GWR Class 800

[Mikey C]

Finally had my first ride in one yesterday, though only a short electric only run (Paddington to Reading). No original observations, but seats rather hard and the interior really dull looking other than that strange stripe.

What surprised me actually was how many are now in service. From walking alongside the railway lines (between Goring and the Moulsford Bridge) in electric mode the 800s are naturally a lot quieter than the HSTs!

 

[Pete_uk]

I had a squeeky seat which felt like it had a screw pose in the top left at the wall side. I was in a unpowered carriage but there was still a bit of engine like noise. The ride was good but still feel like you feel the track more.

The engines ideling at Gloucester Platform 2 was not as loud as other units but still enough to drown out the to quite anouncements.

 

[Envoy]

As I understand it, the 3 centre coaches of the 5 car 800’s have diesel engines and the two at the ends have electric motors? What is the situation with the 9 coach sets? Why do the 5 coach trains have vinyl whilst the 9 coach trains have paint?

 

[387star]

Finally had my first ride in one yesterday, though only a short electric only run (Paddington to Reading). No original observations, but seats rather hard and the interior really dull looking other than that strange stripe.

What surprised me actually was how many are now in service. From walking alongside the railway lines (between Goring and the Moulsford Bridge) in electric mode the 800s are naturally a lot quieter than the HSTs!

That green stripe is the same shade on the livery on certain sections around the doors... on the units at least

Hoping to have my first 800 ride later

 

[sprinterguy]

As I understand it, the 3 centre coaches of the 5 car 800’s have diesel engines and the two at the ends have electric motors? What is the situation with the 9 coach sets? Why do the 5 coach trains have vinyl whilst the 9 coach trains have paint?

On the 5-car sets, the driving cars house pantographs and transformers, but have no motors. The three intermediate vehicles feature both the diesel engines and electric motors, which are fed from the driving cars when running on electric power.

On the 9-car sets, five of the intermediate vehicles incorporate diesel engines. These five plus one additional intermediate vehicle are fitted with motors which are all fed via the pantographs on the driving cars when running on electric power.

Class 800 5-car sets formed:
Driving Pantograph Trailer Kitchen First
Motor Composite (diesel engine)
Motor Standard (diesel engine)
Motor Standard (diesel engine)
Driving Pantograph Trailer Standard

Class 800 9-car sets formed:
Driving Pantograph Trailer Kitchen First
Motor First (diesel engine)
Motor Standard (diesel engine)
Trailer Standard
Motor Standard (diesel engine)
Motor Standard
Motor Standard (diesel engine)
Motor Standard (diesel engine)
Driving Pantograph Trailer Standard

 

[gwr4090]

Abandoned? Then please explain why, according to the current issue of Modern Railways, Porterbrook has just agreed a contract with Siemens to fit the GWR 387s with ETCS equipment. First train not due to be equipped until early 2020 but I don't think anyone would bother agreeing to spend money on such a project if GMWL ETCS had been abandoned. The IETs are already ready for ETCS.

Yes ABANDONED ! As far as I can determine, there now appears to be no current plan to fit ETCS on the GWML. Originally ETCS overlay on the GWML was to be the first main line fitment of ERTMS with complete replacement of the obsolete GWR-ATP between Paddington and Bristol by 2018. Indeed I am pretty sure that contracts were actually let for the work. Now the whole program has disappeared - apart from the Heathrow tunnels (where ETCS still doesn't work).

The current Digital strategy document has no mention of plans for the GWML signalling but merely states that some money is to be set aside to look into the possibility of a life extension for GWR-ATP. Is it not amazing that Class 387s etc are being allowed to run at 110 on the fast lines without the protection afforded by ATP or ETCS ?. This is not mentioned anywhere in the Railway press. There is evidently a cover-up ! I am told there are insufficient qualified engineers, and all the effort was put into the Thameslink tunnels instead. We need to know what is going on !

Incidentally the IETs on the GWML are NOT fitted with ETCS. The GWR-ATP has to be removed first ! And the latest Porterbrook activity is to get first of class certification for the Class 387. IT does not tie in well with timescales required for sorting out the HEX service.

 

[387star]

On a turbo to Oxford

Why not an 800?
Trolley on board which is interesting I'm a doo service

 

[Melancholia]

On a turbo to Oxford

Why not an 800?
Trolley on board which is interesting I'm a doo service

Oxford terminating 1Dxx are yet to switch to IET working, whilst driver training is in progress for Oxford based drivers (who work the Oxford fasts).

Trolley service is provided by Rail Gourmet, on behalf of GWR.

 

[387star]

So a train from cotswold line best bet

 

[JN114]

The GWR-ATP has to be removed first !

Does it? They’ve provided a mode key switch on the back wall behind the driver to allow them to switch between GW-ATP and ETCS. If you had to remove the hardware to switch between them it’s a bit strange for them to then provide a key switch to change modes...

 

[387star]

Cotswold line originator was a turbo too and rammed 800s can't come soon enough to a city missing out on wires and lengthy 387s

 

[Envoy]

On the 5-car sets, the driving cars house pantographs and transformers, but have no motors. The three intermediate vehicles feature both the diesel engines and electric motors, which are fed from the driving cars when running on electric power.

On the 9-car sets, five of the intermediate vehicles incorporate diesel engines. These five plus one additional intermediate vehicle are fitted with motors which are all fed via the pantographs on the driving cars when running on electric power.

Class 800 5-car sets formed:
Driving Pantograph Trailer Kitchen First
Motor Composite (diesel engine)
Motor Standard (diesel engine)
Motor Standard (diesel engine)
Driving Pantograph Trailer Standard

Class 800 9-car sets formed:
Driving Pantograph Trailer Kitchen First
Motor First (diesel engine)
Motor Standard (diesel engine)
Trailer Standard
Motor Standard (diesel engine)
Motor Standard
Motor Standard (diesel engine)
Motor Standard (diesel engine)
Driving Pantograph Trailer Standard

Many thanks ‘sprinterguy’ for taking the time to give this response.

 

[sprinterguy]

Many thanks ‘sprinterguy’ for taking the time to give this response.

No problem.

 

[gallafent]

Cotswold line originator was a turbo too and rammed 800s can't come soon enough to a city missing out on wires and lengthy 387s

Very much so. Thankfully, a train I often take, which is the 1001 from Oxford to London (originating somewhere up the North Cotswold line , is now 9-car IET rather than 5 (which wasn't enough). I'm hoping that's a “permanent” change. It'll be interesting to see how things feel in a month's time, after the blockade and the delivery of quite a few more IETs. It'll also be interesting to see whether / when the 11ish miles from Didcot to Oxford will be scheduled to be wired. I guess it'll be March 2019 before any indications about this break cover.

 

[gallafent]

It'll also be interesting to see whether / when the 11ish miles from Didcot to Oxford will be scheduled to be wired. I guess it'll be March 2019 before any indications about this break cover.

Hmm, having skimmed the document for the Western Region on the CP6 part of the NR website, I don't see any mention at all of planned electrification, even infill or completion of deferred sections, which is somewhat concerning. Time will tell …

Edit: the “Didcot to Oxford Electrification” is present in the full strategy document (which I hadn't found on first looking since it is in a list that isn't expanded by default!) with a gnomic “W001a” next to it, in the enhancements table. The “Hendy Tail” is a long and winding one ……………

https://www.networkrail.co.uk/who-we-are/publications-resources/strategicbusinessplan/ has links to the PDF summary document as well as the detailed documents.

 

[JonasB]

How many class 800s are currently in service? And is there some way to follow deliveries? And is GWR the only operator to use them so far?

 

[TractiveEffort]

How many class 800s are currently in service? And is there some way to follow deliveries? And is GWR the only operator to use them so far?

32 x 800 5 cars

4 x 800 9 cars

No idea if the deliveries are being publicly announced.

Yes.

 

[JonasB]

32 x 800 5 cars

4 x 800 9 cars

No idea if the deliveries are being publicly announced.

Yes.

Thank you!

 

[snowball]

with a gnomic “W001a” next to it, in the enhancements table.

It matches the code used in the Enhancements Delivery Plan and its quarterly updates.

https://cdn.networkrail.co.uk/wp-content/uploads/2018/07/June-2018-EDP-update.pdf

 

[D1009]

Hmm, having skimmed the document for the Western Region on the CP6 part of the NR website, I don't see any mention at all of planned electrification, even infill or completion of deferred sections, which is somewhat concerning. Time will tell …

Edit: the “Didcot to Oxford Electrification” is present in the full strategy document (which I hadn't found on first looking since it is in a list that isn't expanded by default!) with a gnomic “W001a” next to it, in the enhancements table. The “Hendy Tail” is a long and winding one ……………

https://www.networkrail.co.uk/who-we-are/publications-resources/strategicbusinessplan/ has links to the PDF summary document as well as the detailed documents.

May I respectfully suggest that the Great Western Electrification thread in the infrastructure sub forum is the more appropriate place to discuss this topic.

 

[TractiveEffort]

Thank you!

I was wrong, 800308 joined the gang this week, so it’s 5 x 800 9 cars

 

[coppercapped]

SNIP
Is it not amazing that Class 387s etc are being allowed to run at 110 on the fast lines without the protection afforded by ATP or ETCS ?. This is not mentioned anywhere in the Railway press. There is evidently a cover-up !

I cannot work out if this is an attempt at scaremongering or humour.

In any event nobody seems to get uptight about trains running at up to 125mph on other routes with only the protection offered by AWS/TPWS.

 

[td97]

Is the 800 permitted to run on electric anywhere on the ECML at the moment? I've seen them a few times doing testing runs, but only ever running on diesel.

 

[DanNCL]

Is the 800 permitted to run on electric anywhere on the ECML at the moment? I've seen them a few times doing testing runs, but only ever running on diesel.

Some of the 801s have run up the ECML, which suggests that the IEPs are permitted to run electric on the ECML.

 

[class26]

Is the 800 permitted to run on electric anywhere on the ECML at the moment? I've seen them a few times doing testing runs, but only ever running on diesel.

One was through Grantham on Tuesday evening on electric. Stopped at Platform one going southbound then accelerated away like a scolded cat

 

[jimm]

Spotted 800303 at Reading at about 09.20 this morning, pulling out of platform 7 on what looks like test running or driver training, as realtimetrains shows it making several trips up and down between Reading and Didcot until mid-afternoon.

 

[ainsworth74]

One was through Grantham on Tuesday evening on electric. Stopped at Platform one going southbound then accelerated away like a scolded cat

I've seen at least one IET at Darlington on electric. I don't think there's any issues with the units themselves on ECML wires. Whether there is sufficient power in the wires however...

 

[class26]

I've seen at least one IET at Darlington on electric. I don't think there's any issues with the units themselves on ECML wires. Whether there is sufficient power in the wires however...

When I saw the 800 in Grantham it was at about 18.50 as after it accelerated away I retired to the waiting room on Platform one to watch the start of the England game which started at 19.00. That`s how I remember the time ! Was fairly quiet on the main line at that time.

 

[aar0]

GWR IETs now offering hot food in standard, just enjoyed an excellent GWR bacon baguette. Feels like it's dawdling and yet is ahead of time at every station; I do hope the eventual IET timetable allows their performance to be fully exploited!

 

[Pete_uk]

They will be alright while sucking juice out of the wires.

My comment thread about underfloor noise on a unmotored coach was probably from the motors