Theoretically useful extensions to regional train services

[Sad Sprinter]

I say theoretically, because this assumes that such a service would be usful but not possible due to path conflicts/capacity.

Are there any regional train services that could be extended or combined to provide a longer and thus more important rail service? Many probably come to mind, however one that sticks out is extending the North Downs service to Brighton. This would not only provide a better service from Redhill to Brighton, but also to large centres such as Guildford and Reading. Something that obviously can't happen due to capacity constraints south of Gatwick.

 

[Ianno87]

Some way of fusing a Cambridge portion / diversion onto the current Norwich-Nottingham-Liverpool service.

Coventry-Nuneaton-Leicester (that old chestnut)

Chase Line extension to Stafford.

Stoke to Liverpool / Manchester Airport

Bolton to Liverpool (joined up across Wigan)

 

[Whistler40145]

I say theoretically, because this assumes that such a service would be usful but not possible due to path conflicts/capacity.

Are there any regional train services that could be extended or combined to provide a longer and thus more important rail service? Many probably come to mind, however one that sticks out is extending the North Downs service to Brighton. This would not only provide a better service from Redhill to Brighton, but also to large centres such as Guildford and Reading. Something that obviously can't happen due to capacity constraints south of Gatwick.

That sounds like a possibility, only query I have is using a 165/166, could they attain max speed between Redhill and Brighton?

 

[JonathanH]

That sounds like a possibility, only query I have is using a 165/166, could they attain max speed between Redhill and Brighton?

Doesn't really matter if 769s are going to replace them in the near future. Mind you, a 769 isn't going to have the same performance as a 377 / 700.

 

[xotGD]

Leeds - Carlisle services could start back at Nottingham and run through to Glasgow.

 

[Whistler40145]

Leeds - Carlisle services could start back at Nottingham and run through to Glasgow.

Would they operate via Kilmarnock in the current ScotRail paths?

 

[The Planner]

Leeds - Carlisle services could start back at Nottingham and run through to Glasgow.

You will catch a few with that bait.

 

[NorthOxonian]

A direct Oxford (or Banbury) - Bristol service would be nice, and has been proposed a few times. I believe the issue there is lack of paths between Didcot and Swindon.

 

[fishwomp]

A direct Oxford (or Banbury) - Bristol service would be nice, and has been proposed a few times. I believe the issue there is lack of paths between Didcot and Swindon.

That did exist - early 00s, 2 or 3 car turbo, most services reversed at Didcot but it was canned. It was never hugely popular, because it's easy enough to change at Didcot. With the increase in frequency of the London-Bristol/Wales, this service would presumably not be possible now.

 

[David Goddard]

Some way of fusing a Cambridge portion / diversion onto the current Norwich-Nottingham-Liverpool service.

Plus the extension of certain trains to Great Yarmouth, not just summer Saturdays.

 

[Iskra]

Leeds - Carlisle services could start back at Nottingham and run through to Glasgow.

As much as that’s a nice thing to have and it could provide a faster Leeds-Glasgow journey, it’s not that easy to accomodate at Leeds. Unless you run it via Westgate to make things a little easier.

My previous post was deleted so I’ll say again: extend Morecambe/Lancaster trains back to Leeds now commuting is less of a thing meaning more slack on the Aire Valley to re-establish the age old direct journey opportunities.

 

[Ianno87]

As much as that’s a nice thing to have and it could provide a faster Leeds-Glasgow journey, it’s not that easy to accomodate at Leeds. Unless you run it via Westgate to make things a little easier.

My previous post was deleted so I’ll say again: extend Morecambe/Lancaster trains back to Leeds now commuting is less of a thing meaning more slack on the Aire Valley to re-establish the age old direct journey opportunities.

Leeds will remain a huge draw for shopping, threatre, bars etc etc. Much more than Lancaster/Morecambe for Aire Valley dwellers.

 

[Iskra]

Leeds will remain a huge draw for shopping, threatre, bars etc etc. Much more than Lancaster/Morecambe for Aire Valley dwellers.

Yes. I’m suggesting the people of Lancaster/Morecambe may wish to travel to Leeds, without the newly established hindrance of changing at Skipton. Morecambe is if course a traditional seaside destination of Bradford.

 

[xotGD]

As much as that’s a nice thing to have and it could provide a faster Leeds-Glasgow journey, it’s not that easy to accomodate at Leeds. Unless you run it via Westgate to make things a little easier.

Running via Westgate is already planned to happen, isn't it?

I'd also rather see the service run via the main line north of Carlisle. Bimode stock; also on the juice from Wakefield to Skipton.

 

[Iskra]

Running via Westgate is already planned to happen, isn't it?

I'd also rather see the service run via the main line north of Carlisle. Bimode stock; also on the juice from Wakefield to Skipton.

It is, whether it’s still happening I don’t know anymore. The traditional route has always been via Barnsley, if so it would have to do Kirkgate and then Westgate to reduce the complexity of crossing the station throat at Leeds.

I totally agree, bi-modes are a fantastic opportunity for this kind of route.

 

[4-SUB 4732]

The best thing for the S&C is a two-hourly ‘fast’ service from Leeds to Carlisle with suitable connections. Use the other hour for a Lancaster; and then flight a Carlisle slow in about 20 minutes behind the fast one starting from Skipton.

I don’t see Northern Connect wanting to extend anything from the Carlisle route towards Nottingham. It’s a nice idea but better connections would do the trick, really. The punctuality risk from one getting caught in wire troubles on the Airedale, or stuck behind a freight, etc, would be too great. Same in reverse, with Leeds folk having to wait for something to come from Notts just to then sit on a late-runner all the way to Carlisle and miss their connection to Scotland.

 

[HST43257]

A direct Oxford (or Banbury) - Bristol service would be nice, and has been proposed a few times. I believe the issue there is lack of paths between Didcot and Swindon.

I’d quite like Oxford to Cardiff and Bristol services as East West Rail expresses, running through to Ipswich (or even Colchester maybe) and Norwich.

 

[YorksLad12]

The best thing for the S&C is a two-hourly ‘fast’ service from Leeds to Carlisle with suitable connections. Use the other hour for a Lancaster; and then flight a Carlisle slow in about 20 minutes behind the fast one starting from Skipton.

I don’t see Northern Connect wanting to extend anything from the Carlisle route towards Nottingham. It’s a nice idea but better connections would do the trick, really. The punctuality risk from one getting caught in wire troubles on the Airedale, or stuck behind a freight, etc, would be too great. Same in reverse, with Leeds folk having to wait for something to come from Notts just to then sit on a late-runner all the way to Carlisle and miss their connection to Scotland.

Not that nice an idea, given the things that wouldn't be able to happen west of Leeds while the unit trundled in or out across half (or all) of the station. If you were passing through the station to a link connecting the Neville Hill area with the Midland line near Rothwell/M1 J44, then possibly.

Now: if you'd suggested re-opening Leeds (Whitehall Road) so that trains didn't have to reverse...

 

[30907]

My previous post was deleted so I’ll say again: extend Morecambe/Lancaster trains back to Leeds now commuting is less of a thing meaning more slack on the Aire Valley to re-establish the age old direct journey opportunities.

Yes, but I thought the OP was asking about new routes, not reversing temporary Covid cuts?

Back on topic: Crewe-Derby (re-) extended to Nottingham? I suppose there is a capacity issue though?

 

[Whistler40145]

Yes, but I thought the OP was asking about new routes, not reversing temporary Covid cuts?

Back on topic: Crewe-Derby (re-) extended to Nottingham? I suppose there is a capacity issue though?

Might be far more logistical to extend the Crewe-Derby through to Matlock

 

[NoMorePacers]

Extending the Doncaster-Scunthorpe stopper to run through to Cleethorpes in order to give Grimsby and Cleethorpes a second train an hour to the ECML.

 

[Ianno87]

Might be far more logistical to extend the Crewe-Derby through to Matlock

Nottingham is by far a bigger draw from either of Matlock or Crewe/Stoke than Matlock/Stoke are to each other.

 

[Whistler40145]

Nottingham is by far a bigger draw from either of Matlock or Crewe/Stoke than Matlock/Stoke are to each other.

My thoughts were more with available paths between Derby and Nottingham

 

[Tomos y Tanc]

It would be nice if more of the long distance Manchester sevices that terminate in Picadilly continued on to Manchester Airport.

 

[4-SUB 4732]

It would be nice if more of the long distance Manchester sevices that terminate in Picadilly continued on to Manchester Airport.

Stacks of reversing movements that can go wrong...

My thoughts were more with available paths between Derby and Nottingham

But if you're going to have more trains between Derby and Notts, it makes sense for the Matlock to Crewe trains (and vice versa), keep them in Platform 1 and 2 going each way in straight-line movements, same for the Cross Country stuff. Better to let the Norwich trains go to Derby, and the Newark Castle jobs, and the Cross Country 170s and have a good frequency of connections.

 

[Iskra]

Yes, but I thought the OP was asking about new routes, not reversing temporary Covid cuts?

Back on topic: Crewe-Derby (re-) extended to Nottingham? I suppose there is a capacity issue though?

I didn't think it was a Covid cut...

 

[Ianno87]

I'll chuck in King's Cross - Cambridge - Ely - Brandon - Thetford - Norwich to the discussion.

 

[4-SUB 4732]

I'll chuck in King's Cross - Cambridge - Ely - Brandon - Thetford - Norwich to the discussion.

Sensible rolling stock?

 

[Ianno87]

Sensible rolling stock?

Isn't this a theoretical discussion?

 

[4-SUB 4732]

Isn't this a theoretical discussion?

"Are there any regional train services that could be extended or combined to provide a longer and thus more important rail service? Many probably come to mind, however one that sticks out is extending the North Downs service to Brighton. This would not only provide a better service from Redhill to Brighton, but also to large centres such as Guildford and Reading. Something that obviously can't happen due to capacity constraints south of Gatwick."

The OP's one assumes diesel stock can run on third rail (it can) and therefore could be extended in an ideal world. In your one, however, the thing that is missing is an obvious sensible rolling stock plan associated.