The OPC

[185]

Well this is a new one on me.

For many, many years, the mythical shadowy testing and assessment organisation the OPC was the stuff of Railway legend. Many of us recognise their name from the old assessment papers for a variety of jobs ranging from guard, dispatcher, gateline, booking office, to driver - they've wrote most of the assessments for those jobs.

Did they really exist? Do they wear secret agent outfits? Are they psychologists in white coats who take away railway staff who have "gone to plaid" to some rehabilitation camp?

Well, today I met them. One train company is directly hiring them to run their assessment testing - which I consider a good and exceptionally impartial move.

Whilst some companies assessments have become sloppy and seriously open to abuse (ie Northern, everything done online, get yer mate to do the SHL/CEB assessments) ...for me it is good that an old-style, reasonable standard of testing is ensuring solely the best candidates who have prepared get through and cheating gets the boot.

 

[TheAlbanach_]

Wasn't impressed when i met them. Had a structured interview with them, that didn't go well. Still don't see the need for them, a few other people i know who would make excellent train guards also failed the structured interview.

 

[choochoochoo]

Wasn't impressed when i met them. Had a structured interview with them, that didn't go well. Still don't see the need for them, a few other people i know who would make excellent train guards also failed the structured interview.

Have to agree. They seem a bit too removed from the railway to know what makes a good driver.

 

[TheAlbanach_]

Have to agree. They seem a bit too removed from the railway to know what makes a good driver.

Yeah, one question I got asked... 'If you worked in a shop selling TVs, how would you do it?' Genuinely no relevance to being a guard.

 

[OneLowban]

I thought it wouldn’t necessarily be the relevance to that job role specifically, but they must use your answers to determine which sort of person you are likely to be in a certain situation.

I haven’t got a clue why/how but there must be a reason behind it.

 

[wickedhigh]

Hi, i recently passed my OPC to national level but not enhanced level on one thing, does this count as 1 fail or not?

TIA

 

[martin2345uk]

Hi, i recently passed my OPC to national level but not enhanced level on one thing, does this count as 1 fail or not?

TIA

No. It doesn’t.

 

[Cyclist]

Careful what you say here. The OPC are known to read these boards :-P

I think the overall idea of using the OPC is excellent but it does create a lot of confusion with issues like: how many lives you have, enhanced scores, period scores are valid, additional tests being added by TOCs.

 

[choochoochoo]

Careful what you say here. The OPC are known to read these boards :-P

I think the overall idea of using the OPC is excellent but it does create a lot of confusion with issues like: how many lives you have, enhanced scores, period scores are valid, additional tests being added by TOCs.

They should have no problem with feedback when they read this board.

But does a fresh psychology graduate really know what makes a good train driver by following a proforma on how the interviewee responds to their questions.

Also I still think OPC can have conflict of interest . It's not beneficial for them to pass everyone. They make money by doing assessments. The more they assess the more money they make. So the cynic/accountant in me thinks they must have a fail quota they must meet to up profitability.

And I've never heard of them being regulated or observed by an independent body whilst doing assessments. So we've only got their word that it's standardised and fair.

 

[Westcoast-ting]

My dealings with the OPC are that individually and as a group they really helpful.

That being said there MMI average for the day when I did my assessment was 60%, from my research a industry average for the MMI is over 97 %.

 

[Cyclist]

My dealings with the OPC are that individually and as a group they really helpful.

That being said there MMI average for the day when I did my assessment was 60%, from my research a industry average for the MMI is over 97 %.

Are you quoting a pass rate there or what?

 

[Warwick]

OPC? Do tell.

 

[Westcoast-ting]

Are you quoting a pass rate there or what?

Talking to the company I work for they quoted 60 % pass rate for MMI alone on the day. My research shows much higher pass rate with other tocs.

My company said they expected a higher pass rate especially as it was people already with the relevant experience.

I have no sour grapes if had had used the information I had gained better prior to the MMI I wouldn’t have changed my answer and probably passed it.

 

[DanDaDriver]

Yes they do know what makes a ‘good’ train driver, or at least they type of driver the F/TOC’s want.

See this time and time again with ‘enthusiasts.’

It doesn’t matter if you can name the drive train of every single BR DMU since 1967. It doesn’t matter if you have practiced a route really really hard on train simulator. It doesn’t matter if you have downloaded to rulebook and read it or ‘have a mate,’ who is a driver.

That’s not what they’re after. They’ll teach you to drive. They’ll teach you traction, any fool can learn those.

What they’re after is someone level headed who will literally be a happy tool and do as they are told.

You’re not going to be some sort of square jawed, steely eyed God of the 4ft.

You’re not paid to think you’re paid to do as you are told and if no-one is there to tell you what to do then you default to the rule book.

You can’t move a train an inch without someone else’s say so. Signaller, shunter, guard, platform staff. (Not going into DOO here)

They want people who can follow rules, that’s why they don’t just ask if you’ve copped all the 56’s for sight and give you a key if you say yes.

 

[TheAlbanach_]

Yes they do know what makes a ‘good’ train driver, or at least they type of driver the F/TOC’s want.

See this time and time again with ‘enthusiasts.’

It doesn’t matter if you can name the drive train of every single BR DMU since 1967. It doesn’t matter if you have practiced a route really really hard on train simulator. It doesn’t matter if you have downloaded to rulebook and read it or ‘have a mate,’ who is a driver.

That’s not what they’re after. They’ll teach you to drive. They’ll teach you traction, any fool can learn those.

What they’re after is someone level headed who will literally be a happy tool and do as they are told.

You’re not going to be some sort of square jawed, steely eyed God of the 4ft.

You’re not paid to think you’re paid to do as you are told and if no-one is there to tell you what to do then you default to the rule book.

You can’t move a train an inch without someone else’s say so. Signaller, shunter, guard, platform staff. (Not going into DOO here)

They want people who can follow rules, that’s why they don’t just ask if you’ve copped all the 56’s for sight and give you a key if you say yes.

The other people that I know, and me that passed all other tests but failed the structured interview are already safety critical. Have had years of experience the industry too.

I've been for ages trying to work out the point of this stupid interview, and yet I can't. No one can give me answers.

 

[Dynamonic]

From a driving perspective, I failed my first attempt at the OPC's MMI, got valuable feedback, and went on to pass my second attempt a few years later!
After my first attempt, not once did I feel the need to place the blame on anyone or the process. I just accepted that I wasn't ready yet. I then worked on getting the experience I needed to be able to better answer their questions on my second attempt.
My experience with OPC assessors is that they are people who really want you to be successful. At my most recent Stage 2, they even arranged food for us candidates, so they really looked after us.
In both my interviews, the interviewer was professional, polite and tried to steer the interview in a direction that would get the best out of me. In the other tests, they made sure that everyone knew what was expected of them before the test began.
Personally, I think the OPC do a great job, ensuring that everyone gets a fair shot at the role they are after, with standards that are consistent across the whole industry.

In terms of pass rates for the MMI, I understand that it can be influenced by the MMI's position in the recruitment process. If you sit your MMI after your Driver Manager Interview, you're more likely to pass the MMI (as you would have demonstrated the necessary competencies already to pass the DMI).

 

[DanDaDriver]

The other people that I know, and me that passed all other tests but failed the structured interview are already safety critical. Have had years of experience the industry too.

I've been for ages trying to work out the point of this stupid interview, and yet I can't. No one can give me answers.

It’s all a massive conspiracy to keep people who would be amazing drivers out of the grade...

 

[TheAlbanach_]

It’s all a massive conspiracy to keep people who would be amazing drivers out of the grade...

Did I say it was? Just saying I do not see the point of these interviews. The concentration tests, role play and the others all made sense. But these just don't, to me anyway.

 

[OpsWeb]

The OPC were spun off from British Rail. They still "own" the rights and trade marks to some of the aptitude tests such as SCAAT and TRP 1/2.

I think at one point they ran the industry "candidate database" of who took the tests and what their pass marks were.

Incidentally Southeastern own the rights to the Group Bourdon (dots) test, and still supply all the other TOC's with the papers.

 

[Monty]

I did an assessment day for London Overground many moons ago when Overground still had conductors. Had to go to the OPC's centre in Watford, probably one of the most intense assessment and interview processes I had ever been too. I was offered the job but by then I could see the writing was on the wall for conductors there and took up an offer with SWT whom I was already working for at the time.

 

[Cyclist]

The OPC were spun off from British Rail. They still "own" the rights and trade marks to some of the aptitude tests such as SCAAT and TRP 1/2.

I think at one point they ran the industry "candidate database" of who took the tests and what their pass marks were.

Incidentally Southeastern own the rights to the Group Bourdon (dots) test, and still supply all the other TOC's with the papers.

Do you know who “owns” TEA-OCC?

 

[OpsWeb]

Do you know who “owns” TEA-OCC?

 

[Cyclist]

View attachment 47730

Are you quoting a public document? link if so

 

[OpsWeb]

Google it. It took me 30 seconds to find and screenshot it.

Are you quoting a public document? link if so

 

[GB]

From a driving perspective, I failed my first attempt at the OPC's MMI, got valuable feedback, and went on to pass my second attempt a few years later!

Thats good, but also reinforces my opinion that the CBI (and now MMI) should not be part of the "lives". The other tests you can argue that you either have what it takes or you don't, but the interview is all about experiences and how you put that information across. Both of which can be developed over time.

 

[uww11x]

Yes they do know what makes a ‘good’ train driver, or at least they type of driver the F/TOC’s want.

See this time and time again with ‘enthusiasts.’

It doesn’t matter if you can name the drive train of every single BR DMU since 1967. It doesn’t matter if you have practiced a route really really hard on train simulator. It doesn’t matter if you have downloaded to rulebook and read it or ‘have a mate,’ who is a driver.

That’s not what they’re after. They’ll teach you to drive. They’ll teach you traction, any fool can learn those.

What they’re after is someone level headed who will literally be a happy tool and do as they are told.

You’re not going to be some sort of square jawed, steely eyed God of the 4ft.

You’re not paid to think you’re paid to do as you are told and if no-one is there to tell you what to do then you default to the rule book.

You can’t move a train an inch without someone else’s say so. Signaller, shunter, guard, platform staff. (Not going into DOO here)

They want people who can follow rules, that’s why they don’t just ask if you’ve copped all the 56’s for sight and give you a key if you say yes.

Arrogant

 

[DanDaDriver]

Arrogant

Sorry you feel that way. I’ve put it much more politely than a lot of the Ex-BR old boys would. Get through the assessments, get a job, pass out and you can be arrogant too

 

[Woody1234]

I've got my MMI next week, I'm really nervous about it now with reading some of the threads. What advice can people please give me in relation to it. I'm currently in the police and have jotted down a few examples but unsure what they are looking for.
Cheers

 

[FManc]

So I've sat both the MMI and most recently the CBI. My experience of both was extremely positive - they were nothing but helpful and I got the feeling they wanted us to succeed. In both interviews, they promoted me where necessary and probed where they needed certain info.

My advice for the MMI is to make sure you supply detail, detail and more detail! During my CBI I wasn't promoted that often for more info as I had gone into enough depth already. I guess just make sure your answers are relevant and focus only on what you did! Not others. My examples were fairly simple but met the criteria - i didn't want to bog them down with complicated sceneiroes!

 

[Teddyward]

I've got my MMI next week, I'm really nervous about it now with reading some of the threads. What advice can people please give me in relation to it. I'm currently in the police and have jotted down a few examples but unsure what they are looking for.
Cheers

I used an rtc/ car on fire for emergency and stop & search for rules & procedures. Crime scene for long boring work alone. Plenty to choose from.