GWR -Railcard issue - Please somebody help me

[Rajesh Krishna]

Hello, (please someone clarify this)


On 31st dec 2023, I was travelling from swindon to london paddington using Great Western Railway (GWR). I’ve got the ticket using trainline app and I didn’t realise that the 16-25 railcard option was ticked on the app.


After I reached London paddington ticket checking gate , GWR ticket checking inspector asked me to show my railcard, and i said I don't have.



He then turned on his chest camera and took all my details including address in a form and he repeatedly asked me “have you left your railcard at your home?”. Since he repeatedly asked me and I replied “yes I left at my home”. (but I actually don't have railcard but he asked me 3 times have you you left at home or not, then i said yes. Because I was thinking if I said I dont have they might arrest me thats why i said yes , I left at my home.)

Then he mentioned what i said to him on the form and finally he asked me to sign and I did. After signing this form he said that I will get a letter in around 2 weeks and in the letter the GWR will ask me to send a picture of my Railcard via email. If I send a picture of my railcard then GWR will give me a warning.

On the other hand, if I’m unable to send a picture of my railcard ,then i will be prosecuted. This is what he said.


Then I immediately applied railcard in london paddington ticket office and got the railcard within an hour after i caught and the railcard says valid until 30 dec 2024 and issued at London Paddington.

(I was caught by them at 4pm at London Paddington and around 5.30pm i got railcard at london paddington)

Now Iam waiting for the letter from GWR.
For example, if the letter comes as the ticket inspector said, can i take the picture of new railcard which i took after I caught??????

Please somebody help me as i freshly started a new job and Iam currently iam gonna renew my visa feb 2025. I even cried whether this will collapse my carrier especially affects my visa

Your help are much appreciated!!!!

 

[Titfield]

Welcome to the Forum.

No, under no circumstances lie that you held a valid railcard at the time of travel. This would be discovered and would almost certainly result in GWR escalating the matter.

I suggest that you follow the advice @Hadders usually gives in such circumstances:

What will happen next is that you will receive a letter from GWR asking for proof of holding a railcard. The letter normally takes a few weeks to arrive and will say that they have received a report that you were not able to produce a valid railcard when asked. It is important that you engage with and reply to this letter. I suggest your response includes the following in your reply:

- That you did not hold a railcard at the time of travel but have subsequently purchased a railcard (provide proof|). This helps establish good faith.
- That you are sorry for what has happened
- What you have learned from the incident
- That you are keen to settle the matter without the need for court action
- Offer to pay the outstanding fare and the train company's administrative costs in dealing with the matter

GWR are normally prepared to offer an out of court settlement to people who have not come to their attention before. There is no guarantee of this and they are within their right to prosecute you in the Magistrates Court should they decide to do so.

If you are offered a settlement the cost tends to be around £150 plus the outstanding fare. The fare you have paid already may not be taken into account. (I say may not because we have seen some occasions when fares paid have been taken into account but typically they are not). An out of court settlement might appear to be a fine, but it isn't and you won't have a criminal record as a result of accepting one.

 

[Mcr Warrior]

If you are offered a settlement the cost tends to be around £150 plus the outstanding fare. The fare you have paid already may not be taken into account. (I say may not because we have seen some occasions when fares paid have been taken into account but typically they are not).

@Rajesh Krishna. Welcome to the forum.
An undiscounted Anytime Day Single from Swindon (Wilts) to London Paddington would be £80.10 plus the admin fee, as mentioned above by @Titfield.

Expensive certainly, but assuming this was a one-off mistake (easy enough for them to check your online ticket purchasing history), then hopefully the matter can be sorted, and you won't end up with a court conviction.

 

[Rajesh Krishna]

Hello, (please someone clarify this)


On 31st dec 2023, I was travelling from swindon to london paddington using Great Western Railway (GWR). I’ve got the ticket using trainline app and I didn’t realise that the 16-25 railcard option was ticked on the app.


After I reached London paddington ticket checking gate , GWR ticket checking inspector asked me to show my railcard, and i said I don't have.



He then turned on his chest camera and took all my details including address in a form and he repeatedly asked me “have you left your railcard at your home?”. Since he repeatedly asked me and I replied “yes I left at my home”. (but I actually don't have railcard but he asked me 3 times have you you left at home or not, then i said yes. Because I was thinking if I said I dont have they might arrest me thats why i said yes , I left at my home.)

Then he mentioned what i said to him on the form and finally he asked me to sign and I did. After signing this form he said that I will get a letter in around 2 weeks and in the letter the GWR will ask me to send a picture of my Railcard via email. If I send a picture of my railcard then GWR will give me a warning.

On the other hand, if I’m unable to send a picture of my railcard ,then i will be prosecuted. This is what he said.


Then I immediately applied railcard in london paddington ticket office and got the railcard within an hour after i caught and the railcard says valid until 30 dec 2024 and issued at London Paddington.

(I was caught by them at 4pm at London Paddington and around 5.30pm i got railcard at london paddington)

Now Iam waiting for the letter from GWR.
For example, if the letter comes as the ticket inspector said, can i take the picture of new railcard which i took after I caught??????

Please somebody help me as i freshly started a new job and Iam currently iam gonna renew my visa feb 2025. I even cried whether this will collapse my carrier especially affects my visa

Your help are much appreciated!!

Welcome to the Forum.

No, under no circumstances lie that you held a valid railcard at the time of travel. This would be discovered and would almost certainly result in GWR escalating the matter.

I suggest that you follow the advice @Hadders usually gives in such circumstances:

What will happen next is that you will receive a letter from GWR asking for proof of holding a railcard. The letter normally takes a few weeks to arrive and will say that they have received a report that you were not able to produce a valid railcard when asked. It is important that you engage with and reply to this letter. I suggest your response includes the following in your reply:

- That you did not hold a railcard at the time of travel but have subsequently purchased a railcard (provide proof|). This helps establish good faith.
- That you are sorry for what has happened
- What you have learned from the incident
- That you are keen to settle the matter without the need for court action
- Offer to pay the outstanding fare and the train company's administrative costs in dealing with the matter

GWR are normally prepared to offer an out of court settlement to people who have not come to their attention before. There is no guarantee of this and they are within their right to prosecute you in the Magistrates Court should they decide to do so.

If you are offered a settlement the cost tends to be around £150 plus the outstanding fare. The fare you have paid already may not be taken into account. (I say may not because we have seen some occasions when fares paid have been taken into account but typically they are not). An out of court settlement might appear to be a fine, but it isn't and you won't have a criminal record as a result of accepting one.

Welcome to the Forum.

No, under no circumstances lie that you held a valid railcard at the time of travel. This would be discovered and would almost certainly result in GWR escalating the matter.

I suggest that you follow the advice @Hadders usually gives in such circumstances:

What will happen next is that you will receive a letter from GWR asking for proof of holding a railcard. The letter normally takes a few weeks to arrive and will say that they have received a report that you were not able to produce a valid railcard when asked. It is important that you engage with and reply to this letter. I suggest your response includes the following in your reply:

- That you did not hold a railcard at the time of travel but have subsequently purchased a railcard (provide proof|). This helps establish good faith.
- That you are sorry for what has happened
- What you have learned from the incident
- That you are keen to settle the matter without the need for court action
- Offer to pay the outstanding fare and the train company's administrative costs in dealing with the matter

GWR are normally prepared to offer an out of court settlement to people who have not come to their attention before. There is no guarantee of this and they are within their right to prosecute you in the Magistrates Court should they decide to do so.

If you are offered a settlement the cost tends to be around £150 plus the outstanding fare. The fare you have paid already may not be taken into account. (I say may not because we have seen some occasions when fares paid have been taken into account but typically they are not). An out of court settlement might appear to be a fine, but it isn't and you won't have a criminal record as a result of accepting one.

Hello @Titfield

Thankyou so much for reading and sharing your knowledge on this matter. Much appreciated.

Your comment giving me a good idea. I feel bit confident now that i found some good helping soul through this forum.

However, Please could you tell me, should i find a fare evasion solicitors to write my response to GWR when the letter comes as i don't know how to write properly and convince them to settle out of court.
Please give me your insights.


Also Iam expecting @Hadders insights. Hope, he will help me to share his knowledge as well on this matter

@Rajesh Krishna. Welcome to the forum.
An undiscounted Anytime Day Single from Swindon (Wilts) to London Paddington would be £80.10 plus the admin fee, as mentioned above by @Titfield.

Expensive certainly, but assuming this was a one-off mistake (easy enough for them to check your online ticket purchasing history), then hopefully the matter can be sorted, and you won't end up with a court conviction.

Hello @Mcr Warrior

Thankyou so much for your reply.

 

[Titfield]

As forum members we normally recommend that you write the letter back to the Train Operating Company in this case GWR.

There are a number of reasons for this:

1. For relatively straight forward cases writing a suitable letter is just that: straight forward and can be done by nearly everyone*
2. Solicitors are not needed for straight forward cases such as this and can be quite expensive.
3. Letters from the "passenger" can be more personal and come across as more sincere than one from a solicitor.

We normally only recommend using a solicitor either when the case is complicated or there is a lot at stake.

* if you search the forum (use the search tool in the top right hand corner of the page) you can find examples of other peoples letters.

Once you have received the letter from GWR and you have drafted a reply please post them (with any reference or personal details obscured) on this thread and the forum members will provide suggestions for any amendments or improvements to the response letter required.

Please do not become stressed about this. Usually people who engage with the Train Operating Company, are suitably contrite and demonstrate they have learned their lesson are offered a settlement. Once paid then the matter is done and dusted.

 

[Rajesh Krishna]

Hello @Titfield

Thankyou so much for your kind words and for the clarity.

Your answers are making me to come out from this stress. Iam very grateful for finding you.

As you said, i will wait for the letter. Once its arrived i will make a draft and definitely i will post it here to make amendments


Many thanks once again

 

[Hadders]

Welcome to the forum!

Some good advice has been given by forum members and I agree with what @Titfield has said.

There's no need to involve a solicitor at this stage, GWR are normally one of the more reasonable companies when it cones to dealing with this sort of thing, and I expect you to be able to obtain a favourable outcome if your reply includes the points mentioned upthread. Should you not get a favourable outcome from GWR then that would be the time to consider engaging a solicitor.

Feel free to post a copy of the letter from GWR (but do redact any personal detauls and case reference numbers) along with your draft reply and forum members will be happy to proof read it for you.

 

[Rajesh Krishna]

Hello @Hadders

Thank you so much for your reply as I was expecting your insights. My sincere thanks to you for coming here and answering to my queries.

Yes. I completely agree and follow what you and @Titfield said.

Once I received the letter I will post it over here with my draft message. I believe you or @Titfield will help me to make amendments

Thank you

 

[Rajesh Krishna]

Hello @Titfield @Mcr Warrior @Hadders

Its been a month since I interviewed under caution. But I haven’t got any letter from gwr. Im also talking to my company regarding visa sponsorship as iam a international graduate. During this time can i send an email to gwr prosecution department and ask for letter?

If they are not ready to settle out of court then it will surely affect my visa sponsorship when its come to renewal.

Please any advise would be greatly appreciated

 

[ikcdab]

To be honest,there isn't much point writing and asking for the letter. Sometimes it takes a while for the train company to act, so you just need to be patient.
Do check your spam emails.

 

[Titfield]

It can take a few weeks for a letter to be sent by the Train Operating Company. I would first of all double check my spam folder just in case as suggested by @ikcdab and then assuming nothing has been received just give it a couple more weeks. If they are looking at your online train ticket purchasing history this may extend the time for the letter to be sent.

In the meantime dont panic just be patient.

 

[Snow1964]

The company can take anything upto 6 months, typically 1-2 months to write. Not a lot you can do in meantime, especially if you don't yet have case reference number.

Did you previously hold a 16-25 railcard (now expired), if not it isn't clear how the railcard box became ticked.

 

[Rajesh Krishna]

Hello All

On 31st dec 2023, I was travelling from swindon to london paddington using Great Western Railway (GWR). I’ve got the ticket using trainline app but I didn’t realise that the 16-25 railcard option was ticked on the app.


After I reached London paddington ticket checking gate , GWR ticket checking inspector asked me to show my railcard, and i said I didn’t have railcard.

He then turned on his chest camera and took all my details including address in a form and he repeatedly asked me “have you left your railcard at your home?”. Since he repeatedly asked me and I replied “yes I left at my home”. (but I actually don't have railcard but he asked me 3 times have you you left at home or not, then i said yes. Because I was thinking if I said I dont have they might arrest me thats why i said yes , I left at my home.)

Then he asked me few questions and written on a form what i said to him. Finally he asked me to sign and I did.

After signing this form he said that I will get a letter to the address given in around 2 weeks. But its been 3 months since this incident was happened. I haven’t received any letter from them so far.

Soon iam going to move to other place but just because I haven’t received the letter, iam still staying in the address I gave it to them.

After reading some threads some guys mentioned that GWR will take around 6 months to process . But i cant stay in my cureent address till that time comes

So, can i email them to check wheather they have received my complaint? Or is there any chance that they forgot/not received my complaint?

If i email them voluntarily, then i feel like iam reminding them about my case.

What should I do now. Please clarify me. Yours answers are appreciated

Thanks!

 

[WesternLancer]

Hello All

On 31st dec 2023, I was travelling from swindon to london paddington using Great Western Railway (GWR). I’ve got the ticket using trainline app but I didn’t realise that the 16-25 railcard option was ticked on the app.


After I reached London paddington ticket checking gate , GWR ticket checking inspector asked me to show my railcard, and i said I didn’t have railcard.

He then turned on his chest camera and took all my details including address in a form and he repeatedly asked me “have you left your railcard at your home?”. Since he repeatedly asked me and I replied “yes I left at my home”. (but I actually don't have railcard but he asked me 3 times have you you left at home or not, then i said yes. Because I was thinking if I said I dont have they might arrest me thats why i said yes , I left at my home.)

Then he asked me few questions and written on a form what i said to him. Finally he asked me to sign and I did.

After signing this form he said that I will get a letter to the address given in around 2 weeks. But its been 3 months since this incident was happened. I haven’t received any letter from them so far.

Soon iam going to move to other place but just because I haven’t received the letter, iam still staying in the address I gave it to them.

After reading some threads some guys mentioned that GWR will take around 6 months to process . But i cant stay in my cureent address till that time comes

So, can i email them to check wheather they have received my complaint? Or is there any chance that they forgot/not received my complaint?

If i email them voluntarily, then i feel like iam reminding them about my case.

What should I do now. Please clarify me. Yours answers are appreciated

Thanks!

You could set up a Royal Mail post re-direct if you are moving address (se Royal Mail website) - then you do not have to remind GWR about your case. That could be an option for you perhaps.

 

[Rajesh Krishna]

Hi
Thankyou for this. However, I would like solve my issue with them as soon as possible. If I get the letter then I can see what they mentioned. For example, I can check, if they offer me out if court settlement or not.

Because Iam in PSW visa soon going to change my visa. So before that i feel that I want to solve this issue.

Therefore, would you recommend me to email them directly or can i leave it for now?

 

[John R]

Hello All



So, can i email them to check wheather they have received my complaint? Or is there any chance that they forgot/not received my complaint?

If i email them voluntarily, then i feel like iam reminding them about my case.

What should I do now. Please clarify me. Yours answers are appreciated

Thanks!

You are probably best emailing them if you want to get it resolved quickly. GWR are usually pragmatic and will offer a settlement. And there is a risk that a letter to you may have got lost and you end up being prosecuted without your knowledge, which will be inconvenient in terms of unwinding.

They may be taking their time because they are awaiting the results of a wider investigation of your online accounts. If you don’t have a railcard, it is a surprise that the railcard option was ticked at all on your account - they will likely seek reimbursement for any other instances they find.

 

[WesternLancer]

Hi
Thankyou for this. However, I would like solve my issue with them as soon as possible. If I get the letter then I can see what they mentioned. For example, I can check, if they offer me out if court settlement or not.

Because Iam in PSW visa soon going to change my visa. So before that i feel that I want to solve this issue.

Therefore, would you recommend me to email them directly or can i leave it for now?

yes, in that case probably an idea to e-mail them with your details, explain you are soo to move, give them a new postal address but also ask if they can contact you by e-mail. With luck this may help.

When you hear from them also head back to the forum for advice on how best to get the out of court settlement that will be in your best interest to acheive. People here will be happy to help you with what you need to write.

Also - if you are entitled to a Railcard it would be a good idea to buy one now, given what you said when you were stopped - it will help you show that you have taken steps to put matters right about what went wrong. The cost of the Railcard would not be much compared with the benefits it would bring in terms of your case as well as being able to get ticket discounts in future.

 

[Rajesh Krishna]

If you don’t have a railcard, it is a surprise that the railcard option was ticked at all on your account - they will likely seek reimbursement for any other instances they find.

Hi @Brissle Girl

Actually i’ve got railcard an year back. Once it expired I didn’t renew it. That could be the reason that the railcard option was ticked automatically

Also - if you are entitled to a Railcard it would be a good idea to buy one now, given what you said when you were stopped - it will help you show that you have taken steps to put matters right about what went wrong. The cost of the Railcard would not be much compared with the benefits it would bring in terms of your case as well as being able to get ticket discounts in future.

Hi @WesternLancer

As I mentioned above, this incident was happened on 31st Dec 2023 around 4 pm at london paddington station. As soon as they allowed me to go after asking me questions, I instantly went to paddington GWR ticket office and got the 16-25 railcard around 5pm.

 

[WesternLancer]

Hi @Brissle Girl

Actually i’ve got railcard an year back. Once it expired I didn’t renew it. That could be the reason that the railcard option was ticked automatically


Hi @WesternLancer

As I mentioned above, this incident was happened on 31st Dec 2023 around 4 pm at london paddington station. As soon as they allowed me to go after asking me questions, I instantly went to paddington GWR ticket office and got the 16-25 railcard around 5pm.

Great - this is something you can mention in your mitigation as it shows you were keen to 'do the right thing' going forwards to prevent the matter happening again.

 

[Rajesh Krishna]

Moderator note - there are multiple threads about the same case so I’ve consolidated everything into one thread to avoid confusion.

Hi all

What happened:
On 31st December 2023, i was travelling from swindon to London paddington by GWR. I’ve got the ticket using Trainline app and I didn’t realise that the 16-25 railcard option was ticked on the app.

(Making it short) At paddington station, the ticket checking inspector interviewed me under caution because I couldn’t show up my railcard when he was asked me to show. He told me I will get a letter in two weeks.

Now:
But after 4.5 months finally I got the letter from GWR (attachment-1) but surprisingly enclosed with court summons and they want me to come to Magistrate court at London on 19th June (attachment-2)

However, As you can see the front page, they’ve given me one week time to pay an out of court settlement amount which is £236.05. Also, they mentioned in the front page, if they receive an out of court settlement they will withdraw the case from the court

As soon as I saw this I immediately paid this amount (Receipt also attached )


Now my Questions are;
1)Do I still need to be in the court on 19th June? or

2) If they withdraw this case from the court as mentioned in the front page, Will my name still appears on criminal Record?

3)Do I still consult a solicitor about this case? or leave it as I paid the out court settlement during the time they’ve given me?

Please clarify these things to me.All your answers are much appreciated and I feel so grateful


Thanks

 

[AlterEgo]

As you have paid the settlement, that is the end of the matter. GWR will withdraw the case and there will be no criminal record. The matter is closed.

 

[WesternLancer]

Moderator note - there are multiple threads about the same case so I’ve consolidated everything into one thread to avoid confusion.

Hi all

What happened:
On 31st December 2023, i was travelling from swindon to London paddington by GWR. I’ve got the ticket using Trainline app and I didn’t realise that the 16-25 railcard option was ticked on the app.

(Making it short) At paddington station, the ticket checking inspector interviewed me under caution because I couldn’t show up my railcard when he was asked me to show. He told me I will get a letter in two weeks.

Now:
But after 4.5 months finally I got the letter from GWR (attachment-1) but surprisingly enclosed with court summons and they want me to come to Magistrate court at London on 19th June (attachment-2)

However, As you can see the front page, they’ve given me one week time to pay an out of court settlement amount which is £236.05. Also, they mentioned in the front page, if they receive an out of court settlement they will withdraw the case from the court

As soon as I saw this I immediately paid this amount (Receipt also attached )


Now my Questions are;
1)Do I still need to be in the court on 19th June? or

2) If they withdraw this case from the court as mentioned in the front page, Will my name still appears on criminal Record?

3)Do I still consult a solicitor about this case? or leave it as I paid the out court settlement during the time they’ve given me?

Please clarify these things to me.All your answers are much appreciated and I feel so grateful


Thanks

The only thing you may want to do nearer the date given in the court papers would be to contact the magistrates court listed to check that the court themselves have been advised that it has been withdrawn. But I suspect that this is not really necessary to do.

Keep your paperwork and proof of payment for some time in case needed. Keep it for several years.

 

[Rajesh Krishna]

Hi @AlterEgo, @WesternLancer

Thanks for your advice. I was thinking to send an email to GWR by attaching the payment receipt and asking wheather they have withdrawn this case from the court or not?

Is it okay to ask like this?

 

[WesternLancer]

Hi @AlterEgo, @WesternLancer

Thanks for your advice. I was thinking to send an email to GWR by attaching the payment receipt and asking wheather they have withdrawn this case from the court or not?

Is it okay to ask like this?

Can’t see any harm in doing that. Tho it is what their auto reply seems to say would happen. If they replied to confirm it then you have that as evidence should you ever require that.