Primrose Hill Station Closure 1992

[Springs Branch]

I was musing over some of the "parliamentary" stations and how many stay open with absolute minimal passenger calls to avoid tricky closure proceedings. Not to mention routes like the Helsby - Ellesmere Port line which also limp along with few users & services - and which seem the first to be cancelled when crews or rolling stock are scarce - again because it's too hard to just close them.

Then I remembered Primrose Hill.

Primrose Hill station was eliminated in 1992, along with the token local service along that stretch of line - all seemingly without much fuss. At the end it had been served by just one Watford Jn / Liverpool Street train in each direction on M-F only, and even this was reportedly prone to frequent cancellations.

Unlike other London area stations which have closed in recent decades, Primrose Hill was neither replaced by a new, better alternative (think Angel Road > Meridian Waters, or Kings Cross Thameslink > St Pancras Thameslink), nor closed as part of some nearby infrastructure project (thinking North Woolwich / Silvertown > DLR and Elizabeth line, or Croxley Green & Watford West > LU Metropolitan Line extension proposal).

Being inner North London, I would have expected strident objections to any closure from vociferous local Camden / Islington activists & protestors ("Savage Tory Cuts", and all that in the language of the time - even if none of them had ever used the station).

So how did Network SouthEast manage to close Primrose Hill and that section of line to passengers, rather than bunging on some sort of parliamentary service, or a token replacement bus? For example, a once-a-day / once-a-week train running at some odd time between Willesden Junction Low Level & Stratford via Primrose Hill (bit like LO does to/from Battersea Park)

• Does anyone remember what happened at the time?
• Were there actually significant objections to closure in 1992, rather than Primrose Hill just "passing away peacefully in its sleep", as my memory suggests?
• Is it easier to shut stations within London than elsewhere in the country? - e.g. because inner London is more likely have decent alternative options close by.

 

[Bletchleyite]

I expect the fact that Chalk Farm Tube station, which is probably what most people used anyway (as the vast majority of the demand is to central London, not Watford, and anyone going to Watford might well be quicker doing so via Euston and a fast service, or certainly not slower), is 2 minutes or 0.1 miles walk away, is fairly relevant.

In short, the better alternative was already there. Even in terms of commuting to the City, because it's the Northern Line.

 

[Railwaysceptic]

There are various YouTube videos giving a driver's POV going through Primrose Hill Station, and it's clear that a substantial clearing of vegetation from the island platform was carried out at some point. Can anyone explain why?

 

[StephenHunter]

Primrose Hill got badly damaged by floods in 1992, so closed early.

 

[sh24]

Chalk Farm serves the City (and much more) far better than Primrose Hill even could have done. And back then the huge growth in East London (Hoxton, Shoreditch et al) fuelled by the Overground was unimaginable. Even the NLL was a 20min interval service of a 3 car 313. So I doubt anyone batted an eyelid.

 

[The exile]

It would have quite difficult to argue that the station and its service represented a “vital lifeline” - far harder than in an area with little or no alternative.

 

[station_road]

I only used it once - mid 80s, it even had a staffed ticket office at that point (albeit with one of the ticket machines that printed something that looked like a bus ticket, using number codes instead of names of stations). I was the only passenger on the station, and don't remember the train being busy

 

[StephenHunter]

Chalk Farm serves the City (and much more) far better than Primrose Hill even could have done. And back then the huge growth in East London (Hoxton, Shoreditch et al) fuelled by the Overground was unimaginable. Even the NLL was a 20min interval service of a 3 car 313. So I doubt anyone batted an eyelid.

The Goblin was a 2-car slam door, I believe.

 

[citycat]

Trying not the derail the thread off topic too much, my dad was apparently a freight guard roster clerk at Primrose Hill in the 60’s before later moving to Freightliner at York Way and Willesden before eventually finishing his railway career at BRB headquarters.

I have vague memories of going to work with my dad in school holidays when I was six or seven via the Northern line to Chalk farm and the short walk to the yard. I would often be given rides in the 08 pilot or lifted up into one of the electrics, still with the white roofs. And once I was given a short ride in a green class 40. I clearly remember the whistling.

However, over the years of time, my memories have diminished and some details are lost. Could anyone tell me what kind of yard was at Primrose Hill where my dad would have worked? Was it a freight yard? Where did the various locos come from that were in the yard. Was there a line direct to Willesden depot.

My dad’s office seemed to be right next to a line as I can remember the vibrations as a loco trundled past his window.

Any info on my dad’s work location would be gratefully received.

 

[Gloster]

A look at the fourth edition of the London Railway Atlas suggests that the sidings on the Up side of the main line were carriage sidings. Those on the Down side, between the Euston and Camden Road lines, were goods sidings. There was no special loco road to or from Willesden.

 

[citycat]

A look at the fourth edition of the London Railway Atlas suggests that the sidings on the Up side of the main line were carriage sidings. Those on the Down side, between the Euston and Camden Road lines, were goods sidings. There was no special loco road to or from Willesden.

I remember we would take a walking route from Primrose Hill station to the yard so I guess it was definitely the goods yard.

In later years when I used to make use of my free ‘staff dependant’ passes on the WCML, the guard on the train would recognise the surname on the blue free pass and tell me to give their regards to my dad.

Thanks for the info !

 

[ChiefPlanner]

Camden Goods was an impressive place in it's day ! I remember meeting some old boy who had migrated to Stratford Flt , who had started his career sometime in the 1950's who used to look after horses there ! - the decline of railborne general freight and Freightliners saw it pretty well dead in the late1960's.

 

[stuving]

This is the core of the BR closure notice (these started to appear in local papers on 2 May 1991).


It's pretty clear that BR saw this as some minor tidying up of what was left over from the Broad Street services. They'd tried switching the remaining trains into Liverpool Street, but passenger numbers were still too few to make it worth doing. That second part of the closure was the chord from Dalston Kingsland to London Fields, which was only built six years earlier (and is still there).

There were some, almost ritualised, complaints about this, e.g. that the few passengers are being treated with contempt. This sounds like another of those cases where BR scaled down the number of trains to match the reduced passenger numbers, which left such a poor service that even more passengers deserted (a more cynical interpretation is possible). I guess the real question is why, if people still commuted in to work in the city (and I think they did in the 70s and 80s), they had already chosen to change to the underground for the last bit rather than stay on a suburban train all the way.

 

[Mr. SW]

My biggest surprise was that it lasted as long as it did and frankly, I didn't think the station was really missed. It was always a little odd, and because of its position and the surrounding railway land, the entrance faced away from the busy Chalk Farm Road/Regents Park Road/Adelaide Road/Haverstock Hill Junction. The Northern Line basically killed it, and why it wasn't put out of its misery at the earliest available opportunity seems a bit of a mystery. Still, never mind, eh?

 

[Statto]

Primrose Hill was due to close anyway when the Watford - Liverpool Street service was withdrawn, but closed earlier than expected due to flooding. Quite odd to keep the station running as long as it did when Chalk Farm Tube is around the corner & as mentioned serves the City far better than Primrose Hill did.

 

[Magdalia]

I guess the real question is why, if people still commuted in to work in the city (and I think they did in the 70s and 80s), they had already chosen to change to the underground for the last bit rather than stay on a suburban train all the way.

You are right that the historical context is key to understanding what happened.

In the 1970s Broad Street handled significant amounts of commuter traffic for the City of London. It lost its GN services in 1976, with the Great Northern services switching to Moorgate, but it still had the North London Line trains from/to both Richmond and Watford Junction. The Richmond service ran to/from Broad Street all day, but Watford Junction-Broad Street was peak hours only. In the peaks, very few dc line trains ran in and out of Euston, that was basically an off peak service.

This meant that, even in the 1970s, Primrose Hill only had a peak hour service when the Watford Junction trains were running mostly to/from Broad Street not Euston.

If you want a key date for change it is probably the 1983 general election. After that it was clear that financial deregulation was coming, with "Big Bang" in the form of the Financial Services Act 1986. Astute property investors got in early to provide the expansion of office accommodation that was going to be needed in the City of London, and the Broadgate development is an example. A key feature of this was closing Broad Street station to release land for building offices.

The Richmond service was dealt with by diverting it to run to/from North Woolwich. Provision of the Graham Road curve enabled a peak hour Watford dc-City service to be retained, but with more peak hour Watford Junction trains going to/from Euston.

I'm relying on memory here, but I think that the Graham Road curve and the token Watford Junction-Liverpool Street service were regarded as a necessary cost to get the whole Broadgate development through the planning process. I suspect that it was recognised that, in practice, the Watford Junction line-City of London traffic would migrate to other routes, and that's what happened. By 1990 Watford Junction-Liverpool Street was down to one morning peak and one evening peak train in each direction.

 

[ChiefPlanner]

Excellent summary - I recall the standard 3 tph DC service to Euston all day , was reduced to 2 tph in the high peak to allow the Watford - Broad Street services to operate.

 

[Ken H]

You are right that the historical context is key to understanding what happened.

In the 1970s Broad Street handled significant amounts of commuter traffic for the City of London. It lost its GN services in 1976, with the Great Northern services switching to Moorgate, but it still had the North London Line trains from/to both Richmond and Watford Junction. The Richmond service ran to/from Broad Street all day, but Watford Junction-Broad Street was peak hours only. In the peaks, very few dc line trains ran in and out of Euston, that was basically an off peak service.

This meant that, even in the 1970s, Primrose Hill only had a peak hour service when the Watford Junction trains were running mostly to/from Broad Street not Euston.

If you want a key date for change it is probably the 1983 general election. After that it was clear that financial deregulation was coming, with "Big Bang" in the form of the Financial Services Act 1986. Astute property investors got in early to provide the expansion of office accommodation that was going to be needed in the City of London, and the Broadgate development is an example. A key feature of this was closing Broad Street station to release land for building offices.

The Richmond service was dealt with by diverting it to run to/from North Woolwich. Provision of the Graham Road curve enabled a peak hour Watford dc-City service to be retained, but with more peak hour Watford Junction trains going to/from Euston.

I'm relying on memory here, but I think that the Graham Road curve and the token Watford Junction-Liverpool Street service were regarded as a necessary cost to get the whole Broadgate development through the planning process. I suspect that it was recognised that, in practice, the Watford Junction line-City of London traffic would migrate to other routes, and that's what happened. By 1990 Watford Junction-Liverpool Street was down to one morning peak and one evening peak train in each direction.

I did Liverpool St- watford in the late 1980's. I used my Nuneaton - London Stations return as it was a permissable route!

 

[WesternLancer]

Good entry here, as you’d expect from the excellent disused station’s website

Disused Stations: Primrose Hill Station

Includes a picture with pretty fresh looking network south east paintwork so not seemingly run down and neglected at that point.

 

[yorksrob]

Good entry here, as you’d expect from the excellent disused station’s website

Disused Stations: Primrose Hill Station

Includes a picture with pretty fresh looking network south east paintwork so not seemingly run down and neglected at that point.

It's ironic considering that even as a station with a parliamentary service in the 90's, Primrose Hill had far better passenger facilities than many well used stations then or now.

 

[Hornet]

My Visit to Primrose Hill Snapping the 15:56 Watford Junction to London Broad Street on the 6th March 1984.

 

[StephenHunter]

Excellent summary - I recall the standard 3 tph DC service to Euston all day , was reduced to 2 tph in the high peak to allow the Watford - Broad Street services to operate.

Broad Street was never fully repaired after war damage.

 

[WesternLancer]

My Visit to Primrose Hill Snapping the 15:56 Watford Junction to London Broad Street on the 6th March 1984.View attachment 173435

Nice pic. Would that be an eastern region blue station name on the strip light shade, or LMR maroon?

 

[Statto]

Interesting that Primrose Hill had platforms on the LNWR lines in & out of Euston, but that part of the station was closed & platforms removed during electrification in 1915, & just left with the service to Broad Street

 

[Gloster]

Interesting that Primrose Hill had platforms on the LNWR lines in & out of Euston, but that part of the station was closed & platforms removed during electrification in 1915, & just left with the service to Broad Street

Chalk Farm Underground station had opened in June 1907 and I would expect that the resulting loss of ‘West End via Euston’ traffic at Primrose Hill was so great that retention was not worthwhile once changes occurred.

 

[Ashley Hill]

It’s probably black and white. Primrose Hill had maroon totems.

 

[WesternLancer]

It’s probably black and white. Primrose Hill had maroon totems.

Thanks

 

[norbitonflyer]

The Goblin was a 2-car slam door, I believe.

Whehn I first knew the Goblin in the late 70s (when it still ran to Kentish Town rather than Gospel Oak) it was usually a 3- or 4-car lash up of leftovers from Cricklewood depot - sometimes a standard class 127 set.

 

[Springs Branch]

Interesting that the BR Closure Notice attached to Post #13 proposed diverting that axed peak Primrose Hill train to run between Willesden Jn and Stratford via Hampstead Heath.

The existing Watford Junction to Liverpool Street train will be diverted at Willesden Junction to provide an additional Monday to Friday peak hour service between Willesden Junction and Camden Road via Gospel Oak, and between Dalston Kingsland and Stratford and vice versa in the evening peak period

I wonder whether this promise ever eventuated once the Primrose Hill route had shut? Presumably, if it ever did, it didn't last very long.*

If anyone has easy access to a NSE timetable from around 1993, perhaps they can confirm.

This would have given an easy cross-platform interchange at Willesden Jn Low Level from stations north of there - albeit only once per day. But of course no use if you wanted to travel to/from Liverpool Street - and transfers between the DC and NLL lines were available all day, every day at Willesden Jn by yomping between the High Level and Low Level platforms.


* - I know there's still a once-a-day passenger service from Willesden Jn Low Level to Stratford via the New Line. However this is an empty-stock-into-service move at 05-something in the morning. Not a train ostensibly provided for the convenience of peak hour commuters.

 

[Bletchleyite]

This would have given an easy cross-platform interchange at Willesden Jn Low Level from stations north of there - albeit only once per day. But of course no use if you wanted to travel to/from Liverpool Street

If you wanted to get there, you'd use the Northern Line to Moorgate and walk, it's really not very far (and is actually shown on the Tube map as a walking interchange now), or change for the Met/H&C/Circle either there or Kings Cross if for any reason you could not. It's not that quick, but when you get to frequencies of upward of 10tph (often vastly upward of it, too) the convenience of not having to look at a timetable nor wait very long wins out. That's why it just wasn't useful.