Legality of changing bus interior?

[heathrowrail]

Wanted to pick someone's brains.

I was wondering what's the legality of changing a buses interior for example. First bus buys Stagecoach North Devon ops & buses. Decides not to keep the Stagecoach style low backs and wants high back Civic 3s would they actually be allowed to heavily modify a bus in that way which could mean changing the grab handles along with new seats etc?

 

[randyrippley]

Well I've seen buses where it's been done...........for instance where coach seats have been ripped out and replaced by benches due to vandalism.

 

[K4016td]

Sure. The best example is widespread converting of ex-London dual door buses for provincial use by removing the middle doors and adding extra seats.

 

[bussnapperwm]

I'm sure for some changes it has to be DVSA re-certified, I think it may be to be with upseating or downseating (so changing it from say a 45 seater single deck to a 40 seater or 50 seater) or moving poles.

Birmingham Busworks say that for seatbelting "The final step is to re-certify your bus with the Driver and Vehicle Standards Agency (DVSA). Your bus is now back on the road and ready to generate income." (They do seat belting for Wright Geminis and I think E400s)

 

[Cesarcollie]

I'm sure for some changes it has to be DVSA re-certified, I think it may be to be with upseating or downseating (so changing it from say a 45 seater single deck to a 40 seater or 50 seater) or moving poles.

Birmingham Busworks say that for seatbelting "The final step is to re-certify your bus with the Driver and Vehicle Standards Agency (DVSA). Your bus is now back on the road and ready to generate income." (They do seat belting for Wright Geminis and I think E400s)

Significant changes have to be inspected by DVSA to ensure gangway widths etc meet Construction & Use regs. The certifying officer then issues a VTP5 document. That would include removing a centre door. Simply replacing bus seats with the same number of high back seats may not require this if the same seat type is used, as gangway and legroom etc dimensions wouldn’t change, nor would weight to any significant degree.

The fitment of seatbelts certainly has to be approved, and where the bus didn’t originally have them, there are now some fairly significant tests which have to be performed to demonstrate their integrity.

 

[GusB]

There are numerous examples where vehicles have been re-seated, either to replace existing seats with those of a higher/lower quality, or to simply increase or decrease the the number of seats available. One historic example I can think of is when some Scottish Bus Group Alexander Y-type Lepoards went from B53F to B61F - would this have required "approval" at the time? What about coaches that have de-mountable toilets?

I can't put my finger on it right now, but I read an article fairly recently that mentioned "dual-certification" - the ability to re-seat a vehicle from "school" layout to "normal" layout without having to go through any formal process. I think it was the Plaxton Leopard, but I'll have to do a bit of digging.

*Edit*

Found it!

Plaxton Leopard gains dual seating 3+2, 2+2 certification - routeone

Alexander Dennis has achieved dual seating certification on new Plaxton Leopard coaches. It will allow to be quickly reconfigured.

www.route-one.net

Alexander Dennis has achieved dual seating certification on new Plaxton Leopard coaches, which use the Volvo B8R chassis. It will allow the model to be quickly switched between 3+2 and 2+2 layouts without the need for a VTP5 inspection by DVSA.

The manufacturer says that such certification is available from the start of 2023 on newly built Leopards that are originally built in a 3+2 configuration. Both stock coaches and those to customer order are in scope.

 

[MotCO]

Would buses and coaches receiving new or additional seats require to be reweighed and log book amended? Also the weight recorded on the side of the vehicle would need to be updated.

 

[JKP]

There are numerous examples where vehicles have been re-seated, either to replace existing seats with those of a higher/lower quality, or to simply increase or decrease the the number of seats available. One historic example I can think of is when some Scottish Bus Group Alexander Y-type Lepoards went from B53F to B61F - would this have required "approval" at the time? What about coaches that have de-mountable toilets?

I can't put my finger on it right now, but I read an article fairly recently that mentioned "dual-certification" - the ability to re-seat a vehicle from "school" layout to "normal" layout without having to go through any formal process. I think it was the Plaxton Leopard, but I'll have to do a bit of digging.

*Edit*

Found it!

Plaxton Leopard gains dual seating 3+2, 2+2 certification - routeone

Alexander Dennis has achieved dual seating certification on new Plaxton Leopard coaches. It will allow to be quickly reconfigured.

www.route-one.net

A number of Y Type Seddons were converted in the Borders to 3+2 seating making them 62 seaters. These buses were mainly used in Berwickshire and from Kelso for school and college services.

 

[CBlue]

My rough understanding is this would require a recertification of the COIF (Certificate of Initial Fitness) https://www.gov.uk/government/publi...-alteration-to-a-public-service-vehicle-vtp-5

This would require a re-test to ensure the vehicle is still safe to operate. Simply swapping seats out that are "like for like", say low back seats replaced with high back ones to the same capacity and layout without seatbelts probably require less stringent inspections than say converting a 49 seat coach to a 3+2 70 seater.

 

[lloyd.penfold@]

Seat number / layout changes are a "Notifiable Alteration" and unless the DVLA holds tilt test data for the vehicle as modified, each one altered needs tilt testing as well as inspection. I was with a firm that bought some 2-door ex- Lothian buses and had then converted to single door, and I did the "in house" seat modification of the lower deck. The offside was VERY difficult, no more than 2mm leeway over four rows of seats! I took each one to the Garretts Green testy station to be inspected, we found that Swansea DVLA held tilt data of some identical vehicles for a a Scottish operator, which were single door from new, which saved about £1K per bus. All passed without further modification. We had to run one foe a week before the rebuilding, a unique photo of it on a hire below.

 

[DunsBus]

A number of Y Type Seddons were converted in the Borders to 3+2 seating making them 62 seaters. These buses were mainly used in Berwickshire and from Kelso for school and college services.

I know of four Seddons which went from being 53-seaters to 49-seater DPs and then to 60-seaters. In the case of two of them they had two seat changes in the space of 18 months.