Merseyside to Shrewsbury

[A S Leib]

What's the cheapest option for an off-peak ticket for Newton-le-Willows to Shrewsbury then to Liverpool Lime Street on the same day? The off-peak return from Lea Green to Shrewsbury (£26.95 with a railcard) is shown as valid via Newton-le-Willows and Liverpool Lime Street on the TfW Rail website; is there a cheaper option?

Thank you.

 

[Mcr Warrior]

Off Peak Day Return Newton le Willows to Chester via Liverpool is £5.90 (without railcard) (or £3.85 with railcard discount). Chester to Shrewsbury is £12.70 (or £8.35 with railcard discount). Total £18.60. (£12.20).

Obviously you'll have to travel via Liverpool out and back.

 

[A S Leib]

Thank you. Is the Chester to Shrewsbury fare valid via Crewe?

Going via Liverpool instead of Warrington for the outbound journey means changing my plans slightly, but only uses up seven minutes of a 40 minute connection at Chester against going via Warrington so should be fine; with the benefit of hindsight, I'd have gone for Liverpool instead of Newton-le-Willows with the TPE £1 deal, but overall still good.

 

[Merseysider]

The advice by @Mcr Warrior is the cheapest option. If you ever find yourself needing to make a one-way trip, you can get Advance tickets for £7-£8 providing you use Transport for Wales services the whole way, via Chester (see screenshot - any decent booking site like the forum’s will let you choose this).

Yes, Chester to Shrewsbury tickets are valid to change at Crewe. This is sometimes the fastest route when there’s a gap in service or cancellations etc.

 

[A S Leib]

Thank you.

 

[Mcr Warrior]

Is the Chester to Shrewsbury fare valid via Crewe?

Travel via Wrexham General seems to be what's normally offered, but yes, travel via Crewe is also allowed.

 

[Watershed]

Worth noting that you don't actually need to travel all the way into Liverpool city centre on the "via Liverpool" fare, as silly as that might sound.

That's because for this ticket, you have to conduct the "split route check" to determine the permitted routes - as there are normally no permitted routes between Newton-le-Willows and Chester that pass through Liverpool.

The "split route check" means you determine permitted end-to-end routes by combining the permitted routes from the origin to the "via" point, and then from the "via" point to the destination.

One of the permitted routes from Newton-le-Willows to Liverpool is via Warrington Bank Quay, walk to Warrington Central and then via Liverpool South Parkway. Equally, one of the permitted routes from Liverpool to Chester is via Runcorn. These two routes intersect at Liverpool South Parkway and since the ticket permits break of journey, the double-back to Lime Street is entirely optional.

Unfortunately the "split route check" still doesn't allow travel via the direct route between Warrington Bank Quay and Frodsham, but it may still save some time depending on how the connections work out. As a minimum, it gives you more flexibility than you might think.

 

[Mcr Warrior]

@Watershed. Noted your comments / observations. It does seem somewhat bizarre that a (walk up) "route via Liverpool" ticket from Newton-le-Willows to Chester would ever be valid for some itinerary which doesn't actually involve travelling via Liverpool. Thank you for the explanation as to why this would be possible.

If the OP still wishes to travel outward via Warrington (BQ), might a one-way change of route excess from "route via Liverpool" to "route via Warrington" be the easiest way to achieve this? If so, reckon it would possibly cost an additional £2.50 (£1.65 with Railcard discount) for an Off Peak Day Return.

 

[Watershed]

@Watershed. Noted your comments / observations. It does seem somewhat bizarre that a (walk up) "route via Liverpool" ticket from Newton-le-Willows to Chester would ever be valid for some itinerary which doesn't actually involve travelling via Liverpool. Thank you for the explanation as to why this would be possible.

Yes, I'll be the first to admit it's less than obvious - but it makes more sense when you break it down. There aren't any permitted routes that follow the specified routing so you have to work out how to travel to & from the via point.

This reminds me of the case we saw in 2017 where a passenger held a Manchester to Andover ticket routed "via London" and was prosecuted for allegedly "being off route" due to using a XC service from Manchester to Basingstoke via Reading.

For a variety of reasons that prosecution was fundamentally flawed (and was ultimately withdrawn) but most notably, the "via London" fare was in fact valid for avoiding London - as it was valid from Manchester to London via Birmingham and Reading, and from London to Andover via Reading and Basingstoke. As the ticket was a flexible walk-up, the passenger was under no compulsion to undertake the unnecessary double-back between Reading and London.

This is somewhat similar to the example following which ATOC infamously stated "the routes "London" and "not London" are not necessarily mutually exclusive", in the early years of the Routeing Guide.

If the OP still wishes to travel outward via Warrington (BQ), might a one-way change of route excess from "route via Liverpool" to "route via Warrington" be the easiest way to achieve this? If so, reckon it would possibly cost an additional £2.50 (£1.65 with Railcard discount) for an Off Peak Day Return.

Yes, agreed - that would likely be the cheapest way. This excess could of course be obtained at any ticket office, or onboard the train without penalty

 

[yorkie]

@Watershed. Noted your comments / observations. It does seem somewhat bizarre that a (walk up) "route via Liverpool" ticket from Newton-le-Willows to Chester would ever be valid for some itinerary which doesn't actually involve travelling via Liverpool...

You would not be issued with such an itinerary; you can get an itinerary which involves doubling back, but you can choose not to double-back.

It's similar to fares from London to Hope Valley stations routed "via Manchester"; it is permitted to avoid the double-back between Stockport and Manchester (if both trains call at Stockport) however you won't ever get an itinerary changing at Stockport. If both trains do call at Stockport, then you would be instructed to go via Manchester and double-back, but failing to double-back doesn't invalidate the ticket.

London Euston to Edale via Stockport?

I'm intending to travel to Edale next Friday evening (23rd June). I'd like to use an off-peak return - costing £82.40, restriction code 9I. This means I'll be restricted to departing Euston after 18:44, so I'll arrive in Manchester after 21:00 (missing the 20:45 Piccadilly to Edale service). The...

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[sansyy]

I would suggest for future travel that you obtain a Merseyrail Saveaway for £6 as it includes Newton-le-Willows travel to Liverpool and then Liverpool to Chester via Merseyrail or you can go to Heswall via the borderlands line and continue with a separate ticket from Heswall to Shrewsbury via Wrexham General which iirc is cheaper than via Chester (don’t quote me on this!) and also gives you a chance to ride a class 230 if you’re the luckiest human alive