Lost season tickets

[elycommuter]

Once again, I have lost my annual season ticket. I am really annoyed with myself: I've spent hours looking for it, and it's wrecked my week. Probably it slipped out of my pocket on a train, possibly down the side of the seat - however, I travelled on the services of four different train companies during the 36-hour period when I could have lost it, so my ticket could now be almost anywhere in England or Scotland.

This wouldn't be so bad if season tickets were replaceable without restriction; but unfortunately, only one replacement is allowed per year. Last year I lost my ticket with 3 months to run, and spent those 3 months terrified that I would lose it again. This time I have 6 months to run on my ticket, so I'll be carrying an extremely expensive and irreplaceable piece of card in my pocket for the remainder of the year. Most people wouldn't be happy carrying a fat pile of £50 notes everywhere they went for months, but somehow we're expected to do this with season tickets. I can get insurance against loss/theft of my mobile phone, but seemingly not for my season ticket, which is worth many times more than my phone. It seems very wrong to me that I should need to worry about losing the right to rail travel that I have paid for, since the four-figure price is not actually the cost of the physical piece of card that I have lost.

Rail company websites have a list of silly tips for protecting season tickets, such as "Do not cut or tear your ticket." (yeah, I'm sure that's a common problem, accidentally attacking a your season ticket with the kitchen scissors). But they don't say anything sensible about avoiding loss. Season tickets, unlike passports and driving licences, need to be produced several times a day for inspection throughout their validity, often at a few seconds notice - so I can't carry it inaccessibly under my clothes. Season tickets are provided in lightweight shiny plastic wallets, which slip very easily out of pockets, especially if I'm not wearing a jacket with inside pockets. A season ticket also needs to be shown together with a photocard, hence the special wallet. Some season tickets cost enormous sums of money: up to £35,872.00 for a 1st Class annual season from Berwick-upon-Tweed to London Zones 1-6. You can buy a home in some parts of the country for less than that. I can't believe anybody would take the risk of carrying an uninsurable piece of card with that value, subject to the rule that it can only be replaced once a year (or twice if genuinely stolen). Or am I just paranoid?

I would be very glad to hear any advice about this - including practical ways to carry a season ticket securely yet accessibly, or any way to insure a ticket financially against loss.

 

[neilm]

Hi

I have been there, I lost one last year and had the problems of buying weeklys until it was replaced and then having to not to loose it again.

Try and get hold of a bright yellow ticket holder, yellow pages use to give them out, it means if you drop it or it falls out you will see it. Also I always carry mine in a coat pocket with a zip that an elastic section inside it so it won't fall out and I keep it zipped.

I agree that it is a difficult issue, I am hoping itso solves this like oyster, when you loose it they transfer it to a new card and cancel the old one, they even do this for free!

I think also for you maybe monthlys are better, it maybe more but less issues if you loose it.

 

[LexyBoy]

This one is definitely my favourite:

9. Strong substances can affect the ticket. Try to avoid leaving your ticket near to anything that could affect it.

Careful not to sit on a steel bench or lean on a plexiglass shelter then!

More seriously, where you you keep your wallet/purse? This is also needed frequently and at short notice, and I assume you don't lose it as regularly? Personally I would not advise keeping your ticket in your wallet, as this if you lose it you will have neither ticket nor money for your fare which could leave you open to prosecution (especially if you commute with FCC), but if you can keep it in a similar place e.g. secure pocket in a bag, zippable jacket pocket etc. that would be safe.

A brightly coloured ticket wallet is a good idea. You can also write your phone number on the back of the ticket on the off-chance that someone finds it.

 

[tsr]

I simply check I have my ticket before boarding and when I change trains, plus I do check around my seat briefly when I get up. Even if I'm tired, it doesn't take any real effort. I also carry a distinctive-looking ticket wallet and pad it out with a few old tickets to make sure my pocket feels emptier if I lose it. I agree with suggestions about using a zipped pocket or whatever, and ticket inspectors/guards really don't mind if it takes you a second or two longer to extract it. Last but not least, consider getting a bigger, more durable and brighter wallet, as others have implied above. See: http://shop.spartansafety.co.uk/hi-vis-orange-wallet-p/mc16012.htm

 

[elycommuter]

I think also for you maybe monthlys are better, it maybe more but less issues if you loose it.

You're right, monthlies are less risky. However, an annual Gold Card in the southeast has several advantages:

• The cost per year is significantly lower than 12 monthlies, equivalent to 6-7 weeks free travel.
• You get Network Railcard benefits, but without the £13 weekday minimum fare (so the Gold Card is worth more than a £28 Network Railcard)
• You can get a normal Network Railcard (worth £28) for someone else for only £1.
• A Gold Card can be loaded onto an PAYG Oyster Card for discounted Tube travel, whereas a Network Railcard cannot.

Putting all those advantages together, I'd be losing £250-£300 per year by getting monthlies. This would be equivalent to losing my Gold Card for the last 2-3 of months of every year.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

More seriously, where you you keep your wallet/purse?

I've never lost my main wallet, but I've lost my ticket wallet twice in the past 12 months. I think the difference is that that normal wallets are bigger and heavier, so they don't slip out of pockets so easily. (Carrying a ticket wallet in the same pocket as a big wallet seems particularly dangerous, as the ticket wallet can be dragged out when I pull out the big wallet, whereas the reverse is unlikely to happen.)

One possibility I'm considering is to punch a hole in both my ticket wallet and my main wallet, and tie them together with a short length of cord.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

Last but not least, consider getting a bigger, more durable and brighter wallet, as others have implied above. See: http://shop.spartansafety.co.uk/hi-vis-orange-wallet-p/mc16012.htm

Thanks for that.

I still maintain that we have a bizarre and unsatisfactory system, though, with documents costing over £10k being issued on paper with no proper protection scheme. I imagine there are plenty of Peterborough-London commuters, for example, where the First Class annual fare on East Coast is £12,704.

 

[tsr]

Thanks for that.

Not a problem - enjoy - nice and subtle it is! I've seen them around, I think, and they do stand out, IIRC!

My real point in posting that is that there are such products around, so you may be able to find a similar item which offers a trade-off between visibility and taste.

 

[tony_mac]

you could also try an alarm attached to your ticket wallet.

http://dx.com/p/129529
No, it's not an ideal situation, but better alternatives are not about to suddenly appear.

 

[IanD]

One possibility I'm considering is to punch a hole in both my ticket wallet and my main wallet, and tie them together with a short length of cord.

Use a very long cord, possibly elastic. Put your wallet in your left hand pocket then thread the elastic up one sleeve of your coat and down the other and put your season ticket in the other pocket.

 

[table38]

Maybe some sort of wallet with a chain from Amazon?

 

[maniacmartin]

Having lost an annual season ticket myself I can understand how easy it can be (although I'm 90% sure mine is somewhere in my flat).

I now keep my season ticket in the National Rail wallet, and keep that wallet inside my main wallet. It's a bit cumbersome when you want to get out a credit card, but it means every time I use my wallet I'm checking that the ticket is still there. I also never put the season ticket or NR wallet down on any surface that's not in my wallet. The wallet lives in a specific pocket in my trousers and it lives in a specific place at home. You could try a similar strategy.

 

[Sleepy]

:roll: Most people on my route leave it out on tables for guard to inspect (even if asleep !). Surprisingly never heard of one being stolen.

 

[westv]

Maybe I was lucky but, when I had an annual ticket, I never lost it once in 30 years of travelling.

 

[mralexn]

Have you considered just getting some form of ticket wallet?

after all, what about ALL railcard holders for example.. they have to have their railcard for at least 1 year, yes they are replaceable for a admin fee the first time I believe but still, it's your responsibility to look after your possessions and it's not as if you don't know the terms and conditions before you buy your season ticket.

In my view though they should just have a flat "Replacement fee" of £20 for each time you loose it, as long as you have proof of purchase etc.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

Having lost an annual season ticket myself I can understand how easy it can be (although I'm 90% sure mine is somewhere in my flat).

I now keep my season ticket in the National Rail wallet, and keep that wallet inside my main wallet. It's a bit cumbersome when you want to get out a credit card, but it means every time I use my wallet I'm checking that the ticket is still there. I also never put the season ticket or NR wallet down on any surface that's not in my wallet. The wallet lives in a specific pocket in my trousers and it lives in a specific place at home. You could try a similar strategy.

I like what you did there! (:

 

[rebmcr]

Get into the habit of 'patting yourself down' whenever you think to throughout the day, with a mental checklist: "keys, money, phone, tickets" etc.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

they have to have their railcard for at least 1 year, yes they are replaceable for a admin fee the first time I believe

I've actually had my last two replaced for free halfway through their validities — the thermal print had pretty much faded away both times, and I surrendered them at the counter.

The first time, a guard ended up using a lighter on the back to heat up the area around the date — which caused it to reappear in the new black area as an absence of said blackness.

 

[al78]

How about something like this:

http://www.everythingid.co.uk/id-card-holders-lanyards--accessories-1-c.asp

Get an ID card holder plus a neck lanyard then wear it around your neck, won't wander off and is easily accessible.

 

[dlj83]

I lost my Southeastern ticket from Medway to London around June/July 2012 and was told that in order to get a replacement ticket I'd have to buy a new Kent to Zone 1-6.


So for the past year I've had two tickets but at least I get a refund on one when the duplicate runs out.

 

[s2345]

I'd be surprised if this problem is not more or less solved in 10 years time (it shouldn't take anything near that length of time but I bet it does...) by all season tickets moving to smart cards. Lose it and it can be instantly cancelled and re-issued - infinite times. I suspect the worry for TOC's is that the lost season is, without some very careful checking, a ticket that wouldn't cause anyone looking at tickets a second glance on a busy commuter train. I'm sure you could find someone who would take the risk of a 2nd hand season for a 75% discount on the price!

 

[ModernRailways]

How about something like this:

http://www.everythingid.co.uk/id-card-holders-lanyards--accessories-1-c.asp

Get an ID card holder plus a neck lanyard then wear it around your neck, won't wander off and is easily accessible.

Not such a bad idea for a paper ticket, but I wouldn't recommend one for a smart card (just for future proofing the topic ). The only reason I say this is because I used to put my Oyster card in one, and somehow it was getting used when I wasn't even near London. I contacted Oyster helpline and they stopped the card and investigated. Turns out someone had a receiver for the chip inside the card and managed to get them and use them for themselves. I now have a wallet that has an RFID blocker inside for when I'm not using my Oyster and I always put it in my pocket so it goes behind the wallet so it would be blocked. I now tend to buy paper tickets though as they are easier, especially at odd stations like Wimbledon.

I personally would recommend a better wallet with a bit grip, the ones TfL give out seem to be pretty good for Oyster. Alternatively as already suggested pad out the wallet to give it some weight so you would have a weird feeling if it did fall out. It could also be the trousers/jeans/shorts you wear, the pockets may not be very deep which can mean something will slide it, I had this problem and managed to lose £20 because of it. Then there is always something I do, check your seating area before you leave the train and always check my pockets too to make sure I have everything. I do it when I get on the train and then when I get off, it helps narrow down where it could be if you have lost it. Mind you, I don't know what I would do if I had lost something, but I would rather have a quick look around the train and my seating area than have gotten to the gateline, and be all confused.

 

[elycommuter]

after all, what about ALL railcard holders for example.. they have to have their railcard for at least 1 year, yes they are replaceable for a admin fee the first time I believe but still, it's your responsibility to look after your possessions and it's not as if you don't know the terms and conditions before you buy your season ticket.

Yes - the difference is that season tickets tend to cost about 100 times more than railcards. Most people are happy to carry £20 cash in their wallet, but less happy to carry £2000. That's why we have bank accounts, so that we can carry a replaceable debit card instead of an irreplaceable wallet full of cash. If course I knew about the terms and conditions - i.e. the risk - and I knew that I have a habit of losing things. That's why I would LIKE to be able to insure my ticket, just like I can insure my (much cheaper) phone. But I can't, so I have to take the risk, or pay a lot of extra money buying monthly tickets instead. Looking after my possessions, ideally, would mean insuring them and/or leaving them at home whenever possible. Everyone makes occasional mistakes, especially when rushed/stressed trying to get to work on a late train, and I know that I (for one) do not always behave carefully or rationally in those circumstances. Nonetheless, I appreciate all the helpful practical advice in this thread.

In my view though they should just have a flat "Replacement fee" of £20 for each time you loose it, as long as you have proof of purchase etc.

That would be great if all season tickets were issued on smartcards, as they are in London, as the lost ticket could be cancelled to prevent fraud. It is the lack of a nationwide smartcard system that forces us to carry these dangerously valuable items in our ticket wallets. A lost season ticket can be used far too easily by the person who finds it (or a person who is sold it by the true owner who then claims to have "lost" it). Ticket inspectors very rarely seem to look closely enough to verify that the photocard number matches the ticket, and sometimes they don't exactly match anyway - mine has extra digits on the ticket which aren't on the photocard. I feel that I as a passenger am made to guard my physical ticket with a paranoid level of security, because the paper ticketing system doesn't provide a reasonable level of security to protect my "right" to the rail travel that I have paid for.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

it's your responsibility to look after your possessions

NB, sorry to be pedantic, but tickets are the property of the Train Companies that issued them, and I would prefer not to be entrusted with a four-figure sum of Greater Anglia's property every day, given the choice.

(This raises another unrelated issue, with all the millions of employees who are asked to keep tickets as evidence of their business travel expenses. The usual advice is to "ask the barrier operator to let you through", so the barriers don't swallow the evidence of your journey - but if the ticket is already the property of the company employing the barrier operator, then the passenger has absolutely no right to retain the ticket. Receipts are available instead, but they don't normally provide details of the journey, e.g. proof that you travelled in Standard rather than First)

 

[bb21]

Smartcards are already starting to be introduced in various areas especially for season ticket holders. Nationwide availability is the government's objective and this will happen in the near future. You just need to be patient. It takes time for new systems to be developed, tested and implemented.

Before this happens, as with everything else in life, you need to weigh up the pros and cons of the different options available to you and make a choice that is most suitable for you. If you are naturally careless and aware of this issue, then an annual season issued on a piece of card may not be a suitable option for you. You might lose out on some of the benefits by purchasing odd-period monthly season tickets, but none of us can always enjoy maximum benefit offered by any system, depending on our own circumstances.

While I can appreciate how frustrating it must be when you are faced with a choice of either forfeiting your entitlement to some of the financial benefits or being constantly worried that you might lose your season ticket somewhere down the line, there is nothing massively wrong with the existing system. Smartcards will bring with them their own set of benefits, but will also remove some benefits associated with paper tickets and introduce certain problems. There is no single system that would make everyone happy. You might benefit from a new system, however there will at the same time be losers too.

 

[Greenback]

It's all a question of balance. Lost tickets can be replaced twice in a twelve month period, which allows passengers an element of free insurance whilst limiting the railway to the exposure of fraud.

As bb21 has said, I'm sure that when smartcards do get introduced across the country, it will lead to a whole new set of problems and difficulties, as well as benefits.

Maybe I am just an old fashioned traditionalist, but I am perfectly happy with the way things are!

 

[Mr Spock]

NB, sorry to be pedantic, but tickets are the property of the Train Companies that issued them, and I would prefer not to be entrusted with a four-figure sum of Greater Anglia's property every day, given the choice.
)

You do have a choice and if you do not wish to be entrusted with a four-figure sum ticket then don't buy one.

 

[elycommuter]

You do have a choice and if you do not wish to be entrusted with a four-figure sum ticket then don't buy one.

Realistically my alternative choice is to give up commuting altogether, and get a different job (and different career) closer to home, since I'm not in a position to afford more expensive tickets, nor the risk of paying twice due to losing annual season tickets. I rather wish that the national rail system would offer a better choice, but it doesn't.

I posted this thread mostly to see what other people thought about the matter, and it appears that that majority think I just need to grow up and take better care of my tickets, or stop buying them - so I'll shut up.

 

[Greenback]

I posted this thread mostly to see what other people thought about the matter, and it appears that that majority think I just need to grow up and take better care of my tickets, or stop buying them - so I'll shut up.

I'm not sure that's what people are saying exactly. In my case, I just can't think of an alternative that would work as well for me and at the same time provide a measure of security for the operators.

I feel pretty pleased that, shoul I lose my annual season ticket in some way, the TOC will replace it for free on the first occasion. That said, I realise it is worth a bit of money so I do take precautions to keep it in a safe place, in a ticket wallet, and not shoved haphazardly in between random bits of paper in my bag where it may get accidentally thrown away (that's a bit of an extreme example, but that is what some customers told me had happened when I worked in the ticket office!).

As has been said, it seems as if smartcards will be offered as an option everywhere in the future, but until then I am at a loss to think how the system could be improved.

 

[zoneking]

My answer is velcro. You can get velcro from most pound stores and sew it to the pockets of your jackets or coats, or anything else, so that a ticket cannot fall out.

 

[elycommuter]

As has been said, it seems as if smartcards will be offered as an option everywhere in the future, but until then I am at a loss to think how the system could be improved.

Sorry to restart the thread after I promised to shut up... but I think there's an easier interim solution for the ToCs without any need for smartcards. Why not offer 12 consecutive monthly tickets for the price of an annual (with Gold Card privileges), so I can leave 11 of the tickets safely at home? Or even 52 weeklies for the price of an annual? It wouldn't cost very much for them to print 52 separate tickets, compared to the actual four-figure fare value. This would vastly diminish the face value of the ticket I have to carry in my pocket. The only necessary change is that the tickets would need to display a clear start date, as well as the end date - but that shouldn't be hard to implement. Tesco sends me batches of Clubcard vouchers valid for specific seven-day periods every few months, so why can't train companies do it with their season tickets?

 

[ModernRailways]

Sorry to restart the thread after I promised to shut up... but I think there's an easier interim solution for the ToCs without any need for smartcards. Why not offer 12 consecutive monthly tickets for the price of an annual (with Gold Card privileges), so I can leave 11 of the tickets safely at home? Or even 52 weeklies for the price of an annual? It wouldn't cost very much for them to print 52 separate tickets, compared to the actual four-figure fare value. This would vastly diminish the face value of the ticket I have to carry in my pocket. The only necessary change is that the tickets would need to display a clear start date, as well as the end date - but that shouldn't be hard to implement. Tesco sends me batches of Clubcard vouchers valid for specific seven-day periods every few months, so why can't train companies do it with their season tickets?

Surely, it's easier to misplace 11 (or 52) tickets than it is to misplace 1 ticket that would be in your wallet?I think I'd be more likely to misplace 11 (or 52) tickets than I would 1 ticket, for the reason I've mentioned, one would stay in my wallet, whereas having 11 (or 52) would mean having to store them somewhere safe. I collect train tickets, and have a huge pile of NR/Metro/LUL but they are in an elastic band on my bookshelf. Whenever I collect tickets in advance I always put them with my railcard so that I know where they are as my railcard and Metro pass both stay on my desk next to me.

 

[cuccir]

I've never lost my main wallet, but I've lost my ticket wallet twice in the past 12 months. I think the difference is that that normal wallets are bigger and heavier, so they don't slip out of pockets so easily.

Isn't your answer in this quote? As in, keep it in your main wallet?

My 16-25 Railcard in its little plastic ticket holder lives in my wallet and has never been lost (as it now has only three weeks to go and I can't get another one, I can say this without tempting fate too much ). It's a little bit of a hassle having to access it, but only a slight one, and it's much better than losing your ticket...

 

[Flamingo]

Sorry to restart the thread after I promised to shut up... but I think there's an easier interim solution for the ToCs without any need for smartcards. Why not offer 12 consecutive monthly tickets for the price of an annual (with Gold Card privileges), so I can leave 11 of the tickets safely at home?

There might be some merit in this suggestion, especially given the tendency of paper tickets to fade and wear out.

Anybody see any down-sides?

 

[island]

There might be some merit in this suggestion, especially given the tendency of paper tickets to fade and wear out.

Anybody see any down-sides?

People forgetting to bring the new ticket at the changeover date is the main one.