Last working steam in the Cheltenham and Gloucester area?

[Robspur]

Does anyone know what the last scheduled steam workings (ie not preserved or dead enroute to scrapyards) would have been in the Gloucester and Cheltenham area please?

 

[Harvester]

,Does anyone know what the last scheduled steam workings (ie not preserved or dead enroute to scrapyards) would have been in the Gloucester and Cheltenham area please?

Although probably unscheduled, an Ivatt Class 2 reached Gloucester with a freight from the Honeybourne line as late as 4th January 1967.

Source: Railway Observer.

 

[Magdalia]

Railway Observer is the monthly magazine of the Railway Correspondence sand Travel Society (RCTS), which was founded in Cheltenham in 1928.

Railway Observer for the period has some detailed reports of many of the last steam workings in the Cheltenham and Gloucester area, some of them possibly provided by the founding members. There's too much to reproduce here, but if you want to find out more, that's a good place to start.

 

[172007]

Depends on your definition of scheduled. How many steam locos did the NCB work into the 1970's in the area, would they count as scheduled?

 

[Bevan Price]

Gloucester (GWR) & Worcester steam sheds - the last in the area - closed in December 1965. That was probably the end of booked workings originating in the area, but, as noted above, there were still some inward workings, which presumably had to return to their home depots. Steam depots in the Birmingham area remained open until March 1967 (Saltley, Oxley), or April 1967 (Monument Lane, Walsall). Steam gradually retreated northwards, and by January 1968, there were no steam depots south of the Liverpool / Manchester areas, so steam visits to the Gloucester / Cheltenham areas were unlikely.

The area was not renowned for coal mining - Staffordshire, parts of Warwickshire, Notts. & Derbyshire, Forest of Dean, or South Wales were probably the nearest areas with NCB locos.

 

[Sir Felix Pole]

As far as regular passenger workings are concerned, the big change for Cheltenham / Gloucester came in November 1964 when the Hereford (via Ross) branch closed and the 'Chalford Flyer' auto service ceased - both were steam worked to the end. Standish Junction was also remodelled at the same time enabling Paddington trains to run to and from Cheltenham (St. James to 1966 then Lansdown) directly via Gloucester Eastgate. Previously they had to reverse in Central - the Cheltenham coaches were often worked to and from Gloucester by steam until quite late. Several of the extra Friday / Saturday West Country holiday services to and from the Honeybourne line continued to be steam hauled, however, right through the 1965 season.

 

[Taunton]

The Western Region "banned" steam from 1 January 1966, including inward workings from other regions, the first region to do so, though they were thwarted for a few months more by the Somerset & Dorset having to stay open. So for scheduled, that would be it south of Bromsgrove. Of course, there was possibly the odd one that might sneak over from the LMR. Things like water columns were still in service, for diesel steam heat boilers.

 

[Magdalia]

The Western Region "banned" steam from 1 January 1966, including inward workings from other regions, the first region to do so, though they were thwarted for a few months more by the Somerset & Dorset having to stay open. So for scheduled, that would be it south of Bromsgrove. Of course, there was possibly the odd one that might sneak over from the LMR. Things like water columns were still in service, for diesel steam heat boilers.

Cheltenham St James closed on 1 January 1966. It had booked steam to the end, according to Railway Observer.

Oxford shed closed to steam on the same date, but steam was not "banned" at Oxford. The York-Bournemouth and return workings were steam hauled south of Banbury right up to the closure of the Great Central in September 1966.

 

[70014IronDuke]

As far as regular passenger workings are concerned, the big change for Cheltenham / Gloucester came in November 1964 when the Hereford (via Ross) branch closed and the 'Chalford Flyer' auto service ceased - both were steam worked to the end.

These were 14XX tanks working this service, were they? I remember there were still a couple on Worcester Shed when I bashed that in August 65.

I don't wish to contradict you in any real way (and not much use to the OP), but when I visited Gloucester in August or September 65, while it was clear that steam was on the way out, there was still - how to put it - "more than a smattering" of steam on Gloucester shed and on the Bristol - Birmingham line. But only on freight by then, I think.

Standish Junction was also remodelled at the same time enabling Paddington trains to run to and from Cheltenham (St. James to 1966 then Lansdown) directly via Gloucester Eastgate. ...

Amazing that it took them so long to do that. And then, of course, 11 years later they closed Eastgate!

 

[Robspur]

Although probably unscheduled, an Ivatt Class 2 reached Gloucester with a freight from the Honeybourne line as late as 4th January 1967.

Source: Railway Observer.

This sighting intrigues me for two reasons.Firstly it is the latest report of a steam loco seen in my area ( Ashchurch ) and secondly it almost ties in with a report that i read on the Redditch RMC site in their Bromsgrove section. This stated that an Ivatt Class 2 loco number 46454 was observed arriving on a freight at Gloucester via the Honeybourne line on the evening of 6th January 1967 and that it returned north, light engine immediately. I had slight reservations in the accuracy of the report, the first being it stated Wednesday the 6th January 1967, so the RO report of Wednesday 4th makes more sense as the 4/1/67 was indeed a Wednesday.The second query that i had was that though 46454 had its last shed allocation as Saltley which would have made total sense geographically, that loco was designated withdrawn at Saltley on 8th October 1966, almost 3 months prior to the reported sighting.Could it have been used by Saltley, even though it had been withdrawn at that time ?.It is recorded as being still at Saltley in February 1967 and taken to Cashmores scrapyard, Newport and cut up in March/April 1967.

Depends on your definition of scheduled. How many steam locos did the NCB work into the 1970's in the area, would they count as scheduled?

I see your point about ex BR steam working for the NCB, but for two reasons i would not include them. Firstly the nearest NCB Collieries would have been Coventry area of Warwickshire or South Wales approx. 40 or so miles away, so not Cheltenham & Gloucester. Secondly even though they may have worked in transfer sidings they were working for the NCB not BR.

Railway Observer is the monthly magazine of the Railway Correspondence sand Travel Society (RCTS), which was founded in Cheltenham in 1928.

Railway Observer for the period has some detailed reports of many of the last steam workings in the Cheltenham and Gloucester area, some of them possibly provided by the founding members. There's too much to reproduce here, but if you want to find out more, that's a good place to start.

Thank you, i will.

Cheltenham St James closed on 1 January 1966. It had booked steam to the end, according to Railway Observer.

Oxford shed closed to steam on the same date, but steam was not "banned" at Oxford. The York-Bournemouth and return workings were steam hauled south of Banbury right up to the closure of the Great Central in September 1966.

Yes, 7029 Clun Castle worked the final steam hauled passenger into St.James station on Saturday 1st January 1966, it was the 5pm from Gloucester Central. Steam continued to appear throughout 1966, mainly on freights from the LMR albeit more sporadically as the year progressed until it was almost extinct by the end of September 1966. I know about 45 myself, the bulk of them 8F's and Black 5's but also 9F's, B1's & Standards. One that stands out was on Saturday 16th July 1966 because it was Black 5 number 44780 on a Wolverhampton to Ilfracombe PASSENGER that went as far as Gloucester before returning north later with empty passenger stock.

Gloucester (GWR) & Worcester steam sheds - the last in the area - closed in December 1965. That was probably the end of booked workings originating in the area, but, as noted above, there were still some inward workings, which presumably had to return to their home depots. Steam depots in the Birmingham area remained open until March 1967 (Saltley, Oxley), or April 1967 (Monument Lane, Walsall). Steam gradually retreated northwards, and by January 1968, there were no steam depots south of the Liverpool / Manchester areas, so steam visits to the Gloucester / Cheltenham areas were unlikely.

The area was not renowned for coal mining - Staffordshire, parts of Warwickshire, Notts. & Derbyshire, Forest of Dean, or South Wales were probably the nearest areas with NCB locos.

Yes as you say, steam was still allocated to or at least still serviced by Saltley, Oxley,Tyseley & Banbury sheds in late 1966 and up to March 1967. All these were able to send steam as far as North Gloucestershire on westward bound freights until , well at the moment January 1967 seems to be the latest sighting.

 

[Harvester]

Oxford shed closed to steam on the same date, but steam was not "banned" at Oxford. The York-Bournemouth and return workings were steam hauled south of Banbury right up to the closure of the Great Central in September 1966.

Steam was not “banned” at Westbury either. Special freights often ran from Weymouth to Westbury (via Yeovil Pen Mill and Castle Cary) until the end of Southern steam. In fact on the last day (Sunday 9/7/67) three special freights ran from Weymouth to the Midlands, steam hauled as far as Westbury. The locos (two Bulleid Pacifics and a Standard Class 5) returned LE to Weymouth, after completing their last revenue earning duty on the Western Region.

 

[Robspur]

Railway Observer is the monthly magazine of the Railway Correspondence sand Travel Society (RCTS), which was founded in Cheltenham in 1928.

Railway Observer for the period has some detailed reports of many of the last steam workings in the Cheltenham and Gloucester area, some of them possibly provided by the founding members. There's too much to reproduce here, but if you want to find out more, that's a good place to start.

I joined RCTS in May and asked the same question in the query corner section in order to get answers from Railway Observer readers. Unfortunately to date ( 19/8/22 ) no information has been forthcoming. So if you have any confirmed sightings in North Glos. through 1966 and early 1967 i would appreciate and be interested to see them.

I joined RCTS in May and asked the same question in the query corner section in order to get answers from Railway Observer readers. Unfortunately to date ( 19/8/22 ) no information has been forthcoming. So if you have any confirmed sightings in North Glos. through 1966 and early 1967 i would appreciate and be interested to see them.

 

[Harvester]

I joined RCTS in May and asked the same question in the query corner section in order to get answers from Railway Observer readers. Unfortunately to date ( 19/8/22 ) no information has been forthcoming. So if you have any confirmed sightings in North Glos. through 1966 and early 1967 i would appreciate and be interested to see them.

I have not found any reports in the RO of steam in the area after that sighting of Ivatt 46454, working a freight on Wednesday 4th January 1967. The last steam hauled passenger train reported in the RO, was with Black Five 44780 on 16/7/66, which you also mention in post #10.

Two interesting workings I did find were by B1s in February 1966. 61013 came down the Honeybourne-Cheltenham line LE on 13th, and 61035 arrived at Cheltenham on a tank train on 26th. The LNER locos were thought to have been commandeered by Saltley, after working into the Birmingham area.

 

[Robspur]

I have not found any reports in the RO of steam in the area after that sighting of Ivatt 46454, working a freight on Wednesday 4th January 1967. The last steam hauled passenger train reported in the RO, was with Black Five 44780 on 16/7/66, which you also mention in post #10.

Two interesting workings I did find were by B1s in February 1966. 61013 came down the Honeybourne-Cheltenham line LE on 13th, and 61035 arrived at Cheltenham on a tank train on 26th. The LNER locos were thought to have been commandeered by Saltley, after working into the Birmingham area.

I have now read through all the Railway Observer magazines from Jan 1966 until Dec 1967 and there are no further confirmed sightings of working steam in north Gloucestershire ( Cheltenham & Gloucester ) after 46454 on 4th Jan 1967 so that would appear to be almost certainly the final one. As it was recorded withdrawn at Saltley on 8th October 1966, it must have been fired up one last time by Saltley to replace a failed Diesel and to become the final steam interloper from the LMR on to the Western Region on that January evening in 1967.

 

[Carbean]

I did write a reply to your query via the Railway Observer (RO) as requested but have seen nothing. If I had sent to the wrong address for the relevant RO editor I would have hoped he would have redirected it instead of just ignoring it. Also Cheltenham has a thriving RCTS Branch so I would think some of their members would have replied too, obviously their replies have gone into a black hole somewhere too. A couple of books I have read have stated last working BR steam was in September 1966 when a 9F was observed passing through Cheltenham on a northbound freight (don't know how it went south). The article said there was no final steam diagram, steam just petered out. Unfortunately with almost complete removal of steam, trainspotters lost interest so there would not be many to record the last steam locomotives working in this area. As the WR was 100% diesel by 2 Jan 66, these movements must have caused problems for servicing and re-coaling of the locomotives at Gloucester or Bristol.

 

[Taunton]

As the WR was 100% diesel by 2 Jan 66, these movements must have caused problems for servicing and re-coaling of the locomotives at Gloucester or Bristol.

7 March 1966, as the S&D closure was delayed for two months. This is not being pernickety as the locos, and any final through workings, would have "escaped" northwards through Bath Green Park and Gloucester etc.

 

[randyrippley]

Steam was not “banned” at Westbury either. Special freights often ran from Weymouth to Westbury (via Yeovil Pen Mill and Castle Cary) until the end of Southern steam. In fact on the last day (Sunday 9/7/67) three special freights ran from Weymouth to the Midlands, steam hauled as far as Westbury. The locos (two Bulleid Pacifics and a Standard Class 5) returned LE to Weymouth, after completing their last revenue earning duty on the Western Region.

by then Castle Cary - Weymouth was Southern

 

[Gloster]

by then Castle Cary - Weymouth was Southern

My recollection is that the regional boundary moved from just south of Cary to just north of Dorchester in 1963. I think I have a notice about it somewhere.

 

[Harvester]

by then Castle Cary - Weymouth was Southern

But the last section of those steam freight workings into Westbury, until they ceased in July 1967, was over Western Region metals (Castle Cary-Westbury).

 

[Robspur]

Thank you to all who replied/commented on my query. An interesting incident of a steam loco appearing on the Western Region long after 31st Dec. 1965 occurred at Bristol Temple Meads as late as February 1967 !!! when the Southern Region Shedmaster at Salisbury had to find a replacement for a failed Diesel on the 1.12 pm Portsmouth to Cardiff passenger service. For whatever reason Battle of Britain number 34057 " Biggin Hill" was deemed a suitable replacement to take the train on to Bristol TM. Needless to say the powers that be at Bristol sent it back light engine to the Southern Region immediately. I would think that without doubt this must have been the last steam hauled scheduled passenger train to work on the Western Region. For more information about this occurrence check out the Bristol Rail Forum.

 

[Harvester]

Thank you to all who replied/commented on my query. An interesting incident of a steam loco appearing on the Western Region long after 31st Dec. 1965 occurred at Bristol Temple Meads as late as February 1967 !!! when the Southern Region Shedmaster at Salisbury had to find a replacement for a failed Diesel on the 1.12 pm Portsmouth to Cardiff passenger service. For whatever reason Battle of Britain number 34057 " Biggin Hill" was deemed a suitable replacement to take the train on to Bristol TM. Needless to say the powers that be at Bristol sent it back light engine to the Southern Region immediately. I would think that without doubt this must have been the last steam hauled scheduled passenger train to work on the Western Region. For more information about this occurrence check out the Bristol Rail Forum.

I can well imagine the diesel loving WR authorities being rather irritated with it’s arrival in Temple Meads, and sending it back LE post-haste. Also by 1967 there would be no coaling facilities at Bristol, and possibly no water available either, with Westbury being the nearest place on route for 34057 to replenish.

 

[Bevan Price]

I can well imagine the diesel loving WR authorities being rather irritated with it’s arrival in Temple Meads, and sending it back LE post-haste. Also by 1967 there would be no coaling facilities at Bristol, and possibly no water available either, with Westbury being the nearest place on route for 34057 to replenish.

There would still be some kind of water supply - to refill steam heating boliers on diesel locos, but maybe not one long enough to reach the tender of a Bulleid Pacific.