Ticket advice Clapham to Southampton 7th Nov.

[northernrail2009]

When i bought advance tickets from Crewe to London Euston the tube drivers made a date the 7th Nov a strike day so as i had to travel to Southampton i bought a ticket from Clapham Juc to Southampton and had planned to use the overground to get from Euston to Clapham but now the strike is off so can i use the ticket that starts from Clapham to Southampton from London Waterloo and make sure i am on the right train that i would had picked up from Clapham or do i need to buy a ticket from London Waterloo to Clapham and use the underground from Euston to Waterloo?

 

[Hadders]

What ticket are you using to get from Euston to Clapham Junction?

If you’re using Oyster/contactless you’ll need to touch out at Clapham Junction.

 

[northernrail2009]

I was going to use the tube from Euston to Waterloo then pick up the train from Waterloo that i would had picked up at Clapham to Southampton.

So need to know if i need to buy a ticket from Waterloo to Clapham as already got a ticket from Clapham to Southampton.

 

[Iggy12a]

What ticket did you buy from Clapham Junction to Southampton?

 

[MarlowDonkey]

So need to know if i need to buy a ticket from Waterloo to Clapham as already got a ticket from Clapham to Southampton.

if you don't you will be travelling without a ticket from Waterloo to Clapham. You most likely won't be allowed through the barriers at Waterloo anyway.

 

[jfollows]

I was going to use the tube from Euston to Waterloo then pick up the train from Waterloo that i would had picked up at Clapham to Southampton.

So need to know if i need to buy a ticket from Waterloo to Clapham as already got a ticket from Clapham to Southampton.

In which case you need a Waterloo-Clapham ticket, because to use contactless you’d have to get off at Clapham to touch out.

Train is probably pick-up only at Clapham Junction, so (if so) technically you can’t get on at Waterloo with a ticket to Clapham Junction. Whether this is a problem in reality, I don’t know.

 

[Belperpete]

You need to give exact details of the ticket you hold, but it is highly unlikely that your ticket from Clapham junction is valid for travel from Waterloo. In which case, you will need to pay for a journey from Euston to Clapham Junction. Probably best not to pay for separate journeys to Waterloo and then to Clapham Junction.

If you use Oyster or contactless for this, as others have stated, beware that you will need to touch out at Clapham, so will need to get an earlier train to Clapham, touch out, and then re-enter with your advance to catch your booked train.

The alternative is to get a ticket for Euston to Clapham Junction. This should allow you to travel to Waterloo and board your booked train there. But, as previous poster has noted, you need to check that your booked train is not pickup only at Clapham, or you could have trouble getting through the barriers at Waterloo. You will need to get this as a paper ticket, in order to get through the underground barriers, so probably best to either buy on line and collect at your local station or at Euston, or buy from your local booking office.

 

[redreni]

Just to reiterate: splitting tickets at Clapham Junction will only be valid if your intended train has an open call at Clapham Junction. If it's a restricted call (pickup-only) then a combination of single tickets with a split at Clapham Junction (e.g. ticket 1: London U1 to Clapham Junction; ticket 2: Clapham Junction to Southampton) would not be valid. It would also cost more than using PAYG to reach Clapham Junction.

I have no idea if it's possible to get an over-distance excess in this situation.

Given how frequent the service to Clapham Junction is, I would suggest using PAYG to get from Euston to Clapham Junction, touching out there and re-entering through the barrier with your ticket. You may even find it marginally quicker to go:

Euston > Victoria > Clapham Junction.

 

[Haywain]

If it's a restricted call (pickup-only) then a combination of single tickets with a split at Clapham Junction (e.g. ticket 1: London U1 to Clapham Junction; ticket 2: Clapham Junction to Southampton) would not be valid.

Citation please. Because that isn't what the National Rail Conditions of Travel says.

 

[redreni]

These are the parts I was thinking of. Happy to be corrected if it isn't so: it's rather a passenger-hostile rule.

14.2 NRCoT: Unless Condition 14.1 applies, you may use a combination of two or more Tickets to make a journey provided that the train services you use Call at the station(s) where you change from one Ticket to another.

Appendix B: Definitions In this contract: “Call” means a scheduled stop of a train service at a station that allows passengers to alight as well as board that train service at that station, as defined in the National Rail Timetable;

 

[Iggy12a]

If time permits I would suggest using PAYG to travel from Euston or Euston Square to West Brompton, tapping on the pink reader and continuing by Overground to Clapham Junction, and tapping out before continuing the pre-booked journey. Off peak this would be £2.80.

 

[Haywain]

These are the parts I was thinking of. Happy to be corrected if it isn't so: it's rather a passenger-hostile rule.

I suspect you are not looking at the April 2024 version which says “to alight and/or board”, which is a minor but very important difference. This is the information panel but it creates ambiguity which should go in favour of the passenger.

 

[MrJeeves]

I suspect you are not looking at the April 2024 version which says “to alight and/or board”, which is a minor but very important difference. This is the information panel but it creates ambiguity which should go in favour of the passenger.

Within a "non-binding" information block which also goes on to say immediately below the bit you quote...

If a combination of Tickets is 'split' at a station but that station Call is defined as for "pick-up only" in the National Rail Timetable and in journey planners, then the Ticket held to that station is not valid; likewise, if that station call is defined as for "set-down only" in the National Rail Timetable and in journey planners, then the Ticket held from that station is not valid.

 

[Haywain]

Within a "non-binding" information block which also goes on to say immediately below the bit you quote...

They’re going full on for ambiguity there, aren’t they?!!

 

[redreni]

They’re going full on for ambiguity there, aren’t they?!!

Absolutely!

I must admit I hadn't spotted the "and/or" which, from their point of view, absolutely needed to be an "and"! Something is seriously awry with the proofreading of these things!

The trouble is, the boxes are expressed to be explanatory and non-binding, and the actual provision is clear once you look up "Call" in the glossary.

As such I can see why they thought an explanatory note would be helpful there, so that the reader doesn't read the word "Call" as having its natural meaning rather than the technical meaning they have given it (which you have to look up). It's just a shame they can't write an explanatory note to save their lives!

I note they've also increased the scope for misunderstanding regarding non-stop splits by removing "unless 14.3 applies" from 14.2.

It's still clear enough that there are two different routes to validity for a combination of two or more tickets (under 14.2 or under 14.3), but possibly makes it even harder to argue with staff who read 14.2 and wrongly decide your combination isn't valid.

 

[Hadders]

If time permits I would suggest using PAYG to travel from Euston or Euston Square to West Brompton, tapping on the pink reader and continuing by Overground to Clapham Junction, and tapping out before continuing the pre-booked journey. Off peak this would be £2.80.

That would be a very slow way of travelling between Euston and Clapham Junction, although saves £1.90.

I've not checked but I'd have thought the fastest way of travelling from Euston to Clapham Junction would be to take the Victoria Line to Vauxhall and change to SWR for a train to Clapham Junction.

 

[northernrail2009]

What ticket did you buy from Clapham Junction to Southampton?

A Advance with Southwestern trains.

Right what we are doing now is getting the tube from Euston to Victoria then southern service from Victoria to Clapham to then pick up the train that we are booked on from Clapham to Southampton.

so will tap in and out of the tube and have bought a ticket from Victoria to Clapham.

 

[miklcct]

A Advance with Southwestern trains.

Right what we are doing now is getting the tube from Euston to Victoria then southern service from Victoria to Clapham to then pick up the train that we are booked on from Clapham to Southampton.

so will tap in and out of the tube and have bought a ticket from Victoria to Clapham.

This will be more expensive than using PAYG all the way from Euston to Clapham Junction, as paper tickets are priced at a premium.

 

[Kite159]

If time permits I would suggest using PAYG to travel from Euston or Euston Square to West Brompton, tapping on the pink reader and continuing by Overground to Clapham Junction, and tapping out before continuing the pre-booked journey. Off peak this would be £2.80.

Wouldn't that take longer than using the Overground from Euston towards Willesden Junction and changing to a Clapham Junction service there?

 

[Haywain]

using PAYG to travel from Euston or Euston Square to West Brompton, tapping on the pink reader and continuing by Overground to Clapham Junction

The pink reader isn't necessary as that would qualify as the 'default' route.