Paddington - Marylebone walking transfer times

[yorkie]

http://www.brtimes.com/#!board?stn=PAD&show=info&date=20160825

Paddington - Marylebone has a fixed link walking transfer time of 17 minutes (for the purposes of planning a valid travel itinerary, this must be added to the minimum connection time for each, which is 15 minutes and 10 minutes respectively, ie. totalling 42 minutes) which is very walkable, indeed less so than some out-of-London interchanges.

The main purpose of this appears to be to allow passengers to make interchanges at times when London Underground isn't running.

The electronic data is set to only show this walking travel in journey planners "from 0001 until 0529", as at other times any itineraries generated would show a tube transfer.

So, the question is: if you are travelling outside those times and can't, or do not want to, take the tube for the transfer (e.g. let's say you are taking a bike with you), can you choose to take the walking transfer at any time you please, and if so would allowing the minimum connection time above count as a valid itinerary for the purposes of Delay Repay, and making any last connections?

(The same principle applies for many other cross-London transfers)

 

[maniacmartin]

I was hoping that page 13 of Network Rail's National Rail Timetable Commerical Information would have more detailed information, but it only states that the 'fastest' way to cross London is normally by Underground, and is silent about other methods.

National Rail's Crossing London page has this to say:

Some London termini stations are within easy walking distance of one another and tickets showing the cross-London Ԡ' symbol are valid to make the connection between them at street level.

As the electronic data does not form part of the contract, and a normal passenger could not be expected to have easy access to it, and because the quote above does not mention times of day, I would say that it is valid to walk at any time of day. As to how close stations have to be to be 'within easy walking distance', I don't think it's defined anywhere.

As traffic in London is much worse in the peaks than the early hours of the morning, I would not be surprised if it took much longer by taxi during the day for some of these transfers than the time that is allocated in the electronic data in the early hours. As such, if your transfer was made by taxi/bus outside of the hours the electronic data suggests, and it took longer than the data suggests, I don't think you could use that as a basis for a Delay Repay claim.

 

[hairyhandedfool]

I'm not an expert on Delay Repay (yet), but in my opinion, if the only delay was caused by a passenger choosing to walk (or cycle), I don't think it could be claimed. Delay Repay is usually based on trains being delayed or cancelled I believe.

Perhaps a more concerning question would be what happens if they miss a booked train on an Advance because they chose to walk.

Ticket offices with Journey Planner can adjust the transfer times to allow longer connections so if booked at a station there may be no reason to risk missing the train.

 

[yorkie]

I'm not an expert on Delay Repay (yet), but in my opinion, if the only delay was caused by a passenger choosing to walk (or cycle), I don't think it could be claimed. Delay Repay is usually based on trains being delayed or cancelled I believe.

I should have clarified: I meant if the original train was delayed, let's say it was 25 minutes late, leaving only 7 minutes to get between terminals, which would not be feasible, resulting in the connection being missed.

Perhaps a more concerning question would be what happens if they miss a booked train on an Advance because they chose to walk.

Yes, that would be another scenario I had in mind.

I would, however, point out that in the scenario described it wouldn't be simply a case of only allowing the tube transfer time and choosing to walk, but specifically allowing the (longer) walking interchange time.

 

[hairyhandedfool]

I should have clarified: I meant if the original train was delayed, let's say it was 25 minutes late, leaving only 7 minutes to get between terminals, which would not be feasible, resulting in the connection being missed....

Ah, right sorry, misunderstood. I would say that Delay Compensation would be due if the time taken to actually cross between stations was not unreasonable. In otherwords, if it did genuinely take 30-35 minutes, or less, (train to train) then I believe it would be fine, but if it was claimed to have taken an hour it might not be so simple (especially if a suitable train departed 40 minutes after the delayed train arrived.

....Yes, that would be another scenario I had in mind.

I would, however, point out that in the scenario described it wouldn't be simply a case of only allowing the tube transfer time and choosing to walk, but specifically allowing the (longer) walking interchange time.

I think that is a tricky one, but again if it is obviously not taking the michael then I think it'd be okay. I believe this is where common sense would have to apply, but if we are talking rules and regs, I'm not convinced either way. I'd probably go with what seemed most sensible at the time.

 

[Haywain]

Paddington - Marylebone has a fixed link walking transfer time of 17 minutes (for the purposes of planning a valid travel itinerary, this must be added to the minimum connection time for each, which is 15 minutes and 10 minutes respectively, ie. totalling 32 minutes) which is very walkable, indeed less so than some out-of-London interchanges.

I'm no expert, but that looks a lot like 42 minutes to me!

 

[Doctor Fegg]

So, the question is: if you are travelling outside those times and can't, or do not want to, take the tube for the transfer (e.g. let's say you are taking a bike with you), can you choose to take the walking transfer at any time you please

I realise this isn't quite the question you were asking and it only fulfils this one example: but if you have a bike with you, you'll easily beat the tube between Paddington and Marylebone. So any Delay-Repay claim should be as valid as it would have been if you took the slower tube.

 

[maniacmartin]

Yorkie could have chosen Paddington to Fenchurch St though. Including connection time, 70 minutes is allowed, of which 48 is for the transfer itself. Although unlikely, its not inconceivable that some cyclists couldn't manage 5.7 miles across central London with all the traffic lights and whatnot in that time. You'd need to average over 7mph