Platform Changes Yeovil Pen Mill

[Kath123]

Hi I am a visually impaired adult.

I just wanted to ask a question though I’m not sure anyone here will know the answer.

At Yeovil Pen Mill station two platforms are used. The one near the Ticket Office and which can be accessed step free is usually where the train comes in if it is going in the Bristol/Gloucester direction.

The other platform has to be accessed by a stepped footbridge and trains going in the Weymouth direction usually come in on this platform meaning you also have to cross the bridge to exit the station if you get off one of those trains.

However on Wednesday I had a nice surprise (which I have had rarely before) where I was returning back from Bristol so expecting to come in on the platform where I’d have to cross the stepped footbridge to exit the station but to my joy the train came in the Ticket Office side instead so I didn’t have to cross the bridge.

This happens rarely but i am wondering why it happens? Who decides which platform the train comes in on what side and to change from the normal routine. Why would they do this?

I know they won’t be able to make a change just for me but it would be much easier if all trains could just come in on the platform the Ticket Office side all the time.

Thanks to anyone who can provide any insight.

 

[Somewhere]

The train planners decide which platform the trains use. Control or the Signaller can change it on an ad-hoc basis, or station staff can request it.
The change can be made just for you if it doesn't clash with another train. Platform changes are regularly made at stations for wheelchair users, for example, when lifts are out of action

 

[norbitonflyer]

As Pen Mill is a passing place on an otherwise single track route, it is common for two trains to be at the station at the same time so they cannot both use platform 1. Generally northbound trains use platform 1 and southbound ones use platfom 3. But both platforms are platform 1 is signalled bidirectionally so southbound trains can use platform 1 if required.

(Platform 2 is the opposite face of the island of which platfom 3 is a part - it faces the same track as platform 1)

Picture shows a southbound train in platforms 1 and 2

 

[Wilts Wanderer]

For southbound trains to use P1 there is approach-control signalling (with a time penalty on paper) which means that during the daytime, there isn’t quite enough time in the timetable to allow services to do this, without impacting the very tight cross at Maiden Newton. if you caught one of the late evening southbound services it probably wasn’t booked to cross anything so there is time.

 

[zwk500]

But both platforms are signalled bidirectionally so southbound trains can use platform 1 if required.

Small point, but Platform 3 is not bidirectional and can only be used by through southbound trains. This stops trains simply swapping platforms, and therefore if a southbound train uses 1 it stops any passing move taking place.

Unofficial box diagram here: https://www.flickr.com/photos/196224078@N04/52880511128/in/photostream/

 

[70014IronDuke]

As Pen Mill is a passing place on an otherwise single track route, it is common for two trains to be at the station at the same time so they cannot both use platform 1. Generally northbound trains use platform 1 and southbound ones use platfom 3. But both platforms are signalled bidirectionally so southbound trains can use platform 1 if required.
...

I had been thinking - Pen Mill is still mechanically signalled - how common was it that a line with mechanical signalling (apart from terminii) were bi-di? Is Pen Mill unusual in this, as it seems to me, or are/were many passing loops bi-di?

 

[zwk500]

I had been thinking - Pen Mill is still mechanically signalled - how common was it that a line with mechanical signalling (apart from terminii) were bi-di? Is Pen Mill unusual in this, as it seems to me, or are/were many passing loops bi-di?

Pen Mill is unusual but almost certainly not unique for being reversibly signalled (even only on one loop). I guess it made sense with the likelihood of trains terminating from the north or Yeovil Junction at various times, rather than requiring lots of shunting.

 

[70014IronDuke]

Pen Mill is unusual but almost certainly not unique for being reversibly signalled (even only on one loop). I guess it made sense with the likelihood of trains terminating from the north or Yeovil Junction at various times, rather than requiring lots of shunting.

The thought has just struck me - this would also have enabled trains from/to the north access Yeovil Town directly - and a GWR train could then have continued to Taunton if necessary too. Perhaps it's a historical leftover from those days?

 

[Gloster]

The thought has just struck me - this would also have enabled trains from/to the north access Yeovil Town directly - and a GWR train could then have continued to Taunton if necessary too. Perhaps it's a historical leftover from those days?

Up to 1968 the arrangement beyond the south end of the station was a straightforward double junction with the line to Town immediately reducing to a single line. It was possible for a train to come in from the Town to the Up platform, reverse and use a facing crossover to run to the Down line and then take the Weymouth line at the double junction; the same move seems to have been possible for Weymouth-Town trains. Otherwise it was simply an Up platform with a second face and a Down platform.

1968 saw singling, major resignalling and closure of the line to Town. The Up line became a reversible one but the Down stayed Down only. At the south end Down trains for Weymouth could still use the old Down Weymouth (using the same crossover if they were in the Up platform), which was now the single-line to Maiden Newton, or could continue on the old Up line which had become the single-line to Yeovil Junction. (I think that that is still the layout.)

Source: Cooke and Pryer’s Diagrams, Section 17 (1983).

 

[DynamicSpirit]

As Pen Mill is a passing place on an otherwise single track route, it is common for two trains to be at the station at the same time so they cannot both use platform 1. Generally northbound trains use platform 1 and southbound ones use platfom 3. But both platforms are signalled bidirectionally so southbound trains can use platform 1 if required.

(Platform 2 is the opposite face of the island of which platfom 3 is a part - it faces the same track as platform 1)

Picture shows a southbound train in platforms 1 and 2

That's a very nice picture. As someone who's never been to that station before, I'm curious though about the design in which one single track has platform faces on both sides (platforms 1 and 2). That seems wasteful in terms of unnecessary construction work, since it means platform 1 is superfluous (other than for accessibility, which is a big issue today but which almost no-one would have cared about at the time the station was built). Does anyone know why the station was built that way?

 

[Mcr Warrior]

Take it that (the former) platform 2 at Yeovil Pen Mill is no longer used by passenger trains (as the doors aren't ever opened on that side)? When would it have last seen regular use?

 

[zwk500]

That's a very nice picture. As someone who's never been to that station before, I'm curious though about the design in which one single track has platform faces on both sides (platforms 1 and 2). That seems wasteful in terms of unnecessary construction work, since it means platform 1 is superfluous (other than for accessibility, which is a big issue today but which almost no-one would have cared about at the time the station was built). Does anyone know why the station was built that way?

There are other examples around of such an arrangement (Guildford, formerly Lewes and on heritage lines Horsted keynes). It could have been to allow Down trains a straighter alignment, or to allow smoother transfer between platforms as part of the junction, or for something else.

 

[Big Sam]

My only experience of Pen Mill was a few months ago while waiting for the SWR service to Yeovil Jcn. Screen indicated Platform 1 (and never changed), and yet the train rolled into platform 3. Cue much running grabbing of belongings for the group of about ten people who now have to qucikly make their way over the footbridge. Wasn't much fun for the couple with several heavy suitcases who were there in good time on what was indicated as the correct platform. Is it any wonder people hate using the train in the UK?

 

[30907]

For southbound trains to use P1 there is approach-control signalling (with a time penalty on paper) which means that during the daytime, there isn’t quite enough time in the timetable to allow services to do this, without impacting the very tight cross at Maiden Newton.

Despite that, I notice that in RTT the platform number 3 remains italicised - I wonder if a definite decision has been made to prefer 1 to 3? Very few trains cross at Pen Mill.
(It may simply be the way the reporting system works of course.)

 

[Wilts Wanderer]

My only experience of Pen Mill was a few months ago while waiting for the SWR service to Yeovil Jcn. Screen indicated Platform 1 (and never changed), and yet the train rolled into platform 3. Cue much running grabbing of belongings for the group of about ten people who now have to qucikly make their way over the footbridge. Wasn't much fun for the couple with several heavy suitcases who were there in good time on what was indicated as the correct platform. Is it any wonder people hate using the train in the UK?

Pen Mill is a mechanical box so I guess if the signaller changes a platform (perhaps due to GWR having a disabled passenger wishing to alight) there is no update until the train actually arrives?

 

[Gloster]

That's a very nice picture. As someone who's never been to that station before, I'm curious though about the design in which one single track has platform faces on both sides (platforms 1 and 2). That seems wasteful in terms of unnecessary construction work, since it means platform 1 is superfluous (other than for accessibility, which is a big issue today but which almost no-one would have cared about at the time the station was built). Does anyone know why the station was built that way?

I did once ask a group that were building a model of the station and they didn’t know. It appears to have had the present arrangement since it was rebuilt in the early 1880s; it may have originally been a more traditional two platform station. My only thought (and it is no more than a guess) is that the arrangement may have been intended to make changing trains between the main line services from Westbury and beyond (to Weymouth) and those to the Town station and on to Taunton, which could start from the Up platform.

 

[CC 72100]

Small point, but Platform 3 is not bidirectional and can only be used by through southbound trains. This stops trains simply swapping platforms, and therefore if a southbound train uses 1 it stops any passing move taking place.

Unofficial box diagram here: https://www.flickr.com/photos/196224078@N04/52880511128/in/photostream/

It is also 10mph through platform 1, which is another reason to avoid using it for Southbound services

 

[norbitonflyer]

That's a very nice picture. As someone who's never been to that station before, I'm curious though about the design in which one single track has platform faces on both sides (platforms 1 and 2). That seems wasteful in terms of unnecessary construction work, since it means platform 1 is superfluous (other than for accessibility, which is a big issue today but which almost no-one would have cared about at the time the station was built). Does anyone know why the station was built that way?

Norwood Junction and Finsbury Park were others, either to allow interchange with trains on either side, or to allow both interchange and direct access to/from the entrance/exit. Stratford Central Line westbound is another, very recent, example.

 

[The exile]

That's a very nice picture. As someone who's never been to that station before, I'm curious though about the design in which one single track has platform faces on both sides (platforms 1 and 2). That seems wasteful in terms of unnecessary construction work, since it means platform 1 is superfluous (other than for accessibility, which is a big issue today but which almost no-one would have cared about at the time the station was built). Does anyone know why the station was built that way?

Accessibility for disabled people was not a consideration - but ease of loading/unloading/ transferring the mails etc might well have been.

 

[Big Sam]

Pen Mill is a mechanical box so I guess if the signaller changes a platform (perhaps due to GWR having a disabled passenger wishing to alight) there is no update until the train actually arrives?

There was no update at any point. The first any of us knew about it was watching the train roll into platform 3. There were no other trains due, so I can only assume it was because they were avoiding the 10mph speed limit into platform 1, even though the train was on time. It's a shambles.

 

[Wilts Wanderer]

There was no update at any point. The first any of us knew about it was watching the train roll into platform 3. There were no other trains due, so I can only assume it was because they were avoiding the 10mph speed limit into platform 1, even though the train was on time. It's a shambles.

Maybe the signaller made an error, assumed it was booked into P3 like pretty much all other southbound services. These things do happen.

 

[randyrippley]

That's a very nice picture. As someone who's never been to that station before, I'm curious though about the design in which one single track has platform faces on both sides (platforms 1 and 2). That seems wasteful in terms of unnecessary construction work, since it means platform 1 is superfluous (other than for accessibility, which is a big issue today but which almost no-one would have cared about at the time the station was built). Does anyone know why the station was built that way?

For interchange between Taunton trains terminating/reversing there, and trains heading to Weymouth.
Saved anyone from the Taunton line from having to use the bridge

 

[AlbertBeale]

Norwood Junction and Finsbury Park were others, either to allow interchange with trains on either side, or to allow both interchange and direct access to/from the entrance/exit. Stratford Central Line westbound is another, very recent, example.

White City Central Line also has a platform where doors can (and do) open on both sides - mainly for terminators/reversers though, I think. (Actually, there must be more terminal stations on the Underground with platforms both sides of a track, I'm sure ... Morden?)

 

[norbitonflyer]

White City Central Line also has a platform where doors can (and do) open on both sides - mainly for terminators/reversers though, I think. (Actually, there must be more terminal stations on the Underground with platforms both sides of a track, I'm sure ... Morden?)

Barking?

 

[LowLevel]

Pen Mill is a mechanical box so I guess if the signaller changes a platform (perhaps due to GWR having a disabled passenger wishing to alight) there is no update until the train actually arrives?

Sleaford is a fairly similar sort of location albeit a bit larger layout wise and traditionally signalled - platform changes there have to be input manually by the TOC control as there are no train describers.

 

[zwk500]

There's been recent threads on the platform either side of a track:

List of stations with one track but platforms either side

can people help me list stations what’s got a track but platforms both sides whether they are both in use or only the 1 for example. Guildford has a platform both sides but only 1 side is able to be used due to the 3rd rail.

www.railforums.co.uk

Which references this:

Trivia: Stations that have two platforms for one track.

What stations have two platforms that serve one track? I can think of the following ones so far: National Rail: • Banbury • Edinburgh Waverley • Finsbury Park • Greenford • Guildford • London Euston • Norwood Junction • Yeovil Pen Mill I believe that Ascot and High Wycombe used to but they no...

www.railforums.co.uk

 

[Big Sam]

Maybe the signaller made an error, assumed it was booked into P3 like pretty much all other southbound services. These things do happen.

Of the 6 southbound services operated by SWR to Yeovil Jcn today, five are booked into platform 1, with only one booked to use platform 3. My service was also booked into platform 1. I would be interested to know how many actually use platform 1 on a daily basis. I'll assume this happens regularly where the train doesn't use the booked platform. If that's the case then just change the bloody information screens instead of annoying passengers.

 

[zwk500]

Of the 6 southbound services operated by SWR to Yeovil Jcn today, five are booked into platform 1, with only one booked to use platform 3. My service was also booked into platform 1. I would be interested to know how many actually use platform 1 on a daily basis. I'll assume this happens regularly where the train doesn't use the booked platform. If that's the case then just change the bloody information screens instead of annoying passengers.

By way of information, not every station has control of it's departure boards on-site.

Having said that, Operators and NR should be co-ordinating the plan at these locations so that if there's a reason to be using 1, it's used and if the trains are always going to be in 3 they're shown as such in advance.

 

[louis97]

Of the 6 southbound services operated by SWR to Yeovil Jcn today, five are booked into platform 1, with only one booked to use platform 3. My service was also booked into platform 1. I would be interested to know how many actually use platform 1 on a daily basis. I'll assume this happens regularly where the train doesn't use the booked platform. If that's the case then just change the bloody information screens instead of annoying passengers.

It is an awkward one, due to the lack of a train describer at Yeovil Pen Mill, the only way for the information screens to be updated is for the signaller to realise their error and contact GWR control, or for the station staff (or on train staff) to notice and contact GWR control. This is assuming there is no way to update the information screens at the station itself, but then even if it was that would only be possible in the hours it is staffed.

 

[randyrippley]

Some of these could be last minute changes due to there being no barrow crossing at Pen Mill - if there's a passenger who can't use the footbridge then platform 1 has to be used