Trivia - Routes With Genuine Shared Traffic Between TOCs

[Deepgreen]

I live near Dorking, Surrey. This weekend there are no trains on the radial Epsom to Dorking route and the replacement buses are needlessly complicated, apparently because two TOCs share the route. It set me wondering where there are other routes that are more or less equally shared by different TOCs with very similar service patterns and provision. In the Dorking case SWR and Southern operate what are essentially similar suburban services along the corridor, so neither offers a fast vs. slow service, etc. I can't think of anywhere else in the UK where this situation exists, but I'd be surprised if I've not missed examples.

 

[alangla]

North of Preston, I suspect most passengers aren’t overly bothered if they’re travelling on an Avanti or TransPennine service.

 

[NSE]

I guess you have examples where Thameslink runs. I know TSGN is all one, but from somewhere like Gravesend/London Bridge is similar. I know the Thameslink one carries on further north. But SE offer a virtually identical service in terms of both being localish/metro-y services with similar journey times.

 

[CBlue]

Thameslink and Great Northern offer a more or less identical semi-fast service between Cambridge and London. The only big difference is that the Thameslink terminus is St Pancras.

 

[johnnychips]

(Manchester)-Sheffield- Meadowhall-Doncaster-(Cleethorpes) TPE hourly
Sheffield - Meadowhall - Doncaster - (Hull and Scarborough) Northern hourly

and also pre-CV

Sheffield-Doncaster (Terminates/Adwick) Stopper, Northern half-hourly
(Birmingham and beyond)-Sheffield - Doncaster- (Newcastle) XC hourly

If there are rail replacement buses, I have no idea who organises them. XC have diversion options; but there is generally a ‘stopper’ bus, and a direct Sheffield to Doncaster bus if there are no trains. This is what happened in the floods just under a year ago.

 

[Mojo]

Between Birmingham New Street and Birmingham International / Coventry. Whilst some trains take substantially longer than the other, you might as well catch the first departure whenever you arrive at the station because the timetable (during the daytimes at least, not sure about the extremes of the day) doesn't have trains being overtaken.

If you also count the city as a whole, the service options between Birmingham and Leamington Spa / Banbury are fairly equal between Chiltern Railways and CrossCountry Trains with fast trains operating twice per hour (pre-Covid timetable).

 

[Dr Day]

Cardiff-Newport - TfW vGWR plus XC . Plus others on South Wales main line. Needs 3 different poster boards at Newport for each operator’s engineering changes.

 

[sheff1]

In normal times:
- two trains per hour Sheffield - Derby from both XC & EMR
- one per hour Sheffield - Nottingham from both Northern & EMR
- one fast per hour Sheffield - Manchester from both TPE & EMR

In the Derby case regular travellers might aim for EMR due to the frequent overcrowding on XC but most people will just turn up and go as the journey times are almost identical, as they are on the other two routes.

 

[Mag_seven]

Queens Park to Harrow and Wealdstone - operated by both London Underground and London Overground

 

[thenorthern]

Wolverhampton to Birmingham I think is a big one given how close it it most people won't care which operator they travel on. Same with Stockport to Piccadilly.

York to Edinburgh I think as well is one as there are an option of 3 "Fast" operators.

 

[waverley47]

The most obvious for me is Edinburgh - York. The three are broadly similar journey times, stopping patterns, speed and tbh, broadly similar comfort levels. The only difference is really capacity and onward journeys, but along the 220 miles they're more or less similar.

Edit, beaten to it

 

[NoMorePacers]

The Northern fast services and the Hull Trains/LNER services between Doncaster and Hull take about the same length of time - although the former is much more frequent than the latter, especially right now.

 

[johnnychips]

Who actually has to organise rail replacement buses for engineering? Is it Network Rail because they have caused the ‘problem’ or is it the train companies? With @sheff1 in post#9 I wonder who would be responsible if it were between, say, Dore and Chesterfield?

 

[thenorthern]

Derby to Sheffield has two operators taking about the same time. Nottingham to Sheffield is the same.

 

[Puppetfinger]

Exeter - Penzance, GWR and XC, although granted the XC services are not as frequent.

 

[Glenn1969]

Leeds to Wakefield. Four operators. Northern, XC, LNER, EMR (few)
Leeds to York also has 4 operators Northern, XC, TPE, LNER (few)

 

[MarlowDonkey]

The off peak outer end of the Paddington to Reading service between Maidenhead and Reading. Two Tfl trains per hour, two GWR, all calling at Maidenhead, Twyford and Reading.

Between Paddington and Maidenhead, the GWR trains have far fewer stops.

 

[Bevan Price]

North of Preston, I suspect most passengers aren’t overly bothered if they’re travelling on an Avanti or TransPennine service.

Plus Northern between Preston & Lancaster / Oxenholme.

 

[Yindee8191]

Arguably I’d say SWR and GWR between Reading and Wokingham. Admittedly, SWR stop at all stations, while GWR do a bit more of an express service, but they’re both more or less outer-suburban commuter trains.

 

[Bald Rick]

Who actually has to organise rail replacement buses for engineering? Is it Network Rail because they have caused the ‘problem’ or is it the train companies? With @sheff1 in post#9 I wonder who would be responsible if it were between, say, Dore and Chesterfield?

Train companies. In multi-TOC areas they will decide between them who takes the lead

 

[Watershed]

Train companies. In multi-TOC areas they will decide between them who takes the lead

Network Rail foot the bill though. For the time being!

 

[daodao]

Wolverhampton to Birmingham I think is a big one given how close it it most people won't care which operator they travel on. Same with Stockport to Piccadilly.

York to Edinburgh I think as well is one as there are an option of 3 "Fast" operators.

There are 3 TOCs operating between Manchester and Stoke via Macclesfield, and between Manchester and Crewe via Wilmslow.

 

[Scotrail314209]

North of Preston, I suspect most passengers aren’t overly bothered if they’re travelling on an Avanti or TransPennine service.

Ive noticed a lot of people do pick between Avanti and TPE. Avanti are a bit more frequent in a normal timetable and slightly faster.

When I’ve travelled on TPE, I’ve noticed it’s seemed rather slow going up the WCML.

 

[yorkie]

Thameslink and Great Northern offer a more or less identical semi-fast service between Cambridge and London. The only big difference is that the Thameslink terminus is St Pancras.

This is all one TOC though.

There are loads of examples that match the criteria posted, for example from York I have a choice of similar operator of I go towards Edinburgh, Leeds or Doncaster.

 

[pdeaves]

Almost any route run by CrossCountry duplicates another operators' services. Not 100% of XC options, obviously.

 

[norbitonflyer]

Between Reading and Oxford, Cross Country and GWR. Also Basingstoke - Southampton - Bournemouth - Cross Country and SWR. Both Basingstoke and Reading are major interchange points, particularly for passengers travelling to/from SW London and Surrey. (Indeed, Surbiton to Oxford via Basingstoke is a valid route my family have used several times)

 

[The Planner]

Network Rail foot the bill though. For the time being!

Hopefully Schedule 4 dies a death, such a prime example of wooden dollars.

 

[Mcr Warrior]

Hopefully Schedule 4 dies a death, such a prime example of wooden dollars.

Not previously heard that. What's the meaning of the phrase?

Every day's a school day on here!

 

[Horizon22]

Between New Cross Gate and Norwood Junction / Crystal Palace, London Overground and Southern share route with the same (all stations) calling patterns. They divert off at either end of course.

 

[Royston Vasey]

Queens Park to Harrow and Wealdstone - operated by both London Underground and London Overground

Are you sure that isn't Wimbledon?