They had a better gangway than the original fitted for multiple working within their own class, and the couplings were changed to allow rescue coupling only by Desiros. Never intended to work together.At the time the 458 and 460s were converted to 458/5s
Didnt SWT plan for them to work together with the 450s? Isnt that why they have a cab gangway in the first place?
The actual spacing of the seats is already there due to the large seat spacers used. The gangways aren't really any wider than in a mainline 2+2 carriage. They just need armrests.Suburban 2+2 is wide aisles and no tables, unsuitable for mainline work. Presumably it'll be an upgrade to Class 444 type interior.
That is exactly what I was thinking.Begs the question what will happen to the spare 458 trailers.
Probably sold for scrap, unless ScotRail wants them to extend their Class 334s.That is exactly what I was thinking.
Be interesting to see if use of the gangway doors is resurrected? Biggest pain at the moment is to find that you are in the half of the train that has no working toilets and you can't get to the other unit.
The actual spacing of the seats is already there due to the large seat spacers used. The gangways aren't really any wider than in a mainline 2+2 carriage. They just need armrests.
I think it’s in that sort of grey area where they can theoretically be used but the non-commercial guards insist on locking them to maintain their status quo...Thought they were using them on those units.
75mph currently. As a post above stated, they're getting regeared to 100mph againAren’t the 458s restricted to 90mph, so not going to be useful on fasts or semi-fast on the main Winchester line.
But I guess the lower gearing might help on the twisty and less flat Portsmouth direct line. However might be sensible to keep them on self contained diagrams, something like Solent lines
I wonder if they'll get their vinyl replaced with carpet? That will be interesting!
It would be nice if the toilets got upgraded for their new role. They didn't work the first time they were reprieved at the expense of the 442s.Be interesting to see if use of the gangway doors is resurrected? Biggest pain at the moment is to find that you are in the half of the train that has no working toilets and you can't get to the other unit.
They can do that by just binning the cars from the 460s.I've nether understood the difference in window panelling on 458's! Would be nice if they could all get consistent window frames fitted!
I've nether understood the difference in window panelling on 458's! Would be nice if they could all get consistent window frames fitted!
Agreed, and they were completely untouched by the five-car project.It would be nice if the toilets got upgraded for their new role. They didn't work the first time they were reprieved at the expense of the 442s.
Another advantage of the 458s is that they don't require a shunter to couple them up so it opens the possibility of them going on the Weymouths.
That would be quite an expensive project for what is effectively vanity.I've nether understood the difference in window panelling on 458's! Would be nice if they could all get consistent window frames fitted!
Not if they want to retain 36 sets. Seriously why not return 1-30 to original 4 car formation then make the others (made up of the old 460 vehicles) up to six x 10 car trains, possibly for dedicated diagrams. Understand this is part logic, part OCD but saves losing vehicles which are only twenty or so years old so only at half life.They can do that by just binning the cars from the 460s.
The cab looks small, but no more cramped than Electrostars..There’s already quite a bit of concern they’ll be converted to DOO but I don’t know if there’s room in the cabs for monitors.
Four driving cars already scrapped during the conversion process.Understand this is part logic, part OCD but saves losing vehicles which are only twenty or so years old so only at half life.
Oh yes, realise that, have photos of them at Doncaster awaiting disposal. make that "saves losing any more vehicles which are only twenty or so years old so only at half life"Four driving cars already scrapped during the conversion process.
Is it even likely? Seems to me they’ll be operating mainly on the same or similar routes as 444 and 450, and neither have monitors...There’s already quite a bit of concern they’ll be converted to DOO but I don’t know if there’s room in the cabs for monitors.
Why not? Because you're making yet another odd ball sub-fleet compared with 30 or 36 x 4-car units that can run at maximum 12-car length. And that's before you look at the make-up of the spare vehicles in terms of motors or trailers, TMS capabilities etc etc etc. Just a total non-starter.Not if they want to retain 36 sets. Seriously why not return 1-30 to original 4 car formation then make the others (made up of the old 460 vehicles) up to six x 10 car trains, possibly for dedicated diagrams. Understand this is part logic, part OCD but saves losing vehicles which are only twenty or so years old so only at half life.
Stagecoach specified them for DOO because they were intending to DOO all suburban services, hence they have door buttons on the drivers desk. No in-cab monitors because they were going to use platform mirrors and monitors.Is it even likely? Seems to me they’ll be operating mainly on the same or similar routes as 444 and 450, and neither have monitors...
Surely unlikely given the DOO equipment was removed on the 442s.There’s already quite a bit of concern they’ll be converted to DOO but I don’t know if there’s room in the cabs for monitors.
I think the 350/2 would have been a better option than this, with a longer remaining life following conversion, so presumably Porterbrook still have them earmarked for something else?