NHS dentists.

[Bikeman78]

mods note - split from this thread

My dentist isn't doing check ups anymore. They'll only see people with serious problems. The waiting lists are in the millions with no sign of improvement. Waiting times for an ambulance are measure in hours. We didn't save it at all.

 

[Peter Sarf]

My dentist isn't doing check ups anymore. They'll only see people with serious problems. The waiting lists are in the millions with no sign of improvement. Waiting times for an ambulance are measure in hours. We didn't save it at all.

Aye.

Took me a year to find an NHS dentist for my Granddaughter. A dentist 20 miles / 30 minutes drive away and she lives in a city !.

Getting medicines has been tricky. My partners blood pressure medicine was never a problem until November 2021. Worse came in June 2022 when I spent two days walking around Croydon and phoning elsewhere on the hunt for her medicine. Found in Sutton in different places but then had to get round the prescription at Boots being partly satisfied so had to persuade GP to give us new prescriptions. I have now stopped the automatically repeating medicine sent to Boots. Instead I manually request and get three separate paper prescriptions so now I can hand over one prescription for one medicine at whatever chemist has that particular medicine. The use-by dates went to less than 6 months ahead during 2021 but are now back to 18-24 months.

I wonder how much of this is due to Covid and how much is due to Brexit ?.

 

[Mojo]

As it is, the NHS is completely stuffed anyway. My dentist isn't doing check ups anymore. They'll only see people with serious problems. The waiting lists are in the millions with no sign of improvement. Waiting times for an ambulance are measure in hours. We didn't save it at all.

NHS dentistry is a waste of time for checkups anyway. When I had a NHS dentist they say they want to see you every 6 Months and charge you £25 for the privilege. The checkup is cursory at best. My private dentist charges £40 for a checkup and I only need to go once a year.

 

[nw1]

NHS dentistry is a waste of time for checkups anyway. When I had a NHS dentist they say they want to see you every 6 Months and charge you £25 for the privilege. The checkup is cursory at best. My private dentist charges £40 for a checkup and I only need to go once a year.

It's not just the checkup though, other forms of treatment are more expensive when done privately.

It's getting to the point where it's probably cheaper to go overseas to countries which do more affordable private dentistry. This is a particularly attractive proposition if you have contacts overseas who you can stay with, thus drastically reducing accommodation costs.

Then the absolutely ridiculous routine you have to go through to get a doctor's appointment. Whatever is wrong with booking an appointment for 3, 4 or 5 days hence - either the phone or online - rather than the ridiculous, time-wasting and often unsuccessful scramble to get appointments first thing in the morning, which is self-evidently not a "patient first" approach.

The shocking state of basic NHS services is quite unacceptable, and it's all gone wrong since Covid. I don't know exactly why it's gone so badly wrong since Covid but I'd wager a combination of Government underfunding and the after-effects of enforced closures for several months. Certainly the latter is the reason my dentist has given for withdrawal of NHS services as it seems many of the NHS dentists "jumped ship" due to being denied a guaranteed income.

Still, I suppose this is the "new normal".

 

[Peter Sarf]

NHS dentistry is a waste of time for checkups anyway. When I had a NHS dentist they say they want to see you every 6 Months and charge you £25 for the privilege. The checkup is cursory at best. My private dentist charges £40 for a checkup and I only need to go once a year.

And then at the other end of the extreme there is my granddaughter where it took over a year to get her an NHS dentist !. The oft quoted reason I got for no availability was that the government pays too little to the dentists. The reality is that just like the rest of the NHS you have expensive to look after patients some of whom have done nothing to look after their own health. People who pay for healthcare tend to look after themselves and use healthcare sparingly - dangerously sparingly. It is very easy for people to undermine the NHS by arguing over its effectiveness. A free at point of access service will always get more use.

Personally I would rather waste £25 on six monthly checkups knowing that my cleaning regime and diet are good enough to make that unlikely to find problems. Then again - when did I last go......

 

[jfollows]

Getting medicines has been tricky. My partners blood pressure medicine was never a problem until November 2021. Worse came in June 2022 when I spent two days walking around Croydon and phoning elsewhere on the hunt for her medicine. Found in Sutton in different places but then had to get round the prescription at Boots being partly satisfied so had to persuade GP to give us new prescriptions. I have now stopped the automatically repeating medicine sent to Boots. Instead I manually request and get three separate paper prescriptions so now I can hand over one prescription for one medicine at whatever chemist has that particular medicine. The use-by dates went to less than 6 months ahead during 2021 but are now back to 18-24 months.

I wonder how much of this is due to Covid and how much is due to Brexit ?.

You might not want to do it, but I used to find repeat medicine orders hugely frustrating and annoying, until I changed to (1) ordering the repeat prescriptions on-line (your GP may not implement this) and (2) fulfilling them through Pharmacy2U, dreadful name, but they come in the post a couple of days later. No waiting around in pharmacies, only to find they don't have what you want anyway. No extra cost. Only problem came with postal strikes at the end of 2022 and that's over now. Just a thought.

Off-topic for NHS dentistry I agree. I have used private dentists since before 2000. I probably didn't want to but felt compelled to then and things are only worse now.

 

[ChrisC]

I’ve been going to the same dental practice for around 50 years now, since I was in my early teens. During all those years I have only been treated by 3 dentists as they have all remained working there for many years. I have now been seeing my current dentist for over 20 years.

Last summer, I received a letter informing me that she is now only working 2 days a week, and will no longer be treating NHS patients. The letter informed me that there are no alternative dentists at the practice seeing NHS patients and if I wanted to continue NHS treatment I would have to register at a different dental practice. That is not easy to do these days!

Last November, I had a large filling come out, and I went into my dental practice with the intention of making an appointment with my usual dentist and paying to have this done privately. She has always been a good dentist, and even though I didn’t agree with the way they have treated their long term NHS patients, I preferred to continue to see the same dentist. I don’t think that I would have easily been able to find an alternative NHS dentist in the locality.

A very friendly and helpful receptionist told me that they now have another dentist who is seeing some NHS patients, who was reportedly very good, and they could give me an appointment with him at the beginning of January. I wasn‘t in any pain so didn‘t mind waiting 2 months for the appointment. Early on the morning of my appointment I received a text message informing me that unfortunately my appointment has had to be cancelled and could I give them a ring to rebook. I was given another appointment for the beginning of March. The day of the appointment the same thing happened again and when I rang to rebook the earliest appointment available this time was the beginning of June. Guess what! That day came and at 7.15am I received yet another text message cancelling my appointment. I was daft enough to book again as this time they were only asking me to wait 5 weeks! My appointment should have been this Wednesday but it has been cancelled again, although this time I was given 7 days notice.

To end a long story I am now right back to where I was last November. The next available NHS appointment is in October! I have therefore done what I originally intended to do and have made an appointment to see my usual dentist as a private patient. She‘s on holiday for the next two weeks but I was given a choice of appointment times during the first week that she is back at work. I would rather be treated under the NHS but I am not willing to wait any longer for an appointment that perhaps would never happen. I can afford to pay for private treatment, but so many people can’t.

 

[duncanp]

NHS dentistry is a waste of time for checkups anyway. When I had a NHS dentist they say they want to see you every 6 Months and charge you £25 for the privilege. The checkup is cursory at best. My private dentist charges £40 for a checkup and I only need to go once a year.

So private dentistry is cheaper then.

 

[bleeder4]

Personally, I think dental care for adults should be chargeable anyway. Children, absolutely, should have free NHS dental care, but once you reach adulthood it should become a chargeable service. I would rather the NHS focus on general healthcare and life or death emergencies, operations etc. Things like removing fillings, taking out a tooth, performing a check up etc shouldn't be NHS. I think if we are to stand any chance of retaining a free healthcare system then it needs to be pulled right back to the essentials, it's stretching itself too thin at the moment.

 

[gswindale]

Personally, I think dental care for adults should be chargeable anyway. Children, absolutely, should have free NHS dental care, but once you reach adulthood it should become a chargeable service. I would rather the NHS focus on general healthcare and life or death emergencies, operations etc. Things like removing fillings, taking out a tooth, performing a check up etc shouldn't be NHS. I think if we are to stand any chance of retaining a free healthcare system then it needs to be pulled right back to the essentials, it's stretching itself too thin at the moment.

Even on the NHS a check-up is chargeable for an adult, so I'm not sure of your point.

I would suggest that maybe treatment etc. should be free whilst you've got your milk teeth and then chargeable after that?

I'm not sure stripping dentistry (even charged) out of the NHS is a good idea if that is what you're suggesting?

 

[telstarbox]

Check ups should be free on the principle that prevention is better than cure. At the moment the band charges create a perverse incentive to spread out checkups or wait until you need more than one filling as they all come under one band 2 treatment.

So private dentistry is cheaper then.

Only if you don't need any treatment. It's more expensive for fillings etc.

 

[birchesgreen]

It's not just the checkup though, other forms of treatment are more expensive when done privately.

It's getting to the point where it's probably cheaper to go overseas to countries which do more affordable private dentistry. This is a particularly attractive proposition if you have contacts overseas who you can stay with, thus drastically reducing accommodation costs.

Yeah thats what my wife did when she needed a new denture and some other work. Mind you our niece is a dentist over there so even cheaper!

 

[matt]

I only see my NHS dentist once a year (ish)

 

[Parjon]

Personally, I think dental care for adults should be chargeable anyway. Children, absolutely, should have free NHS dental care, but once you reach adulthood it should become a chargeable service. I would rather the NHS focus on general healthcare and life or death emergencies, operations etc. Things like removing fillings, taking out a tooth, performing a check up etc shouldn't be NHS. I think if we are to stand any chance of retaining a free healthcare system then it needs to be pulled right back to the essentials, it's stretching itself too thin at the moment.

We are already double charged for this. It's just unfortunate that the way dentists are paid for NHS work isn't fit for purpose.

Dentistry isn't cosmetic or a nice to have. Not only do you need your teeth to eat, but decent teeth are linked to all sorts of positive health outcomes

Bad teeth, on the other hand, are actually a health risk and increase risk of infections and several types of cancer.

Dental health is about as basic a need as you can get.

 

[BananaRepublic]

Almost all dentists can offer you a dental care plan, from on of the main providers.
Our practice uses Denplan.
The monthly payments are not that expensive and cover 6 monthly check-ups, including additional hygienist treatment.
Most remedial and repair work is included, up to the more expensive jobs, where you only pay for the additional extra cost.

Routine appointments can be booked at reasonable notice, check-ups are usually scheduled months ahead and emergency treatment is usually done the same day, or out-of-hours.
When they can't provide emergency cover, out-of-hours, there's a weekend and evening emergency scheme, shared between a dozen or so practices in the area.

It makes sense to budget for this sort of dental cover, which is easily within reach of all but the poorest in society.
There needs to be a better scheme for those, who cannot afford it. The NHS will never cut the mustard.

Our practice stopped treating adults on the NHS, nearly 20 years ago, but has continued to enrol children on the public scheme.
Usually when parents sign their children up on the NHS, most also join Denplan, when they see the value on offer.

 

[Parjon]

It makes sense to budget for this sort of dental cover, which is easily within reach of all but the poorest in society.

That last bracket these days covers millions of people, who have to cut back on basics to get by.

In terms of the NHS not cutting the mustard for this basic healthcare essential, just how far are we supposed to go with this logic?

We are heading towards having an American style healthcare system but still with European level taxation.

 

[Crossover]

I’ve been going to the same dental practice for around 50 years now, since I was in my early teens. During all those years I have only been treated by 3 dentists as they have all remained working there for many years. I have now been seeing my current dentist for over 20 years.

Last summer, I received a letter informing me that she is now only working 2 days a week, and will no longer be treating NHS patients. The letter informed me that there are no alternative dentists at the practice seeing NHS patients and if I wanted to continue NHS treatment I would have to register at a different dental practice. That is not easy to do these days!

Last November, I had a large filling come out, and I went into my dental practice with the intention of making an appointment with my usual dentist and paying to have this done privately. She has always been a good dentist, and even though I didn’t agree with the way they have treated their long term NHS patients, I preferred to continue to see the same dentist. I don’t think that I would have easily been able to find an alternative NHS dentist in the locality.

A very friendly and helpful receptionist told me that they now have another dentist who is seeing some NHS patients, who was reportedly very good, and they could give me an appointment with him at the beginning of January. I wasn‘t in any pain so didn‘t mind waiting 2 months for the appointment. Early on the morning of my appointment I received a text message informing me that unfortunately my appointment has had to be cancelled and could I give them a ring to rebook. I was given another appointment for the beginning of March. The day of the appointment the same thing happened again and when I rang to rebook the earliest appointment available this time was the beginning of June. Guess what! That day came and at 7.15am I received yet another text message cancelling my appointment. I was daft enough to book again as this time they were only asking me to wait 5 weeks! My appointment should have been this Wednesday but it has been cancelled again, although this time I was given 7 days notice.

To end a long story I am now right back to where I was last November. The next available NHS appointment is in October! I have therefore done what I originally intended to do and have made an appointment to see my usual dentist as a private patient. She‘s on holiday for the next two weeks but I was given a choice of appointment times during the first week that she is back at work. I would rather be treated under the NHS but I am not willing to wait any longer for an appointment that perhaps would never happen. I can afford to pay for private treatment, but so many people can’t.

I'm with an NHS dentist, though in recent times have been shunted around a serioes of different dentists and rarely see the same one twice in a row!

I have just had a tooth chip and was able to get a same day appointment to be told it needs an onlay (at fairly large cost whether NHS or private) - I have chosen to go with a private option (sold on the basis of the material being better) and all of a sudden can get an appointment at 7pm in the evening for the second fitting (vice working hours only for NHS treatment)

 

[BananaRepublic]

That last bracket these days covers millions of people, who have to cut back on basics to get by.

In terms of the NHS not cutting the mustard for this basic healthcare essential, just how far are we supposed to go with this logic?

We are heading towards having an American style healthcare system but still with European level taxation.

The few millions you are talking about, still represent a minority percentage of the population.
A scheme to provide dental cover for those who can’t afford the modest insurance premiums, would be more affordable than a one size fits all approach.

As for the general point, alternatives to funding the UK‘s public healthcare, categorically do not mean an American style system.
Check out the various successful schemes in other European countries and some of those, further afield.



.

 

[westv]

My company offers us dental insurance.

I have a tooth which has needed to come out for a while but, as it has never hurt, I keep putting it off. I will go private for that. Presumably there is no difference between an NHS extraction and private one - apart from the price?