Milton Keynes to London Euston/Watford Junction

[BostonGeorge]

Hello,

A friend of mine lives in Milton Keynes and has to attend a funeral in Watford. Her family of four will be travelling down for the day, spending a night in a hotel, and heading back the following day. It's £21.40 for an adult to travel from Milton Keynes to Watford Junction, as there are no advance tickets, but it's £6.50 for an adult to travel from Milton Keynes to London Euston where there are advance tickets. Would the member of staff on the barrier give them any grief for getting out at Watford Junction?

 

[JonathanH]

Would the member of staff on the barrier give them any grief for getting out at Watford Junction?

Yes. Stopping short at Watford Junction on an advance ticket to another destination is not permitted.

If a cheaper journey is needed, one option may be to travel to Euston on the advance ticket, then use Oyster or Contactless to make a single journey back to Watford Junction.

 

[jfollows]

Yes, quite possibly.

 

[BostonGeorge]

If a cheaper journey is needed, one option may be to travel to Euston on the advance ticket, then use Oyster or Contactless to make a single journey back to Watford Junction.

I love how you've written this like it's normal behaviour. This country is doomed.

 

[talldave]

Buy an additional Kings Langley to Watford Junction single and use that to exit at Watford Junction?

 

[JonathanH]

Buy an additional Kings Langley to Watford Junction single and use that to exit at Watford Junction?

If purchased as an e-ticket and not scanned at Kings Langley, that could also be picked up as fare evasion.

I think a further off-peak option for the original poster, which doesn't need a detour via London Euston, since the changes in fares from Bletchley, is to buy separate singles from Milton Keynes to Bletchley for £4.60 and Bletchley to Watford Junction for £9.90. The train will need to stop at Bletchley.

 

[BostonGeorge]

If purchased as an e-ticket and not scanned at Kings Langley, that could also be picked up as fare evasion.

I think a further off-peak option for the original poster, which doesn't need a detour via London Euston, since the changes in fares from Bletchley, is to buy separate singles from Milton Keynes to Bletchley for £4.60 and Bletchley to Watford Junction for £9.90. The train will need to stop at Bletchley.

How on earth can it be over £10 more per ticket to travel from Milton Keynes to Watford Junction than Bletchley to Watford Junction?

 

[JonathanH]

How on earth can it be over £10 more per ticket to travel from Milton Keynes to Watford Junction than Bletchley to Watford Junction?

The fares from Bletchley to Watford Junction have, since 3 December, been set on a single leg pricing basis in preparation for the extension of Contactless PAYG to Bletchley at some point in 2024. The fares from Milton Keynes remain on the old fare basis.

A boundary between the two fare structures has to apply somewhere. Return fares are more consistent.

 

[talldave]

If purchased as an e-ticket and not scanned at Kings Langley, that could also be picked up as fare evasion.

True, I failed to point out the need to use a physical tcket for my solution. Paper/card tickets are always the best option for "buying a ticket to somewhere you're not going" adventures. It's a small price to pay (literally!) for the savings to be had.

 

[greatkingrat]

Don't forget you can use Groupsave (on LNWR trains) if there are four of you travelling which gives a third off.

 

[Egg Centric]

Buy an additional Kings Langley to Watford Junction single and use that to exit at Watford Junction?

Well if we were going to suggest things like that, note that if the friends took the overground onwards to Bushey (which is Watford for most purposes) there are no ticket barriers there (or between the overground platforms at WFJ and the mainline ones) and fwiw the contactless fare between the two is £1.90 off peak.

Of course, this would be fare evasion of the most heinous kind, inexcusable even during a funeral.

 

[talldave]

Well if we were going to suggest things like that....

"Things like" what, exactly?

 

[sk688]

Super Off Peak Milton Keynes-London tickets tend to be cheaper than MK-Watford tickets, and you can break your journey on them to exit at Watford.

 

[Kite159]

If purchased as an e-ticket and not scanned at Kings Langley, that could also be picked up as fare evasion.

I think a further off-peak option for the original poster, which doesn't need a detour via London Euston, since the changes in fares from Bletchley, is to buy separate singles from Milton Keynes to Bletchley for £4.60 and Bletchley to Watford Junction for £9.90. The train will need to stop at Bletchley.

Pretty sure there are no barriers at Kings Langley so not having an entry scan won't ring any sort of alarm bells.

 

[Egg Centric]

Now I've thought about Bushey a bit more, plenty of MK-Euston trains stop there (although I'm not sure if you can book MK<->Euston advances on the ones that do), and it really is Watford for all intents and purposes...

"Things like" what, exactly?

Travelling not in accordance with tickets

 

[JonathanH]

Pretty sure there are no barriers at Kings Langley so not having an entry scan won't ring any sort of alarm bells.

Well, so long as you get to Watford at the same time as a train from Kings Langley gets there.

Suggesting people buy tickets just to open barriers is not great advice in any circumstance, even if in this one it is harder to detect.

 

[Hadders]

Well, so long as you get to Watford at the same time as a train from Kings Langley gets there.

Suggesting people buy tickets just to open barriers is not great advice in any circumstance, even if in this one it is harder to detect.

Agreed! Maybe we would call it ‘doing a Wembley Stadium’!

Chiltern seem to be good at identifying people arriving at Marylebone using tickets from Wembley Stadium to open the barriers!

 

[Kite159]

Agreed! Maybe we would call it ‘doing a Wembley Stadium’!

Chiltern seem to be good at identifying people arriving at Marylebone using tickets from Wembley Stadium to open the barriers!

That's because the majority of genuine passengers from Wembley Stadium to Marylebone will be using oyster/contactless. Same theory with SWR RPIs picking up anybody arriving at Waterloo with a ticket (either paper or as an e-ticket) from Clapham junction/Vauxhall

 

[Hadders]

That's because the majority of genuine passengers from Wembley Stadium to Marylebone will be using oyster/contactless. Same theory with SWR RPIs picking up anybody arriving at Waterloo with a ticket (either paper or as an e-ticket) from Clapham junction/Vauxhall

We should not condone breaking the terms and conditions of tickets. Yes, it will almost certainly work but it’s a very fine line between recommending a Kings Langley ticket to exit at Watford Junction and a Wembley Stadium ticket at Marylebone.

 

[talldave]

Travelling not in accordance with tickets

Well that is the thread topic.

However, my suggestion involves having two tickets covering the journey between the final two stops on the journey. I'm not sure what that's not in accordance with, whilst allowing an unhindered exit at the final station?

 

[Gaelan]

An off-peak return to Euston, which allows return travel any time within the next month, is £36.60, less than a return to Watford Junction. Unlike the Advances, there's no restriction on getting off at Watford Junction.

Also, both LNWR and Avanti offer good prices (£16-£17) for a super off-peak return to Euston, again with a month of validity and no break of journey restrictions - but the time restrictions here are onerous (arrival after 1pm). You'd also have to constrain yourself to one operator in both directions.

 

[Egg Centric]

Well that is the thread topic.

However, my suggestion involves having two tickets covering the journey between the final two stops on the journey. I'm not sure what that's not in accordance with, whilst allowing an unhindered exit at the final station?

You cannot leave an advance early or break it, nor start short. There is internal guidance saying not to penalise if it isn't being done to gain an advantage but this clearly would be.

Whether anyone would give a stuff is another matter but don't think we should be publically advising it for same reason I'm not posting a great place near here to test the top speed of your car. Or if we were then there's bugger all difference with leaving at Bushey - I imagine this thread is only still open cause everyone's drunk this time of year. Speaking of which, cheers

 

[gray1404]

What day of the week is travel taking place on and at what times?

 

[fandroid]

Could they actually start their train journey from Bletchley and so take advantage of the much better fare? Perhaps using the LNWR Group save too?