New German Railway Timetable

NARobertson

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The Frankfurter Allegemeine reports today that DB fares will rise this month by an average of 1.8%, well under the current German inflation rate of around 5%. A new train type is being introduced on eight of the most intensively used routes, the ICE Sprinters which will have fewer stops. Three of these will travel non-stop each way every day between Cologne and Berlin, cutting about 30 minutes from the journey time ( down on ICE Sprinters to under four hours). ICE4 trains continue to come into service. These have 13 coaches with 918 seats. The new coalition government plans to double the DB's travel capacity.
 
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30907

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Ah, so they are. I had an idea that they already existed, but I must have been thinking of something else.
Sprinters have run on and off for years, as duesselmartin says, typically 1tpd.

DB seem to be making a slightly more concerted effort now, including the Frankfurt-Berlin service which stops only at Erfurt and Halle (and averages less than 130km/h over the non-high-speed section to Erfurt - but does at least run at 2-hour intervals).
 
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Sure, but the issue is pathing a non-stop service alongside the 'stopping' ICEs from Berlin to Cologne/Frankfurt-Main so as to retain the typically 1tph that the medium-sized stations currently have. Particularly on Fulda - Hanau and Hannover-Hamm. The 30 min time saving will presumably mean speeding the whole timetable up somewhat. The IC/ICE timetable is prone to major delays as it is, so it's hard to see that this is going to end well...
 

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I've lost the reference, but aren't there plans for more long-distance services as part of the aim to reduce domestic flights?
A levy on air fares was intended to fund extra services run by DB.
The new German coalition government also looks "greener" than the last, but time will tell.
 

duesselmartin

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I've lost the reference, but aren't there plans for more long-distance services as part of the aim to reduce domestic flights?
A levy on air fares was intended to fund extra services run by DB.
The new German coalition government also looks "greener" than the last, but time will tell.
The new minister for transport already emphasied the importance of investing in road transport.
I doubt the liberals will allow any levy to be introduced anywhere.
 

LSWR Cavalier

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It would be worth getting the timetables as books and listing places that have lost services. But service withdrawals are not announced with such enthusiasm!

Chemnitz (247 000 inhabitants) has no long-distance services, while Leipzig or Erfurt have maybe more trains than they really need. Between Berlin and Hamburg there seem to be ever more fast trains, stopping trains have to make room for them so many journies become less attractive.

This week the new transport minister takes office, what shall he do?
 

30907

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It would be worth getting the timetables as books and listing places that have lost services. But service withdrawals are not announced with such enthusiasm!

Chemnitz (247 000 inhabitants) has no long-distance services,
It is IIRC the one large city that has no InterCity services, and hasn't had for 20-odd years, having the misfortune to lie on secondary routes which miss the much bigger city of Leipzig. (Even Bavaria to Dresden is no longer quickest that way.) IIRC Deutschlandtakt improves the situation....
 

Senex

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Things do seem to be moving on the Chemnitz front. An invitation to tender appeared in the EU Journal — https://ted.europa.eu/udl?uri=TED:NOTICE:409590-2021:TEXT:DE:HTML&src=0 — in August seeking bids for a service between Chemnitz and Berlin, to start on 12 June 2022 and run to 9 December 2028 with the possibility of extension. There are to be at least two pairs of trains daily, and there's a string of conditions for bidders to meet, but (for instance) great freedom over the route to be used amongst other things. So one way of fulfilling the conditions might be for DB to extend its Warnemünde–Dresden IC service to Chemnitz, or another might be an extension of the present RB45 service from Chemnitz to Elsterwerda north to Berlin.
 

30907

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Things do seem to be moving on the Chemnitz front. An invitation to tender appeared in the EU Journal — https://ted.europa.eu/udl?uri=TED:NOTICE:409590-2021:TEXT:DE:HTML&src=0 — in August seeking bids for a service between Chemnitz and Berlin, to start on 12 June 2022 and run to 9 December 2028 with the possibility of extension. There are to be at least two pairs of trains daily, and there's a string of conditions for bidders to meet, but (for instance) great freedom over the route to be used amongst other things. So one way of fulfilling the conditions might be for DB to extend its Warnemünde–Dresden IC service to Chemnitz, or another might be an extension of the present RB45 service from Chemnitz to Elsterwerda north to Berlin.
The direct route via Mittweida-Döbeln-Riesa-Elsterwerda with a fast train (not the RB, but the equivalent of the old IR) is the only one that would be competitive with changing at Leipzig. Trouble is, none of those towns is particularly large (D and R are around 25k) so the service wouldn't generate much intermediate traffic. Going via Dresden would at least include Freiberg(Saxony) which is a bit bigger.
Either would be a start, though.
 

Fragezeichnen

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The awkward part about Chemnitz is that it's surrounded by an electrification moat, in a country where(like most of Europe) virtually all premium long distance services are Electric. What would make sense would be Hamburg - Berlin - Leipzig - Chemnitz, and Dresden - Chemnitz - Nürnberg - München; but neither is possible currently with Electric traction, and Deutsche Bahn is not going to invest in an special expensive-to-run fleet to handle this special case over the next few years.

Eagle eyed German railway fans have spotted that there are already allocated paths in the new timetable for a Chemnitz - Mittweida - Döbeln - Riesa - Berlin Airport - Berlin Ostkreuz - Lichtenberg service. However it is unclear yet if it will actually run.
 

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For five years in the 1980s the Deutsche Reichsbahn's Städteexpress "Fichtelberg" did run all-electric between the then Karl-Marx-Stadt and Berlin Lichtenberg via Dresden-Neustadt (avoiding DD Hbf), thus giving a precedent for that apparently rather indirect route.

Interesting to hear that there are paths allocated for trains over the Döbeln route — and that those paths duly meet two of the conditions in the invitation to tender, that the trains should serve Berlin Airport and that they should make at least one call at a Berlin station with good S-Bahn connections.
 

30907

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The awkward part about Chemnitz is that it's surrounded by an electrification moat, in a country where(like most of Europe) virtually all premium long distance services are Electric. What would make sense would be Hamburg - Berlin - Leipzig - Chemnitz
...which will need to wait for the planned electrification of the last section (ditto for Hof-Regensburg).

For five years in the 1980s the Deutsche Reichsbahn's Städteexpress "Fichtelberg" did run all-electric between the then Karl-Marx-Stadt and Berlin Lichtenberg via Dresden-Neustadt (avoiding DD Hbf), thus giving a precedent for that apparently rather indirect route.
I hadn't realised that - the serious disadvantage being that you lose some of the Dresden traffic, which is considerable. Presumably the routing had in mind the various connecting branch lines (the clue being in the train name).
 

Senex

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...which will need to wait for the planned electrification of the last section (ditto for Hof-Regensburg).


I hadn't realised that - the serious disadvantage being that you lose some of the Dresden traffic, which is considerable. Presumably the routing had in mind the various connecting branch lines (the clue being in the train name).
Not too bad because you still serve Neustadt, which is one of the two major Dresden inner-city stations and with excellent links across the bridge to Hbf. Rather more like the Edinburgh Waverley and Haymarket situation than the Cologne Hbf and Deutz one.
 

30907

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Not too bad because you still serve Neustadt, which is one of the two major Dresden inner-city stations and with excellent links across the bridge to Hbf. Rather more like the Edinburgh Waverley and Haymarket situation than the Cologne Hbf and Deutz one.
You have a point (I like the Neustadt area!). It's reasonably well served by trams too, so a bit of good PR might swing it - reopening the direct route into Berlin and finishing the route upgrade for example. However, Riesa seems to be the preferred route...

Incidentally, I wonder if there would be mileage in running the Berlin service through to Zwickau Hbf?
 

Senex

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The direct route into Berlin is supposed to re-open in December 2025 — work is really pressing on now. Of course, as far as Chemnitz trains were concerned, it would benefit any routed either via Dresden or via Elsterwerda and Riesa (though not, of course, if someone had the idea of getting to Riesa via Jüterbog and Röderau!).
 

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(though not, of course, if someone had the idea of getting to Riesa via Jüterbog and Röderau!).
Funnily enough, I had glanced at the map (it being the standard diversionary route when Berlin-Dresden is blocked).... :)
But once the old Dresdner Bahn reopens it makes no sense.
 

dutchflyer

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As I write this, the german news of this evening is on and they just had a short item about todayś new timetable-and pricehike-on DB.
Leipzig-Chemnitz (=formerly Karl Marxstadt) will go under major renovation, electrification and partly doubling the coming period, making it all easier to achieve. However, since a week or 2, dus to very low covid-vaccination rates, this region (Land=Sachsen) is even completely closed for all touristy trips and visits. Chemnitz is also-slowly-slowly- building a Karlsruhe type mixed tram+train local system, but without todays opened new tunnel like in Karlsruhe. Having visited this area just before the closure for tourism in nov: its a bit depressing sight to see how empty the few and short trains are and how little use in general they seem to have.
 

Fragezeichnen

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So the Chemnitz-Berlin question is finally settled.
The paths for MRB from Chemnitz via Elsterwerda will not be used, instead from June DB FV will extend two morning Dresden-Rostock services(Stadler KISS) to start back from Chemnitz at 6.26 and 8.26, returning in the evening at 1930 and 2130.

Since there are no suitable overnight servicing facilities in Chemnitz every trip to/from Chemnitz will have a balancing ECS move to/from Dresden (at the expense of the Saxonian taxpayer) :rolleyes:
 

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So Chemnitz gets indirect through trains to Berlin but only in 'Tagesrandlagen' (early and late). How might the journey time compare with taking the shorter route and changing?
 

30907

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So Chemnitz gets indirect through trains to Berlin but only in 'Tagesrandlagen' (early and late). How might the journey time compare with taking the shorter route and changing?
About 5 minutes longer - good if you live in Freiberg on the way to Dresden, disappointing if you live in Riesa!
From the times, I wonder if the trains will avoid Dresden Hbf.
 

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Good point. However. the press release says "Local Transport tickets will be accepted between Chemnitz and Dresden Hbf", which would imply it doesn't.
An RE takes takes 61 minutes and the current InterCity departure time from Dresden Hbf would allow for 53 minutes including reversal, so I guess it's just about feasible.
 

30907

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Good point. However. the press release says "Local Transport tickets will be accepted between Chemnitz and Dresden Hbf", which would imply it doesn't.
An RE takes takes 61 minutes and the current InterCity departure time from Dresden Hbf would allow for 53 minutes including reversal, so I guess it's just about feasible.
Thanks, hadn't followed the full discussion.
Nice for the morning commuters, but 1840 back from Dresden is a bit late.
 

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