How does London Terminals work

[Minstral25]

I'm looking into a new season ticket to Central London from Redhill and trying to avoid the All zone travel card.

Options are either a Farringdon season ticket or a London Terminals. Would I be able to use the Farringdon ticket from London Bridge or Victoria like I can the Terminals version or would I be restricted to start from one station?

The Farringdon ticket is actually more expensive than a London Terminals ticket (by only £8 per year) but the London Terminals only goes to City Thameslink - one station short

 

[Intermodal]

I believe you'd be able to use the Farringdon ticket via Waterloo and London Bridge but not Victoria. This is because the ticket is routed "Not Underground".

I'm not 100% sure on this and would welcome corrections.

 

[hairyhandedfool]

The London Terminals ticket you can use on FCC/Thameslink as far as City Thameslink (which is only a 5-10 minute walk from Farringdon) and it would allow travel from Victoria, Waterloo, London Bridge, etc.

I can't see how you'd use a Farringdon ticket from Victoria, but as noted, London Bridge and Waterloo are certainly options.

 

[Minstral25]

Thanks guys - pretty much as I expected.

Farringdon is about 5 minutes walk less than City Thameslink so useful but not end of the world. I guess I'd use London Terminals as they can be used at other stations I use for weekends etc - I.e. Victoria, Vauxhall etc

Is there a list of stations anywhere that comprises of what London Terminals includes for Southern season tickets?

 

[Intermodal]

A list of London Terminals stations is detailed in this page. The ones you can travel to are detailed in the routeing guide maps for the route Redhill to London Group.

Valid Routes from Redhill [RDH] to London Terminals:

1. Direct trains from Redhill to London Terminals
2. The shortest route (as shown in the National Rail timetable)
3. Mapped Routes:
   REDHILL GROUP - LONDON GROUP:
   • LB
   • LB + SL
   • SC

If you click on the maps linkeds (LB, LB+SL, SC) it will show you the permitted routes for that journey. You cannot travel past any of the London Terminals stations, you must terminate there.

When following a route you must not pass through one station more than once or it is not a valid route, however you may go into a station and then back out again via a different route. Full instructions for interpreting routeing guide maps can be found here. If you need any more help understanding this then just post again.

 

[John @ home]

The list of London Terminals for ticketing purposes appears on the National Rail Enquiries site on this page.

For convenience, I list them below with bold type for those valid for a Redhill - London Terminals journey.

Blackfriars
Cannon Street
Charing Cross
City Thameslink
Euston
Fenchurch Street
Kings Cross
Liverpool Street
London Bridge
Marylebone
Moorgate
Old Street
Paddington
St Pancras International
Vauxhall
Victoria
Waterloo
Waterloo East

 

[clagmonster]

There isn't a list per se as the answer to the question depends on the permitted routes from the particular station to London.
In the case of Redhill, you have the following (assuming the ticket is routed any permitted):
You may travel to London on direct trains, but only as far as City Thameslink on Thameslink services. Routes that are served by direct trains are not neccesarily permitted routes if you don't use a direct train.

The shortest route or any route within three miles of it.
By my reckoning, the shortest route is direct to London Bridge at 20.75 miles. Also allowed are:
Victoria 21 miles
Blackfriars 22.5 miles
City Thameslink 23 miles
Waterloo East 21.75 miles
Charing Cross 22.5 miles
Cannon St 21.5 miles
Vauxhall (changing at Clapham Jn) 21 miles
Waterloo 22.25 miles

Also mapped routes defined in the Routeing Guide.
Routeing permissions for Redhill-London Group are:
LB, LB+SL, SC
http://www.atoc.org/clientfiles/File/permitted_route_identifier.pdf page 800

LB gives:
Redhill-Croydon-New Cross Gate-London Bridge
Redhill-Croydon-Crystal Palace-Tulse Hill-Peckham Rye-London Bridge
Redhill-Croydon-Crystal Palace-Tulse Hill-Herne Hill-Blackfriars
Redhill-Croydon-Crystal Palace-Tulse Hill-Streatham Group-Clapham Jn-Waterloo
Redhill-Croydon-Crystal Palace-Tulse Hill-Streatham Group-Clapham Jn-Victoria
Redhill-Croydon-Selhurst-Streatham Group-Tulse Hill-Peckham Rye-London Bridge
Redhill-Croydon-Selhurst-Streatham Group-Tulse Hill-Herne Hill-Blackfriars
Redhill-Croydon-Crystal Palace-Streatham Group-Clapham Jn-Waterloo
Redhill-Croydon-Crystal Palace-Streatham Group-Clapham Jn-Victoria
Redhill-Croydon-Selhurst-Streatham Group-Clapham Jn-Waterloo
Redhill-Croydon-Selhurst-Streatham Group-Clapham Jn-Victoria
Where a route into London Bridge is shown, you may continue to Blackfriars, City Thameslink, Cannon St, Waterloo East or Charing Cross.
Where a route into Blackfriars is shown, you may continue to London Bridge, City Thameslink, Cannon St, Waterloo East or Charing Cross.
Where a route into Waterloo is shown, you may continue to Blackfriars, City Thameslink, Cannon St, London Bridge or Charing Cross.
http://www.atoc.org/clientfiles/File/Maps.pdf page 57

LB+SL gives:
Redhill-Croydon-Selhurst-Streatham Group-Tulse Hill-Peckham Rye-Denmark Hill-Blackfriars
Redhill-Croydon-Crystal Palace-Streatham Group-Tulse Hill-Peckham Rye-Denmark Hill-Blackfriars
Redhill-Croydon-Crystal Palace-Tulse Hill-Peckham Rye-Denmark Hill-Blackfriars
http://www.atoc.org/clientfiles/File/Maps.pdf pages 57 and 99

SC gives loads, see http://www.atoc.org/clientfiles/File/Maps.pdf page 95

 

[hairyhandedfool]

....You cannot travel past any of the London Terminals stations, you must terminate there....

Just to clarify....

You cannot use LUL services (except by inter-available routes) and cannot travel to, from or via Farringdon. However, you can pass through London Bridge, London Waterloo (for Waterloo East), Waterloo East and London Blackfriars in order to get to Charing Cross, Cannon Street, City Thameslink and the above named stations.

 

[Intermodal]

No. That link is to the list of London Group stations for the purposes of the National Routeing Guide.

Ah - thanks for the correction. Post edited.

 

[Minstral25]

Brilliant - it just seems a shame the City-Thameslink to St Pancras is not included.

I had forgotten that the other advantage of the Travelcard is that I can get off at any station on route which I assume I can't on the London Terminals ticket. Is that worth almost £500pa - I'm not sure.

 

[b0b]

Brilliant - it just seems a shame the City-Thameslink to St Pancras is not included.

I had forgotten that the other advantage of the Travelcard is that I can get off at any station on route which I assume I can't on the London Terminals ticket. Is that worth almost £500pa - I'm not sure.

You can get off/on at any intermediate station on a valid route with a season ticket.

 

[Mcr Warrior]

You can get a Redhill -> London St Pancras season ticket. Price is £2356 per annum (Std). (Same as Redhill -> Farringdon Und).

Redhill -> London terminals is £2344 (Std).

Redhill - London Zones 1-6 Travelcard is £2844 (Std)

 

[Minstral25]

Thanks all - think I understand it all now.

I'll probably go London terminals to City Thameslink as 4/5 times a month I go down to Victoria or Vauxhall to meet friends and I can still use that to go home, whereas with a Farringdon which costs a couple of earth pounds more its not valid.

Plus the 5 minute walk will do me good.....

 

[Caped Crusader]

Is there a London Thameslink option available from Redhill on a season ticket, if so this will allow travel to stations to City Thameslink, but might not allow to Victoria.

(once again no access to definative info and brain is in beer mode )

 

[John @ home]

Is there an option London Thameslink option available from Redhill on a season ticket

National Fares Manual NFM 10 CD shows "No Fares" for the journey Redhill - London Thameslink.

 

[b0b]

London Thameslink tickets are only available from the stations from the North

 

[hairyhandedfool]

Indeed, it's only Bedford to West Hampstead Thameslink (inclusive) that has tickets to to London Thameslink.