Edinburgh to Carstairs in order to board the Sleeper: best way of doing it?

[nitten_travell]

Hello everyone

I'm planning a trip to Germany using an Interrail pass. Ideally I would leave (Scotland) on 7th or 8th October, picking up a Eurostar via either Paris or Brussels and end the day in Karlsruhe. However, there is a large spanner and that is ECML engineering work between Scotland and Newcastle all that weekend with the subsequent longer journey times leaving things very squeezed at the other end.

My thoughts then turned to the Caledonian Sleeper (CS). Unfortunately as it departs from Edinburgh at 2340 on Friday 6th October I cannot use my Interrail pass on this train as it will use up one of my two "home" days (well, I could use it, but I'd then need to buy a separate Eurostar ticket and I'd still have lost 23 hours and 20 mins of a day of my pass). That same CS service picks up at Carstairs at 0020 on Saturday 7th October. That is after midnight, so now I can use the Interrail pass on this and on a Eurostar later in the day. Fine.

My question concerns actually getting to Carstairs from Edinburgh. There is a Scotrail service which leaves Waverley at 2313 and arrives at Carstairs at 2356. I could take that, and wait for the following CS service. Or, seeing as *that exact same CS service* will also be at Edinburgh (boarding starts 2300) before the 2313 ScotRail service departs (and assuming I cannot sweet talk the attendant into letting me board at Edinburgh) is there a way I can buy an Edinburgh to Carstairs Sleeper ticket to cover the gap in my planned journey?

 

[Watershed]

I think it would be difficult to argue that an Interrail pass didn't qualify as a rover under NRCoT condition 14.3. This means you can combine it with another ticket - in this case, Edinburgh to Carstairs - regardless of whether you Call at the splitting station (the capitalised term "Call" having a defined meaning in the NRCoT, which excludes pick-up or set-down only stops). You need only travel via your split station, which you obviously do in the case of Carstairs (the train reverses there and attaches the Glasgow portion).

I imagine it must be very rare for anyone to use a combination of tickets on the Caledonian Sleeper, but I can't see any reason this wouldn't be valid. You can obtain a free reservation for the seats (or pay to upgrade to a room) on the Caledonian Sleeper website, and there's no need to "prove" you have a valid (combination of) ticket(s) to do so - that will be checked upon boarding.

Just in case you experience any difficulties with your tickets being accepted during boarding, I'd get to Edinburgh in good time - early enough to take the 23:13 ScotRail service if need be. Sleeper boarding is supposed to commence at 23:00, so I'd aim to be there in time for that.

 

[nitten_travell]

Thanks! I would definetely reserve a room and have been investigating options.

The sleeper website (https://www.sleeper.scot/tickets/seats/) under the "Room Supplements" tab says: Interrail and Euro Rail need to be valid the date you join the train. BUT - click on the "Seats" tab and it states: Britrail / Inter-Rail / Eurail / FIP Coupons will need to be valid on the date you arrive in your destination but not necessarily on the date you join the train for departures before midnight.

It sounds like a different Interrail policy is applied depending on if one reserves a seat or a room.

 

[Fawkes Cat]

This sounds like one where a tweet to the operator in advance would be a good idea. They may confirm that travel will be fine - but if they don't, at least you will know where you stand.

 

[tspaul26]

"Room Supplements" tab says: Interrail and Euro Rail need to be valid the date you join the train.

This is the current rule, although for your purposes you are only using the pass from Carstairs in the early hours so it doesn’t actually make a difference if you use the combination of tickets as suggested above.

"Seats" tab and it states: Britrail / Inter-Rail / Eurail / FIP Coupons will need to be valid on the date you arrive in your destination but not necessarily on the date you join the train for departures before midnight.

This is the old rule i.e. you used to be permitted to start your journey using an overnight train on day -1, but only had to use one travel day (the date it arrived). As far as I am aware this no longer applies and there is now a blanket ‘the date of departure is a travel day’ even for overnight trains.

Your pass must also still be valid on the date of arrival, although you only need to use a second travel day if you take additional trains on that day after getting off the overnight train.

There is a further nuance to all of this in that with a mobile pass the day runs from midnight to midnight on Central European Time, not local time. This means that for most of the year your travel day would start at 11pm UK time and (in those circumstances) you would only be travelling on one travel day including the full sleeper leg.

However, this is a fairly technical point. The way I would handle your journey is to purchase a standalone Edinburgh to Carstairs fare (1st or 2nd class as the case may be), use day 1 of the pass from Carstairs to Euston and buy a through sleeper reservation supplement from Edinburgh to Euston.

 

[nitten_travell]

However, this is a fairly technical point. The way I would handle your journey is to purchase a standalone Edinburgh to Carstairs fare (1st or 2nd class as the case may be), use day 1 of the pass from Carstairs to Euston and buy a through sleeper reservation supplement from Edinburgh to Euston.

This is I think the best way of booking, but...

This sounds like one where a tweet to the operator in advance would be a good idea. They may confirm that travel will be fine - but if they don't, at least you will know where you stand.

I've written to CS customer service asking for clarification.

I'm really surprised that it's not explicitly stated on the website, to the extent of giving a worked example, as I cannot be the only person to have the same query.

 

[Blindtraveler]

As others have suggested, contacting the guest service centre prior to travel is probably the way forward, they tend to be more responsive by email I have found and far more helpful in that mode so that would be how I would go about it, please also bear in mind that if traveling seated a ticket check does not take place until after the train departs, the seats are at the end and the routine is usually along the lines of, train manager completes dispatch process with platform staff, train departs, train manager walks through seats to check tickets and provide customer service


If guest services are happy with your Edinburgh carstairs interail split then do keep the email dialogue and have it open on your device from the moment you bored just in case you get any difficulties which I somehow doubt, if traveling with a room supplement again I would thrash the whole thing out by email with guest services prior to departure. If I was in this position however and especially if traveling in a seat I would simply use the 23 13 Scott Rail departure and if this is cancelled then I would contact sleeper staff and explain what you had attempted to do but could now know longer achieve due to an early a canceled service





I once attempted a split ticket itinerary on the sleeper, starting in fort William and attempting to split at helensburgh as it saved a lot of money but the fuss cause meant I never did it again and would as I say recommend checking everything out with guest services

 

[Bill57p9]

Just as a further quirk of this particular scenario: IIRC on the southbound leg, Carstairs passengers (and there really can't be many) will be accommodated in the Glasgow rather than Edinburgh portion due to platform length and the Edinburgh portion being attached to the rear.

Northbound I would expect any Carstairs passengers to be accommodated in the Edinburgh portion for the same reason that some of the Glasgow portion stops west of the platform. (The Edinburgh portion being on the rear both northbound and southbound).

A similar scenario could apply with an All Line Rail Rover. I have certainly in the dim and distant past boarded an overnight train before midnight on my last day to squeeze a few more hours/miles out of it.

There is a further nuance to all of this in that with a mobile pass the day runs from midnight to midnight on Central European Time, not local time. This means that for most of the year your travel day would start at 11pm UK time and (in those circumstances) you would only be travelling on one travel day including the full sleeper leg.

I believe that UK is always 1 hour behind CET: we enter and leave daylight saving time at exactly the same GMT. It's certainly the same Sunday (unlike North America) when GB sleepers don't run anyway.

 

[zero]

I've used split tickets a few times now and the on board staff were very relaxed about it even letting me stay in the cabins when I technically hadn't paid for them - after all they wouldn't have been occupied by anyone else

 

[nitten_travell]

An update:

I sent an email to CS customer service (CS CS I suppose) and received this response:

I can confirm after clarifying with my team leader that the pass must be valid on the day of arrival, Saturday 7th October

I then asked for my particular intended days of travel which day do I activate on the app pass (Fri/Sat?):

I can absolutely confirm that for Interrail you would date your pass for the day of departure and any reservation on our services will be perfectly valid.



There is a contemporary discussion on the Eurail forum (which I did not know existed until I googled this issue), a similar issue where the OP intends to board at Garelochead, is unsure which date to activate and, unlike me, doesn't have the option of a ScotRail service to split-ticket the journey. It seems others asking CS/Interrail the same question do not get a convincing or concrete reply. The consensus is that one books a room as required and the issue is how to trick the pass into only using the day of arrival. The workaround (oh how I dislike that word!) is to enter the journey details manually, with a departure time of midnight OR to use the app to search for (e.g.) Carstairs to Euston, even though one boards at Edinburgh or Garelochead, since this will only activate one day. Or, use a paper pass!

 

[Cheshire Scot]

An alternative to Carstairs could be Falkirk Grahamston on the Highlander, depart 00.26 - buy a single from Edinburgh to Grahamston. Admittedly the arrival into London is later which might not fit with your plans.