Speed limit reductions on South West mainline

[RichHI]

When I was younger, I used to travel regularly on the London to Southampton line and I remember the line speeds being much higher. Trying to eat in the restaurant car going through Clapham Junction was a challenge and I remember 90 mph signs at New Malden and going through Basingstoke on the new 4reps flat out. Could anyone tell me when the speeds were cut please? I imagine it was on Health and Safety grounds?

 

[jfollows]

The line speeds are, if anything, higher today than they used to be.
See the Sectional Appendix at https://sacuksprodnrdigital0001.blob.core.windows.net/sectional-appendix/Sectional Appendix full PDFs Sept 23/Kent Sussex Wessex Sectional Appendix September 2023.pdf
Granted, it's only 80mph at New Malden but it's 90mph after Surbiton and it's 100mph on the up until West Byfleet. I don't think there are any significant cuts in line speeds; I used to use the line frequently from about 1984 to 1996. Basingstoke now has 18 chains at 65mph on what I call the down through, officially now down fast, this was always the case because it's also in my personal 1970s track diagram I can't recall whether or not that used to exist, but otherwise it's 90mph on both through lines, increasing to 100mph on the up after the junction.
Speed reductions would, I think, normally be caused by related issues such as signal sighting - stricter rules on how far ahead a signal has to be visible for - or maintenance costs - no point maintaining infrastructure to a higher standard than it generally gets used for.
Of course, the 4-REPs were capable of 100mph (officially limited to 90mph) and often did so, nowadays speed limits won't be broken with the same impunity because of on-train monitoring devices.
If you went through Basingstoke flat out in the down direction then the driver was speeding. Unless the 65mph was introduced after 1966 but before 1980.

 

[hexagon789]

When I was younger, I used to travel regularly on the London to Southampton line and I remember the line speeds being much higher. Trying to eat in the restaurant car going through Clapham Junction was a challenge and I remember 90 mph signs at New Malden and going through Basingstoke on the new 4reps flat out. Could anyone tell me when the speeds were cut please? I imagine it was on Health and Safety grounds?

They haven't, they've been raised three times since the end of steam

1966-67 for the Bournemouth electrification, the early 80s (a few curves were eased, e.g. from 65 to 80 and 70 to 90 etc, but I forget where) and finally in ~1988 for the 100mph 442s.

 

[MichaelAMW]

The line speeds are, if anything, higher today than they used to be.
See the Sectional Appendix at https://sacuksprodnrdigital0001.blob.core.windows.net/sectional-appendix/Sectional Appendix full PDFs Sept 23/Kent Sussex Wessex Sectional Appendix September 2023.pdf
Granted, it's only 80mph at New Malden but it's 90mph after Surbiton and it's 100mph on the up until West Byfleet. I don't think there are any significant cuts in line speeds; I used to use the line frequently from about 1984 to 1996. Basingstoke now has 18 chains at 65mph on what I call the down through, officially now down fast, this was always the case because it's also in my personal 1970s track diagram I can't recall whether or not that used to exist, but otherwise it's 90mph on both through lines, increasing to 100mph on the up after the junction.
Speed reductions would, I think, normally be caused by related issues such as signal sighting - stricter rules on how far ahead a signal has to be visible for - or maintenance costs - no point maintaining infrastructure to a higher standard than it generally gets used for.
Of course, the 4-REPs were capable of 100mph (officially limited to 90mph) and often did so, nowadays speed limits won't be broken with the same impunity because of on-train monitoring devices.
If you went through Basingstoke flat out in the down direction then the driver was speeding. Unless the 65mph was introduced after 1966 but before 1980.

It was 75 inwards from New Malden as the signal spacing required that - the reduction in headway was worth the slight increase in journey time. It was 90 beyond there but later reduced as far as Hampton Court Junction, again for signalling reasons. There was an article about all this in one of the magazines when the resignallng was done (90s?) and they also reviewed what had happened earlier. It was interesting to read about the 'closing up' signals that were installed between Surbiton and Woking before some of the platforms. Wouldn't have thought it would ever be so busy as to need that.

 

[jfollows]

Thanks for that, MichaelAMW. I have a memory of the 1990s being a time when existing signalling was looked at a bit, perhaps following an incident, because - totally unconnected with the lines out of Waterloo - I remember the yellow "100" stencil being moved up from Edgeley Junction No. 1 (it used to be at the junction, it got moved closer to Adswood Road and Cheadle Hulme) and there was a new speed limit on the down between Adlington and Poynton for signal sighting reasons. The speed limits on Manchester Piccadilly approaches were very low also, this was following the Ladbroke Grove accident, and it took a while to lift them to today's limits.

 

[Taunton]

I think the speed limits were regarded more as advisory in former times. I have written here before about a flat-out journey around 1989 on a late running nonstop from Southampton Airport to Waterloo, with a 4-VEP substituting for an REP formation, which was achieved in several minutes under the 60 minutes time allowed for the faster main line unit, with notable speed indeed through the Basingstoke platforms, and elsewhere.

Speedometers themselves, simple cable drive units, were also often an approximation. Passing through the gangway between coupled units and looking in the cabs at the speed, a noticeable discrepancy could sometimes be seen.

 

[jfollows]

Agreed, but still one step better than the previous generation of units such as the Manchester-Hadfield DC units which didn't have a speedometer at all, I was lucky to notice when I got to travel in one with the driver once.

 

[Rescars]

When I was younger, I used to travel regularly on the London to Southampton line and I remember the line speeds being much higher. Trying to eat in the restaurant car going through Clapham Junction was a challenge and I remember 90 mph signs at New Malden and going through Basingstoke on the new 4reps flat out. Could anyone tell me when the speeds were cut please? I imagine it was on Health and Safety grounds?
Specific to your point about dining through Clapham, sadly the opportunities to eat in a restaurant car have fallen away even more rapidly than the quality of the ride has improved. It might well be possible now to keep soup in a bowl without needing to leave the spoon in it to stop it slopping all over the linen tablecloth, but there just aren't the opportunities to conduct this most civilised of experiments any more!

Specific to your point about dining through Clapham, sadly the opportunities to eat in a restaurant car have fallen away even more rapidly than the quality of the ride has improved. It might well be possible now to keep soup in a bowl without needing to leave the spoon in it to stop it slopping all over the linen tablecloth, but there just aren't the opportunities to conduct this most civilised of experiments any more!

 

[30907]

Limits in the 1960 appendix were 60 out to Hampton Ct Jn (45 through Clapham Jn?); the 65 on the Down at Basingstoke is long-standing, and Worting was 60 until well after the REPs came in.

 

[Big Jumby 74]

It was interesting to read about the 'closing up' signals that were installed between Surbiton and Woking before some of the platforms. Wouldn't have thought it would ever be so busy as to need that.

Timings out as far as Hampton Court Junction were extremely tight in the peaks, and of course the peaks were the driving factor in headway margins, and the issue of stopping pattern trains between Woking and Surbiton, crossing out to the UMF London side of latter, and vice versa in the evening outbound peak (slowing after passing Berrylands to cross DMF to p3 at Surbiton), causing delays when any late running was evident, is well known about, and at numerous TT changes alternative moves were looked at for certain trains deemed to be critical to overall performance, eg; using the crossings at New Malden, but they were slower speed turnouts than those in Berrylands cuttting, and even the possibility of crossing at HC Junction (US to UF) and use p2, but this was a total no-no, the stream of UMF trains (morning peak) was such that there was no time for anything to stop at p2, without serious knock-on to trains following.

But back to OP comment about impression of speed, one thing that has changed is todays driving techniques, which are now far more focused on certain criteria (trying to be diplomatic here... ), and so some of those runs many of us experienced way back will never be repeated - I myself as a passenger once noted a run, start to pass, Waterloo to Clapham Junction, DMF, in under 5 minutes....just....

Specific to your point about dining through Clapham, sadly the opportunities to eat in a restaurant car have fallen away even more rapidly than the quality of the ride has improved. It might well be possible now to keep soup in a bowl without needing to leave the spoon in it to stop it slopping all over the linen tablecloth, but there just aren't the opportunities to conduct this most civilised of experiments any more!

That's put a smile on my boat race. One might also add the ability, or not (after a night on the town) to remain standing upright at the bar in a REP heading out of the smoke at a rate of knots....best not say more....

 

[Rescars]

Timings out as far as Hampton Court Junction were extremely tight in the peaks, and of course the peaks were the driving factor in headway margins, and the issue of stopping pattern trains between Woking and Surbiton, crossing out to the UMF London side of latter, and vice versa in the evening outbound peak (slowing after passing Berrylands to cross DMF to p3 at Surbiton), causing delays when any late running was evident, is well known about, and at numerous TT changes alternative moves were looked at for certain trains deemed to be critical to overall performance, eg; using the crossings at New Malden, but they were slower speed turnouts than those in Berrylands cuttting, and even the possibility of crossing at HC Junction (US to UF) and use p2, but this was a total no-no, the stream of UMF trains (morning peak) was such that there was no time for anything to stop at p2, without serious knock-on to trains following.

But back to OP comment about impression of speed, one thing that has changed is todays driving techniques, which are now far more focused on certain criteria (trying to be diplomatic here... ), and so some of those runs many of us experienced way back will never be repeated - I myself as a passenger once noted a run, start to pass, Waterloo to Clapham Junction, DMF, in under 5 minutes....just....


That's put a smile on my boat race. One might also add the ability, or not (after a night on the town) to remain standing upright at the bar in a REP heading out of the smoke at a rate of knots....best not say more....

The pole in a RKB was to be treasured on nights like these!

 

[Taunton]

Timings out as far as Hampton Court Junction were extremely tight in the peaks

It is of course always more difficult to merge trains from diverse start points into a single headway stream to the terminus, generally the morning peak, than it is to have the same service intervals on the way out from that terminus in the evening.

 

[Sad Sprinter]

I think the speed limits were regarded more as advisory in former times. I have written here before about a flat-out journey around 1989 on a late running nonstop from Southampton Airport to Waterloo, with a 4-VEP substituting for an REP formation, which was achieved in several minutes under the 60 minutes time allowed for the faster main line unit, with notable speed indeed through the Basingstoke platforms, and elsewhere.

Speedometers themselves, simple cable drive units, were also often an approximation. Passing through the gangway between coupled units and looking in the cabs at the speed, a noticeable discrepancy could sometimes be seen.

Yes and I remember your story and that thread very well, it was the first thread I read when joining this forum: https://www.railforums.co.uk/threads/memories-of-fast-trains-sr.147733/

Growing up on the Brighton Line, the SWML seemed like a Brighton Line on steroids as a child. I have similar memories to the OP, being in a Wessex Electric passing through Wimbledon with a cup of hot chocolate from the buffet car, and my Dad telling me to hurry up and drink it because we'd be in Waterloo soon!

To echo what others were saying, the South Western still seems very fast. I did Clapham Junction to Guildford in Summer 2014 and remember the run being enormously fast for the Southern Region through New Malden etc. Last Summer I did Bournemouth to Waterloo which got up to a good speed in places.

Everything seemed faster in the past. There's a thread going on in the London Underground subforum about Piccadilly Line train speeds, both I and many others recall the trains on the express section in West London going at absolute full pelt in the 1990s/2000s - now slowed to the same speed as a stopping District Line train

 

[Big Jumby 74]

There's a thread going on in the London Underground subforum about Piccadilly Line train speeds, both I and many others recall the trains on the express section in West London going at absolute full pelt in the 1990s/2000s - now slowed to the same speed as a stopping District Line train

Ditto the Eastern Central line, circa 1980 ish, I recall Liv St to Stratford and vice versa could be a bouncy ride, shall I say, but probably exaggerated by still being underground at that point.

 

[Snow1964]

When I was younger, I used to travel regularly on the London to Southampton line and I remember the line speeds being much higher. Trying to eat in the restaurant car going through Clapham Junction was a challenge and I remember 90 mph signs at New Malden and going through Basingstoke on the new 4reps flat out. Could anyone tell me when the speeds were cut please? I imagine it was on Health and Safety grounds?

The 4REPs had dining chairs, not fixed seating

90mph was official limit, think it was 65mph upto New Malden until early 1970s then 75mph

There were some lower limits eg 15mph at Northam, but curve was eased to 25mph, Lymington Junction was 70mph (now 90mph),

 

[nw1]

It is of course always more difficult to merge trains from diverse start points into a single headway stream to the terminus, generally the morning peak, than it is to have the same service intervals on the way out from that terminus in the evening.

The frequency on the fast lines in the early/mid 80s out of Waterloo in the peaks was quite something.

There were departures almost every 2 mins from around 1700 to 1810, with just a few gaps. There were many cases of a Surbiton-stopper being "chased" just 2 mins later by a non-stop through Surbiton. The 1982 timetable and 1983 WTT are both available on Timetable World. Particularly interesting features from 1983 include the 1736 stopper to Farnham, with a Surbiton call, being followed immediately by the 1738 50-hauled Exeter service, and the 1742 Cobham line service, also with a Surbiton call, being followed immediately by the 1744 REP/TC combo to Bournemouth.

The pattern was approximately:

xxx0 Portsmouth Direct
xxx2 Cobham (some gaps)
xxx4 Basingstoke or beyond, alternating semi-fast and stopping
xxx6 all stations from Surbiton to Woking, alternate trains extending to Farnham
xxx8 Alton line (every 20 mins)

with some exceptions (e.g. there was the 1730 to Weymouth, which delayed the Portsmouth Direct to 1732).

I think at some point (not sure when?) the Cobham services in the peak moved from the fast to the slow lines, which made things a bit less tight.

 

[Big Jumby 74]

There were departures almost every 2 mins from around 1700 to 1810, with just a few gaps. The 1982 timetable and 1983 WTT are both available on Timetable World.

Correct. Usually three or four (peak time) consecutive departures at minimal two minute intervals, then one (or two) three minute gaps, then back to two minute again, just to give some reliability in the plan.

The 4REPs had dining chairs, not fixed seating

Used those myself even (particularly) when the buffet was closed, as no one else wanted to sit in them, so you could have that half a coach to yourself, with a window slid open and listen to the motors.....that's sad...

The pole in a RKB was to be treasured on nights like these!

Quite so. We could speak of 'poles' and certain London venue's, but that's not for here...

 

[nw1]

Correct. Usually three or four (peak time) consecutive departures at minimal two minute intervals, then one (or two) three minute gaps, then back to two minute again, just to give some reliability in the plan.

That would probably explain a few of the stoppers departing at xxx8 rather than xxx6. There didn't seem to be any 3-min gaps, just 4-min gaps (so everything departed on an even minute).

In 1983, according to the WTT, with a bit of memory thrown in, the longest continuous 2-min run appeared to be from 1730 to 1744. In fact the only gap from 1730 to 1802 was at 1746:

1730 Weymouth
1732 Portsmouth Direct
1734 Basingstoke and Alton (interesting stock formation, 12HAP which split at Woking)
1736 Farnham stopper
1738 Exeter FO/Plymouth FX
1740 Portsmouth Direct
1742 Cobham line
1744 Bournemouth
1746 GAP
1748 Guildford via Woking stopper
1750 Portsmouth Direct
1752 Cobham line
1754 Eastleigh
1756 Farnham stopper
1758 Alton
1800 Portsmouth Direct
1802 Cobham line

Correct. Usually three or four (peak time) consecutive departures at minimal two minute intervals, then one (or two) three minute gaps, then back to two minute again, just to give some reliability in the plan.

Used those myself even (particularly) when the buffet was closed, as no one else wanted to sit in them, so you could have that half a coach to yourself, with a window slid open and listen to the motors.....that's sad...

REPs and TCs were examples of those classes I saw much more frequently than I actually used (see also: EPBs). Just one ride on a REP or TC, IIRC: 21 June 1986 from Brockenhurst to Woking, on the Network Day.

 

[Big Jumby 74]

REPs and TCs were examples of those classes I saw much more frequently than I actually used (see also: EPBs). Just one ride on a REP or TC, IIRC: 21 June 1986 from Brockenhurst to Woking, on the Network Day

Sadly you missed out. The climb out of Bournemouth on the UP with only one TC in tow, could make for a spirited run. Have a few such memories lurking in the (my) misty memory...!

As for Waterloo departures, it has to also be remembered that every few minutes there would be an arrival off the UMF, and (for averages sake lets say) a quarter of these would need to cross the bows of departing services to gain a lower numbered arrival platform (otherwise 'one' eventually runs out of platforms to use for incoming trains!). This conflicting crossing margin was historically three minutes, which also (in theory) included an allowance for the signalman to reset the road, but in more recent times this margin was increased to four minutes for main line services, which has even more recently (2017 rebuild of suburban platforms) been the norm on the Main suburban side as well (AFAIK), specifically when inbound UMSL trains now cross to the DMSL West of Westminster Bridge instead of the old set up where such moves were made just off the platform ends.

 

[nw1]

Sadly you missed out. The climb out of Bournemouth on the UP with only one TC in tow, could make for a spirited run. Have a few such memories lurking in the (my) misty memory...!

As for Waterloo departures, it has to also be remembered that every few minutes there would be an arrival off the UMF, and (for averages sake lets say) a quarter of these would need to cross the bows of departing services to gain a lower numbered arrival platform (otherwise 'one' eventually runs out of platforms to use for incoming trains!). This conflicting crossing margin was historically three minutes, which also (in theory) included an allowance for the signalman to reset the road, but in more recent times this margin was increased to four minutes for main line services, which has even more recently (2017 rebuild of suburban platforms) been the norm on the Main suburban side as well (AFAIK), specifically when inbound UMSL trains now cross to the DMSL West of Westminster Bridge instead of the old set up where such moves were made just off the platform ends.

That makes sense. I wonder if, at any stage, a small number of inner suburban services immediately before the peak were formed of mainline stock, to reduce the conflicts? For example, an 8VEP comes out of the yard for an out-and-back inner-suburban trip departing Waterloo around 1530 to 1600. The stock could then access the low-numbered mainline platforms for a mainline peak departure without any conflicting moves.

 

[route101]

When I was younger, I used to travel regularly on the London to Southampton line and I remember the line speeds being much higher. Trying to eat in the restaurant car going through Clapham Junction was a challenge and I remember 90 mph signs at New Malden and going through Basingstoke on the new 4reps flat out. Could anyone tell me when the speeds were cut please? I imagine it was on Health and Safety grounds?

What service had a restaurant car SWML?

 

[Snow1964]

What service had a restaurant car SWML?

The Weymouth services as far as Bournemouth, and handful of semi-fasts, although I only remember them in 1970s as buffet and bars, but freestanding seats were still there

 

[jfollows]

London-Southampton public timetable for 1974 attached which shows catering services available.

 

[Snow1964]

Sadly you missed out. The climb out of Bournemouth on the UP with only one TC in tow, could make for a spirited run. Have a few such memories lurking in the (my) misty memory...!

I have been on a single 4REP from Bournemouth (no TCs due to disruption), that was a lively run.

The other interesting one used to be the first up train on very frosty morning through New Forest, pick up shoes would crackle and flash continuously, sit in front coach and get few minutes of lighting up pitch black from Brockenhurst to near Beaulieu Road

 

[Taunton]

The 2+1 loose seats in the kitchen buffet vehicle were the same as in their original loco-hauled form before conversion to the REPs, this was a common arrangement in 1950s Mk1 refreshment vehicles. However, I believe (never having been in the train when a full restaurant service was in hand) that the nearer four bays in the adjacent Motor Open Second, fixed seats of course, were the ones laid up for full meals, if so provided and staffed, and the waiters worked through the gangways to the adjacent kitchen. The seating area in the buffet was for more casual refreshments from the buffet counter. This does lead to a seeming contradiction that full meals were served at four-a-side tables, while odd drinks etc could be had in the more spacious three-a-side buffet seating area. It did mean that the seats for meals did not get wasted when restaurant service was not in hand.

I seem to recall the catering vehicle was branded 'Buffet', but where the meals might be served had no branding of 'Restaurant', unlike restaurant cars elsewhere, some of which were 'Restaurant Buffet'. It seemed the provision of full restaurant staffing and service steadily fell away over time, possibly inconsistent with what the timetable offered.

For those too youthful to remember, serving restaurant meals through the gangway from the kitchen in the next coach was pretty standard on all such BR trains, although more commonly on loco services it was into a first class coach with only three-a-side seating.

The loose chairs always seemed a bit of a hazard in a railway vehicle. Given that a REP was the front colliding unit in the Clapham accident, and the buffet vehicle, although the counter was closed and unstaffed, was apparently one of those most destroyed, one is concerned for what might have occurred in there.

 

[Big Jumby 74]

Just as an add on to the REP story, the plan was normally for them to run 'the correct way round' (in themselves), whereby the buffet car (TRB) was the 3rd coach from London end, the Brake First being in position 2, keeping the tradition of having the first class on main line trains nearest the exits at Waterloo on stock where this was at one end of a unit type. But as the last few years passed, particularly once the 442 associated REP reforms started, this practice was effectively abandoned.

 

[Rescars]

The 2+1 loose seats in the kitchen buffet vehicle were the same as in their original loco-hauled form before conversion to the REPs, this was a common arrangement in 1950s Mk1 refreshment vehicles. However, I believe (never having been in the train when a full restaurant service was in hand) that the nearer four bays in the adjacent Motor Open Second, fixed seats of course, were the ones laid up for full meals, if so provided and staffed, and the waiters worked through the gangways to the adjacent kitchen. The seating area in the buffet was for more casual refreshments from the buffet counter. This does lead to a seeming contradiction that full meals were served at four-a-side tables, while odd drinks etc could be had in the more spacious three-a-side buffet seating area. It did mean that the seats for meals did not get wasted when restaurant service was not in hand.

I seem to recall the catering vehicle was branded 'Buffet', but where the meals might be served had no branding of 'Restaurant', unlike restaurant cars elsewhere, some of which were 'Restaurant Buffet'. It seemed the provision of full restaurant staffing and service steadily fell away over time, possibly inconsistent with what the timetable offered.

For those too youthful to remember, serving restaurant meals through the gangway from the kitchen in the next coach was pretty standard on all such BR trains, although more commonly on loco services it was into a first class coach with only three-a-side seating.

The loose chairs always seemed a bit of a hazard in a railway vehicle. Given that a REP was the front colliding unit in the Clapham accident, and the buffet vehicle, although the counter was closed and unstaffed, was apparently one of those most destroyed, one is concerned for what might have occurred in there.

Loose chairs had a long history in catering settings and were quite a feature in some Pullman cars.

Serving meals into the adjacent saloon was a lot more straightforward than srewards having to negotiate a path around buffet counter customers with plates of food intended for other people. Four across seating in saloons worked well enough with Mark 1 stock. The trapezoidal tables in Mark 2s were much trickier when it came to finding space for formal place settings.

 

[nw1]

London-Southampton public timetable for 1974 attached which shows catering services available.

Thanks for that, fascinating insight into an era almost 10 years before I started using the trains, and nicely complements the Tables 156 and 166 from the same year you sent me

Interesting that the Weymouth, Bournemouth and Exeters all had restaurant facilities in 1974. By 1982, none did, though the former two had a hot buffet and the latter, a cold buffet.

Aside from that though, the Mon-Sat off-peak is almost identical to that prevailing in the early-mid 80s. The peak is significantly different though, as I have observed before: I believe there was a big change in 1977. In particular there was just a half-hourly stopping service down the SWML in the evening peak, vs. every 20 minutes in the 80s. The morning peak, for whatever reason, had a much more frequent service, though.

Another interesting feature is how the Mon-Sat off-peak pattern also applied on Sundays. This had also gone by the 80s, likely a symptom of cost-cutting. The notion of a 7-day-a-week base timetable has never really been re-adopted in recent times, though seems to be commonplace on the continent.

A particularly interesting observation is the hot buffet on the 1342 Bournemouth stopper (the '93'). There seems to be no balancing hot buffet on the inbound working, or the up working later in the day, so wondering if this was an error? The standard stock for these services was 8VEP (half down the SWML, half down to Alton) so a buffet would be unusual. Possible, for whatever reason, a BIG came up the Portsmouth Direct then down to Bournemouth?

 

[Rescars]

Thanks for that, fascinating insight into an era almost 10 years before I started using the trains, and nicely complements the Tables 156 and 166 from the same year you sent me

Interesting that the Weymouth, Bournemouth and Exeters all had restaurant facilities in 1974. By 1982, none did, though the former two had a hot buffet and the latter, a cold buffet.

Aside from that though, the Mon-Sat off-peak is almost identical to that prevailing in the early-mid 80s. The peak is significantly different though, as I have observed before: I believe there was a big change in 1977. In particular there was just a half-hourly stopping service down the SWML in the evening peak, vs. every 20 minutes in the 80s. The morning peak, for whatever reason, had a much more frequent service, though.

Another interesting feature is how the Mon-Sat off-peak pattern also applied on Sundays. This had also gone by the 80s, likely a symptom of cost-cutting. The notion of a 7-day-a-week base timetable has never really been re-adopted in recent times, though seems to be commonplace on the continent.

A particularly interesting observation is the hot buffet on the 1342 Bournemouth stopper (the '93'). There seems to be no balancing hot buffet on the inbound working, or the up working later in the day, so wondering if this was an error? The standard stock for these services was 8VEP (half down the SWML, half down to Alton) so a buffet would be unusual. Possible, for whatever reason, a BIG came up the Portsmouth Direct then down to Bournemouth?

The difference between a hot and cold buffet probably reflects a saving in staff. A hot buffet would have required a Chief Steward and a Steward/Cook. A cold buffet would normally have been worked by a solitary Chief Steward.

 

[HamworthyGoods]

The loose chairs always seemed a bit of a hazard in a railway vehicle. Given that a REP was the front colliding unit in the Clapham accident, and the buffet vehicle, although the counter was closed and unstaffed, was apparently one of those most destroyed, one is concerned for what might have occurred in there.

Sadly these did indeed become flying missiles at Clapham.

The buffet steward on the Bournemouth Line train involved had a potentially lucky escape that morning, they had overslept and missed their train, hence the buffet counter being closed.