Train ticket fine advice

[Brokenxcrown]

Hello everyone, earlier yesterday afternoon I boarded a train slough station onwards and before getting into the station the barriers were open so I walked through not putting any though to by a ticket.

Once I boarded the train ticket inspectors came on and once I noticed I didn’t purchased a physical ticket, I purchased a ticket on Trainline last minute before they approached me, they scanned my ticket and said to them that the ticket had been purchased on the spot to me presenting it to them which lead them to think I didn’t have a ticket at all.

I was honest and told them I just paid for it on board and not before boarding so they ticket fined me and suggested I should appeal the matter considering I did purchase a ticket.

I’m not sure how to appeal this or what reasons I could give to the ticket offices that I didn’t intend to not board the train without purchasing tickets.

Any advice would be appreciated thanks.

 

[notmyrealname]

Hi.

Were you given any paperwork yesterday? If so, please could you post it here so we can see what's involved. Cover up your name, address and any reference numbers that are on there.

 

[Titfield]

Firstly whilst it appears to you that you have been fined that is not the case. Only a court can issue a fine. It sounds as if you have been issued a penalty fare.

Secondly it is an offence to board a train without a valid ticket except in a small number of circumstances that are unlikely to apply at Slough. (No ticket office / ticket office closed, no working ticket machine).NB the train was about to leave, there was a queue at the ticket office are not considered valid reasons for not paying before boarding.

Unless the penalty fare notice was incorrectly issued or the signage relating to penalty fares at Slough was incorrectly worded you do not have any valid grounds for an appeal.

Subject to you uploading the paperwork to this forum so it can be checked, you are probably best advised to pay the penalty fare and consider it a lesson learned.

Regrettably and somewhat misleadingly, ticket inspectors often suggest appealing as a means of avoiding confrontation / a situation escalating even though in the circumstances an appeal is very unlikely to be successful.

 

[Brokenxcrown]

Hi.

Were you given any paperwork yesterday? If so, please could you post it here so we can see what's involved. Cover up your name, address and any reference numbers that are on there.

Yes I was given a penalty fair ticket printed to me given from the officer, I’ll attach a pic of the ticket to this reply

Firstly whilst it appears to you that you have been fined that is not the case. Only a court can issue a fine. It sounds as if you have been issued a penalty fare.

Secondly it is an offence to board a train without a valid ticket except in a small number of circumstances that are unlikely to apply at Slough. (No ticket office / ticket office closed, no working ticket machine).NB the train was about to leave, there was a queue at the ticket office are not considered valid reasons for not paying before boarding.

Unless the penalty fare notice was incorrectly issued or the signage relating to penalty fares at Slough was incorrectly worded you do not have any valid grounds for an appeal.

Subject to you uploading the paperwork to this forum so it can be checked, you are probably best advised to pay the penalty fare and consider it a lesson learned.

Regrettably and somewhat misleadingly, ticket inspectors often suggest appealing as a means of avoiding confrontation / a situation escalating even though in the circumstances an appeal is very unlikely to be successful.

Thanks for your response and yes the ticket offices were closed and when I brought that up to the inspectors they suggested I still should’ve purchased a ticket but besides that I mean if i don’t have grounds or argument to appeal this then it may just be best to pay this penalty fair and move on

 

[30907]

Thanks for your response and yes the ticket offices were closed and when I brought that up to the inspectors they suggested I still should’ve purchased a ticket but besides that I mean if i don’t have grounds or argument to appeal this then it may just be best to pay this penalty fair and move on

I would agree. I note that you aren't being asked to pay the fare on top of the £50.

 

[Titfield]

Paying when challenged (or perhaps better described as buying a ticket when the passenger realises there is a ticket inspector onboard or an exit block is in force) is common but the Ticket Inspectors self evidently can see the time a ticket was purchased.

My advice remains pay the £50 and see it as a lesson learned.

 

[AlterEgo]

Could you please post the full notice? The entire thing, all the text.

Also, can anyone else link to the Regulations applying to TfL Rail/Elizabeth Line? If this was on the "big railway" there are some arguments that would make the notice or the circumstances of its issue non compliant, but I am uncertain about TfL PFs.

 

[KirkstallOne]

Could you please post the full notice? The entire thing, all the text.

Also, can anyone else link to the Regulations applying to TfL Rail/Elizabeth Line? If this was on the "big railway" there are some arguments that would make the notice or the circumstances of its issue non compliant, but I am uncertain about TfL PFs.

I believe it is schedule 17 of the Greater London Authority Act 1999

https://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/1999/29/schedule/17

With some changes to the amounts in the Transport for London Act 2008

 

[AlterEgo]

I note this:

4(1)Subject to sub-paragraph (2) below, if a person travelling on a train service fails to produce a fare ticket or a general travel authority on being required to do so by an authorised person, he shall be liable to pay a penalty fare if required to do so by an authorised person.

The OP did produce a "fare ticket", but the interpretation of "being required to do so" is a bit vague.

 

[WesternLancer]

Yes I was given a penalty fair ticket printed to me given from the officer, I’ll attach a pic of the ticket to this reply


Thanks for your response and yes the ticket offices were closed and when I brought that up to the inspectors they suggested I still should’ve purchased a ticket but besides that I mean if i don’t have grounds or argument to appeal this then it may just be best to pay this penalty fair and move on

Even if the ticket office was closed you would have been expected to use a ticket vending machine before boarding the train. You are not required to buy on your phone, but you are required to buy before boarding.

 

[island]

I note this:



The OP did produce a "fare ticket", but the interpretation of "being required to do so" is a bit vague.

This might be a valid argument to defend/appeal the penalty fare on a technicality, but TfL would have a slam dunk byelaw/RoRA prosecution that they could bring instead, which would be a lot more expensive.

 

[KirkstallOne]

This might be a valid argument to defend/appeal the penalty fare on a technicality, but TfL would have a slam dunk byelaw/RoRA prosecution that they could bring instead, which would be a lot more expensive.

Yes good point, the restrictions on prosecution are significantly weaker in the linked schedule 17 than for the national railway regulations.