London City Airport Expansion

[MPW]

BBC: LCY passenger cap raised

The annual passenger cap will increase from 6.5 million to 9 million at London City Airport under plans approved by the government.

What are people's thoughts on the end-game for the government overruling local council's rejection of LCY flight increase?

I was pretty surprised as LCY noise and pollution negatively impacts poorer parts of London and major opportunity areas along the Thames.

Then on second thought, I realised City Airport is best located for lower carbon trips to/from the airport due to its urban location, and could be further improved with additional Elizabeth Line station.

Another thing I considered is perhaps the government wants to reduce or repurpose one or more of the private airfields around the M25 (not saying which, as that might then become focus of the discussion). If there is going to be private jet traffic, it's better that the passengers aren't getting to the runway via long taxi journey, or in some cases even a helicopter. Better to have one, more central private jet hub?

Or perhaps its more simple. Other London airports want to expand. That might have some cost to the taxpayer even if the expansion itself is privately funded. Maybe this is seen as most affordable option, and the one which requires the least road investment.

 

[Tetchytyke]

I think it’s mostly symbolic: we’re open for private investment. Given it only has 3M or so passengers now, it’ll be a long time before it gets anywhere near the old cap never mind the new one.

On top of that, the noise conditions attached to the extra flights in the morning basically limit it to the A220 and the E195-E2. They’ve not had the weekend curfews changed.

I don’t see a new station ever being constructed on the site of the old Silvertown station.

 

[Cloud Strife]

It's not actually much of an expansion, all things considered. They will limit extra flights to the Embraer E2 and the Airbus A220, and I wouldn't be surprised if they end up completely banning the older ATRs and Dash-8s.

 

[MPW]

That's helpful context! Thank you

 

[Butts]

They should have opened it up even further for Sat Afternoons etc al !!

 

[Bungle965]

It's not actually much of an expansion, all things considered. They will limit extra flights to the Embraer E2 and the Airbus A220, and I wouldn't be surprised if they end up completely banning the older ATRs and Dash-8s

That’ll be the end for Loganair! Then again, they only have the one route out of City these days .

 

[Fred43123]

LCY should have additional stands (28-31) open in the near future, currently the area where they are to be built stores all the airport vehicles. These would be re-located to just outside the private jet stands - once this is complete then 28-31 can open. Some of the original stands have been upgraded to handle the A220s and E2s. With the expansion, may see the E295 operate commercial flights in the future, the E295 Profit Hunter PR-ZIQ did certfication flights back in 2022. It is my local airport so I do hear the news often

 

[FOH]

I think BA Cityflier said they wanted to upgrade their fleet but the business case rested on Saturday flights. I guess we'll see in time were they bluffing or not

 

[Fred43123]

They'll most likely upgrade to A220 or E2 aircraft in the future, but they're in process of reconfiguring their existing E190s to 106 seats from 98

 

[signed]

Is the terminal going to be expanded? From what I can read about LCY is it already overcrowded on flight departures

 

[Bungle965]

They'll most likely upgrade to A220 or E2 aircraft in the future, but they're in process of reconfiguring their existing E190s to 106 seats from 98

E2 would probably be the better fit over the A220, I should guess.

 

[Fred43123]

E2 would probably be the better fit over the A220, I should guess.

Yep especially if they go over to the E295, but they will have to modify more stands though if they was to get E2s. Currently stands 21-27 and 10 can fit the E2 and A220 if I recall.

 

[Watershed]

It's a purely symbolic move - without the weekend flight restrictions being reduced, it'll be tricky for BA CityFlyer to make a business case for expansion. At the moment they have to position empty to other airports such as STN and SOU to operate weekend flights.

 

[Chester1]

It will be interesting to see if ITA leaving Heathrow will be copied by other European flag carriers. When Alitalia went bankrupt Etihad took ownership of their Heathrow landing slots and leased them to the new Italian national airline. Without the need to preserve a valuable asset they left Heathrow in April to reduce operating costs. ITA added another Rome - LCY flight a day a few weeks ago. I am sure their minority shareholder Lufthansa will be keeping a close eye on how the London City and Gatwick combination works for ITA. It wouldn't take many transfers from Heathrow to make a significant difference to passenger numbers at LCY.

 

[GRALISTAIR]

I thought the IATA code for London City Airport was LCY?

 

[Chester1]

I thought the IATA code for London City Airport was LCY?

Yes your right. I have edited my post.

 

[GRALISTAIR]

BTW I have not flown in or out of LCY. It is on my “to do” list.

 

[Tetchytyke]

BTW I have not flown in or out of LCY. It is on my “to do” list.

It’s a nice airport. And if you can get it on a day when they’re approaching from the west it’s a really exciting landing. Make sure you sit on the right hand side.

 

[Chester1]

BBC: LCY passenger cap raised


What are people's thoughts on the end-game for the government overruling local council's rejection of LCY flight increase?

I was pretty surprised as LCY noise and pollution negatively impacts poorer parts of London and major opportunity areas along the Thames.

Then on second thought, I realised City Airport is best located for lower carbon trips to/from the airport due to its urban location, and could be further improved with additional Elizabeth Line station.

Another thing I considered is perhaps the government wants to reduce or repurpose one or more of the private airfields around the M25 (not saying which, as that might then become focus of the discussion). If there is going to be private jet traffic, it's better that the passengers aren't getting to the runway via long taxi journey, or in some cases even a helicopter. Better to have one, more central private jet hub?

Or perhaps its more simple. Other London airports want to expand. That might have some cost to the taxpayer even if the expansion itself is privately funded. Maybe this is seen as most affordable option, and the one which requires the least road investment.

An Elizabeth Line station will never have a positive BCR. The DLR provides good connections to Canary Wharf and the square mile. A NR station would cost hundreds of millions and would require a few hundred metres of walking.

I am not sure what proportion of the planned increase in passenger numbers of LCY are expected to be from larger planes using the airport in the future. The E195 E2 is now licenced to use it and Airbus is trying to get the A220-300 licenced. Even the A220-100 is bigger than most other planes that use the airport.

BTW I have not flown in or out of LCY. It is on my “to do” list.

I have once because I was transferring from a transatlantic flight and the ticket price was only £15 more than Heathrow. I knew I would save most of that on travel to Euston and I wanted to see what it was like.

 

[GRALISTAIR]

It’s a nice airport. And if you can get it on a day when they’re approaching from the west it’s a really exciting landing. Make sure you sit on the right hand side.

Thank you for the advice.

 

[edwin_m]

I worked for a while at the Crossrail offices in the CitiBank tower at Canary Wharf. This was directly under the flightpath for westbound takeoffs, and after 9/11 it was quite scary to see them coming straight towards you as they climbed out.

 

[GRALISTAIR]

I worked for a while at the Crossrail offices in the CitiBank tower at Canary Wharf. This was directly under the flightpath for westbound takeoffs, and after 9/11 it was quite scary to see them coming straight towards you as they climbed out.

Yikes I had not thought about that! Yes must have been scary.

 

[edwin_m]

Yikes I had not thought about that! Yes must have been scary.

Actually, checking by the hi-tech means of holding a ruler against Google Maps, they should have passed just to the north. But still scary.

 

[nlogax]

It’s a nice airport. And if you can get it on a day when they’re approaching from the west it’s a really exciting landing. Make sure you sit on the right hand side.

Especially good fun when you're heading to LCY from the east and then make a rather low and dramatic 180° in the vicinity of The Shard to land on 09.

 

[Jamiescott1]

It's a purely symbolic move - without the weekend flight restrictions being reduced, it'll be tricky for BA CityFlyer to make a business case for expansion. At the moment they have to position empty to other airports such as STN and SOU to operate weekend flights.

I thought they did a W configuration at weekends (example: london city to ibiza, ibiza to Stansted, Stansted to ibiza, ibiza to London city)

 

[Mojo]

City Airport is fun to fly in and out of as a passenger, but I can’t say I’m a fan of the exprience. Limited seating areas, no lounges and in my experience almost always a long queue for immigration on arrival, compared to Heathrow where there is very rarely a queue of more than 2 people ahead of me.

 

[route101]

City Airport is fun to fly in and out of as a passenger, but I can’t say I’m a fan of the exprience. Limited seating areas, no lounges and in my experience almost always a long queue for immigration on arrival, compared to Heathrow where there is very rarely a queue of more than 2 people ahead of me.

Flew out of London City last night. Pretty easy to get to on the DLR and security was very quiet. Never used it for any international flights.

 

[AlterEgo]

City Airport is like Euston. It’s cramped, dated, and not an ideal place to spend a long time. It’s also got definite peak times. If you fly out of there at noon, you’re laughing. Arrive or depart in the 6:30-8:30am or 4:00-7:00pm bands and it’s hell on earth though.

 

[alholmes]

City Airport is fun to fly in and out of as a passenger, but I can’t say I’m a fan of the exprience. Limited seating areas, no lounges and in my experience almost always a long queue for immigration on arrival, compared to Heathrow where there is very rarely a queue of more than 2 people ahead of me.

I’ve been a regular user of LCY since the 1990s. Can’t say I’ve ever experienced long queues at immigration, though obviously depends if you’re arriving at same time as other flights. Usually when I pass through there’s no queue at all.

 

[GRALISTAIR]

City Airport is like Euston. It’s cramped, dated, and not an ideal place to spend a long time. It’s also got definite peak times. If you fly out of there at noon, you’re laughing. Arrive or depart in the 6:30-8:30am or 4:00-7:00pm bands and it’s hell on earth though.

That is good to know for the future. Thanks.