London - Nottingham via Newark

[itfcfan]

I'm travelling from London to Nottingham tomorrow and engineering work means the direct East Midlands service from St Pancras isn't running. Journey planners are providing itineraries via Grantham (e.g. Kings Cross 10:06 - 11:15 Grantham 11:42 - 12:19).

Having checked it looks like the Grantham - Nottingham services are mainly 2 coach trains (e.g. 11:42 service last weekend - https://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/service/gb-nr:C60911/2024-09-14/detailed). Given London - Nottingham journeys are fairly popular, I think there's a good chance these trains will be very busy.

It looks like routing via Newark Northgate / Newark Castle (i.e. one stop further up the ECML) is a viable alternative (Kings Cross 10:06 - 11:29 Newark Northgate / Newark Castle 12:02 - 12:26 Nottingham). Although there is no through ticketing, splitting at Newark only adds £8 to the £79.40 London - Nottingham Super Off-Peak Return. The Newark Castle to Nottingham trains also appear to be mainly 2 coaches, but with journey planners not routing London itineraries this way I'd expect them to be less busy. The 2 coach journey leg is also shorter (~24mins vs ~37mins). It requires a walk between Newark Northgate & Newark Castle which Google Maps shows as 19 minutes, so allows 10~15mins padding.

Can anyone who knows the area better point out if I've overlooked anything? Are the Newark Castle - Nottingham trains typically busier than I'd thought?

 

[LowLevel]

I'm travelling from London to Nottingham tomorrow and engineering work means the direct East Midlands service from St Pancras isn't running. Journey planners are providing itineraries via Grantham (e.g. Kings Cross 10:06 - 11:15 Grantham 11:42 - 12:19).

Having checked it looks like the Grantham - Nottingham services are mainly 2 coach trains (e.g. 11:42 service last weekend - https://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/service/gb-nr:C60911/2024-09-14/detailed). Given London - Nottingham journeys are fairly popular, I think there's a good chance these trains will be very busy.

It looks like routing via Newark Northgate / Newark Castle (i.e. one stop further up the ECML) is a viable alternative (Kings Cross 10:06 - 11:29 Newark Northgate / Newark Castle 12:02 - 12:26 Nottingham). Although there is no through ticketing, splitting at Newark only adds £8 to the £79.40 London - Nottingham Super Off-Peak Return. The Newark Castle to Nottingham trains also appear to be mainly 2 coaches, but with journey planners not routing London itineraries this way I'd expect them to be less busy. The 2 coach journey leg is also shorter (~24mins vs ~37mins). It requires a walk between Newark Northgate & Newark Castle which Google Maps shows as 19 minutes, so allows 10~15mins padding.

Can anyone who knows the area better point out if I've overlooked anything? Are the Newark Castle - Nottingham trains typically busier than I'd thought?

The Newark - Nottingham trains at that time of day are invariably heaving with drinkers heading out anyway, there's a Notts County home match too. Expect it to be busy/full/leaving people behind whichever route you take.

If you get the xx37ish or xx47ish trains that start at Newark they'd be your best bet, the through trains from Lincoln around the hour will be full.

 

[tram21]

It requires a walk between Newark Northgate & Newark Castle which Google Maps shows as 19 minutes, so allows 10~15mins padding.

The walk is longer than it looks (but not more than google maps's time!) If you're insisting on a quieter train, then Newark may potentially be better, but it will take longer.

Have you looked at coaches? They're journey time is somewhat comparable to the via Grantham/Newark journey time, and you're guaranteed a seat with no hassle with changing etc. I've used it in the past and been very impressed. It's best to get the coach from Underground stations north of London, to avoid the very slow (but nice!) journey through the centre of the city. Having a look, you can get a National Express Coach from Golders Green Station at 09.10, non-stop to Nottingham arr 11.45 (£24) , or from Finchley Road station at 10.00 arriving at Nottingham Broadmarsh (it also stops at NTU Clifton if that's helpful!) 12.50 (£24). Flixbuses are avaliable at 09.35 from Finchley Road, arriving at Broadmarsh at 12.15 (also stopping at University of Nottingham near QMC) for £24.

 

[eastdyke]

As an alternative, you could try Kings Cross - Nottingham but changing at Peterborough.

The usual Norwich - Liverpool services are starting from Peterborough tomorrow so you should be guaranteed a choice of seats before 'diverted' customers join at Grantham. The service you mentioned from Grantham in your original post is ex Skegness and is likely to be busy anyway!

 

[itfcfan]

Thank you everyone for the advice. It's good to know the Newark - Nottingham trains get busy too. I hadn't thought about coaches either.

Note for anyone looking to travel from London to Nottingham and wanting flexibility to travel via either Grantham or Newark, a London to Lowdham Super Off-Peak Return allows travel (as far as Lowdham) via Grantham+Nottingham or via Newark. That combined with a Newark to Nottingham return (all the way from Newark because the faster trains don't call at Lowdham) allows travel via either route. The previous split I'd planned (London - Newark & Newark - Nottingham) would have only allowed travel via Newark, so I'd miss out of flexibility when choosing which route to return on.

 

[LowLevel]

As it happens I've been pleasantly surprised how many Regional trains through Grantham EMR have strengthened today - there are some two cars but mostly 3, 4, 5 and even 6 car trains on both Nottingham - Skegness and Liverpool - Peterborough.

 

[duffield]

The walk is longer than it looks (but not more than google maps's time!) If you're insisting on a quieter train, then Newark may potentially be better, but it will take longer.

...

I timed it at 12 minutes platform to platform last time, that's a fairly brisk pace but not running, probably about 3.5mph, so 15 minutes between trains is adequate, 20 minutes comfortable (for me, anyhow).

The back street route via Alliance Street, Lovers Lane, King's Road and Slaughterhouse Lane is just as quick and much more pleasant than the main road route via North Gate.

 

[ChrisC]

I timed it at 12 minutes platform to platform last time, that's a fairly brisk pace but not running, probably about 3.5mph, so 15 minutes between trains is adequate, 20 minutes comfortable (for me, anyhow).

The back street route via Alliance Street, Lovers Lane, King's Road and Slaughterhouse Lane is just as quick and much more pleasant than the main road route via North Gate.

If you know the way, the riverside path behind Waitrose and over the footbridge can be a slightly quicker route. There is a way to access this from Waitrose car park but it is easy to miss if you are not familiar with the route.

 

[duffield]

If you know the way, the riverside path behind Waitrose and over the footbridge can be a slightly quicker route. There is a way to access this from Waitrose car park but it is easy to miss if you are not familiar with the route.

I hadn't thought of going that way - presumably after crossing the footbridge and continuing along the river past the back of Currys, you leave the river by coming up Trent Lane, next to Homebase?

Anyhow, I'll try that route next time, although I mostly manage to connect for Nottingham at Grantham.

 

[ChrisC]

I hadn't thought of going that way - presumably after crossing the footbridge and continuing along the river past the back of Currys, you leave the river by coming up Trent Lane, next to Homebase?

Anyhow, I'll try that route next time, although I mostly manage to connect for Nottingham at Grantham.

The official footpath as shown on the OS map does indeed come up Trent Lane next to Homebase. However, just like there is a way of shortening the route by cutting through Waitrose car park at the station end, there are also a number of cut throughs between the footbridge and North Gate which also slightly shorten the route without using Trent Lane. I’ve never actually changed trains at Newark but did use the riverside route a couple of times to walk from Newark Castle Station when I had my car serviced just over the North Gate Bridge.