's what I meant !

 

[silvercar]

Thanks all. So it seems that keygo is the way for days where the only journey made is on thameslink and an oyster loaded with the senior rail card for those days where he may additionally travel within London.