Southampton-Tonbridge Route Edenbrige/Polegate

[JB_B]

I need to travel from Brighton to Three Bridges a few times each week - a mix of peak/off peak and day return/overnight. That's around £20-£45/wk using Network South East Card discounted and/or Thameslink-only tickets (to Gatwick).

Just to cover these journeys it's never worth getting a 7-day season (at ~£56) but I'm thinking about getting a more flexible 7-day to include this route and also use as a sort of local rover for other journeys around the South-East.

Southampton (SOU) to Tonbridge (TON) (~£64) could be a reasonable option.

(This is route: Polegate/Edenbridge)

TON and SOU are routeing points and mapped routes are LONDON CW+XE LP+RA LP+TN LP+VH PD+RA
PD+TN PD+VH SW+RA SW+TN SW+VH

As far as I can see there's no mapped route via Polegate - but does the route restriction on the ticket mean that I can still go that way (ie changing at Hastings/St Leonards)?

I think this would could also allow travel on the SWML and Portsmouth Direct ( at least as far as Clapham Junction?).

It seems unlikely that this would this be valid via London - what rule, if any, would make it invalid?

 

[alistairlees]

I need to travel from Brighton to Three Bridges a few times each week - a mix of peak/off peak and day return/overnight. That's around £20-£45/wk using Network South East Card discounted and/or Thameslink-only tickets (to Gatwick).

Just to cover these journeys it's never worth getting a 7-day season (at ~£56) but I'm thinking about getting a more flexible 7-day to include this route and also use as a sort of local rover for other journeys around the South-East.

Southampton (SOU) to Tonbridge (TON) (~£64) could be a reasonable option.

(This is route: Polegate/Edenbridge)

TON and SOU are routeing points and mapped routes are LONDON CW+XE LP+RA LP+TN LP+VH PD+RA
PD+TN PD+VH SW+RA SW+TN SW+VH

As far as I can see there's no mapped route via Polegate - but does the route restriction on the ticket mean that I can still go that way (ie changing at Hastings/St Leonards)?

I think this would could also allow travel on the SWML and Portsmouth Direct ( at least as far as Clapham Junction?).

It seems unlikely that this would this be valid via London - what rule, if any, would make it invalid?

I've used this ticket personally before, my understanding was that it was only valid via Edenbridge / Redhill and then via Brighton / Hove or via Horsham; OR via St Leonards WS (not sure about Hastings because of doubling back), and then via the south coast.

As far as I know it's certainly not valid via London. However it does seem to come up on journey planners for Edenbridge - Redhill - Reigate - Guildford - Woking - Southampton (so getting some SWT legs in). I wasn't aware until I tried that.

 

[Romilly]

If you are correct about there being no mapped route via Polegate, section 3.6 of the forum's ticketing guide explains that you can take any permitted route from Southampton to Polegate, and then any permitted route from Polegate to Tonbridge.

If there are mapped Southampton-Tonbridge routes that go via Edenbridge, you are limited (if you want to travel via Edenbridge) to mapped routes that go via Edenbridge.

 

[bangor-toad]

Hi there,
I can't answer your actual question but can offer another idea...

What about a Southampton to Wye ticket? It's the same price as a SOU-TON one. The Wye ticket is via Barnham and I think covers these basic options:
Southampton - Barnham
then:
Barnham - Horsham - Redhill - Tonbridge - Ashford - Wye
Barnham - Brighton - Redhill - Tonbridge - Ashford - Wye
Barnham - Brighton - Hastings - Ashford - Wye

I don't think it covers the Tonbridge to Hastings line but I could be wrong.

As it's the same price, why not get to Tonbridge sometimes and Wye some other time?
Cheers,
Mr Toad

 

[JB_B]

I've used this ticket personally before, my understanding was that it was only valid via Edenbridge / Redhill and then via Brighton / Hove or via Horsham; OR via St Leonards WS (not sure about Hastings because of doubling back), and then via the south coast.

As far as I know it's certainly not valid via London. However it does seem to come up on journey planners for Edenbridge - Redhill - Reigate - Guildford - Woking - Southampton (so getting some SWT legs in). I wasn't aware until I tried that.

Thanks. I don't think I need to worry about the Hastings double-back because of the Routeing Group Station rule - as I understand it I'm allowed to exit at Hastings to use the station facilities but not for actual BoJ. ( I've previously used day-return tickets with this routeing and they don't work the barriers at Hastings.)

I would expect to be challenged if going via Clapham Junction (and certainly if I went via London) but would I actually be off route?

 

[JB_B]

If you are correct about there being no mapped route via Polegate, section 3.6 of the forum's ticketing guide explains that you can take any permitted route from Southampton to Polegate, and then any permitted route from Polegate to Tonbridge.

Thanks for the pointer to section 3.6. Via St Leonards is the shortest route from Polegate to Tonbridge so I'm sure this will be OK.

If there are mapped Southampton-Tonbridge routes that go via Edenbridge, you are limited (if you want to travel via Edenbridge) to mapped routes that go via Edenbridge.

Yes.

 

[JB_B]

Hi there,
I can't answer your actual question but can offer another idea...

What about a Southampton to Wye ticket? It's the same price as a SOU-TON one. The Wye ticket is via Barnham and I think covers these basic options:
Southampton - Barnham
then:
Barnham - Horsham - Redhill - Tonbridge - Ashford - Wye
Barnham - Brighton - Redhill - Tonbridge - Ashford - Wye
Barnham - Brighton - Hastings - Ashford - Wye

I don't think it covers the Tonbridge to Hastings line but I could be wrong.

As it's the same price, why not get to Tonbridge sometimes and Wye some other time?
Cheers,
Mr Toad

Thanks for the suggestion- yes - I've noted that the same price can be obtained with some destinations east of TON ( and also some origins west of SOU). The downside is the routeing switches from Edenbridge/Polegate to via Barnham which restricts some of the routes I'd like to use further north.

 

[Iggy12a]

Thanks for the suggestion- yes - I've noted that the same price can be obtained with some destinations east of TON ( and also some origins west of SOU). The downside is the routeing switches from Edenbridge/Polegate to via Barnham which restricts some of the routes I'd like to use further north.

I actually think that the fare via Edenbridge/Polegate implicitly also means via Barnham. If you ask the Journey Planner for an off peak day return from Southampton to Tonbridge the fare is £15.60 via Edenbridge/Polegate, and travelling via Barnham. If you request the journey to avoid London Terminals, the cheapest fare it brings up is £46 via Clapham Junction. Presumably season tickets are priced on the same routings: via Edenbridge/Polegate and effectively via Barnham at the price you have found, and then a higher fare for avoiding London, and effectively via Clapham Junction.

 

[John @ home]

Southampton (SOU) to Tonbridge (TON) (~£64) could be a reasonable option.

(This is route: Polegate/Edenbridge)

This is valid by any permitted route between Southampton Central and Tonbridge which goes via Polegate, or which goes via Edenbridge. If there are no permitted Southampton Central - Tonbridge routes via Polegate, then this "Via Edenbridge/Polegate" ticket (but not tickets routed "Not Via London" or "London Not Und") is also valid by any permitted route between Southampton Central and Polegate, followed by any permitted route between Polegate and Tonbridge. It may also be used on trains which pass through, but do not call at, Polegate.

I think this would could also allow travel on the SWML and Portsmouth Direct ( at least as far as Clapham Junction?).

The shortest Southampton Central - Tonbridge route (101 miles) goes via Havant, Guildford, Redhill and Edenbridge, so that's certainly valid.

It seems unlikely that this would this be valid via London - what rule, if any, would make it invalid?

I can't immediately spot one. My fear is that any attempt to use the ticket in this way would lead to changes which would not be favourable to the passenger.

 

[JB_B]

I actually think that the fare via Edenbridge/Polegate implicitly also means via Barnham. If you ask the Journey Planner for an off peak day return from Southampton to Tonbridge the fare is £15.60 via Edenbridge/Polegate, and travelling via Barnham. If you request the journey to avoid London Terminals, the cheapest fare it brings up is £46 via Clapham Junction. Presumably season tickets are priced on the same routings: via Edenbridge/Polegate and effectively via Barnham at the price you have found, and then a higher fare for avoiding London, and effectively via Clapham Junction.

That could be the intention, yes.

 

[JB_B]

... My fear is that any attempt to use the ticket in this way would lead to changes which would not be favourable to the passenger.

That's a good point.