It already is. Just by the Government of a different sovereign nation.
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P&O Ferries - mass redundancies without consultation
- Thread starter Lemmy99uk
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It already is. Just by the Government of a different sovereign nation.
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Baxenden Bank
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I'm not surprised, a ferry will be a complex operation mechanically but also physically - in terms of knowing all the locations where passengers may need assembling from in an emergency etc. A regular crew will know these from experience on that vessel, a new crew member would pick it up from other established crew members but an entirely new crew is starting from scratch.
LNW-GW Joint
Veteran Member
Three ships are running: one on Hull-Rotterdam, one on Cairnryan-Larne, and one on Liverpool-Dublin.
Half service on these routes.
Edit: A fourth ship is now sailing, so the Hull-Rotterdam route has both its ships available.
Still nothing at Dover.
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I'd rather have our own bunch of fools to complain about.
jamesontheroad
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Dai Corner
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The question is "whose money are they spending?".
They may well be sueing P&O Ferries for reputational damage to the brand.
Baxenden Bank
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Given the number of cruise brands that Carnival Corporation owns (10), including one in the same place in the UK (Southampton, Cunard Line) it would be possible to transfer the P & O Cruises business to one of the others and leave the stench of 'that other P & O' in their wake.
I'm not a marketing or brand guru but are there many people nostalgically clinging to the empire related Peninsula and Oriental image? Sunlit Uplands and all that.
Probably mainly meaningful in the US (traditional old British luxury with a modern twist would, at a guess, be the angle) and UK markets. The latter is, of course, where association with the ferry thing would do most harm. If the brand is significantly impaired l suspect that you may well be correct.
LOL The Irony
On Moderation
The problem is, are the staff employed by P&O Cruises or Carnival Corporation & plc? The main problem however, is that repainting and rebranding 6 ships into Cunard colours would be far too expensive compared to just suing P&O Ferries/DP World for brand and reputational damage, which they have a good chance of winning.
I rather expect them to seek the cost of a rebranding and additionally impairment.
Gloster
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Which presumably sail from Britanny’s Piers.
I only ever knew the P&O brand from when I lived and worked in Aberdeen and they had the contract for the Orkney and Shetland ferries (since awarded to Serco - another company known for its benevolent attitude to its employees...)
I don't think the parent company of P&O cruises would have anything to lose by ditching that particular brand but, let's face it, none of them come out smelling of roses when it comes to treating employees well.
The staff are employed by subsidies of Carnival UK, and can freely transfer or be transferred between P&O cruises and Cunard ships.
It isn't just branding - the ships are designed and built in very distinctive styles, so transferring ships to cunard would be incredibly expensive without seriously diluying the cunard brand, especially Ventura and Azura which are barely good enough to be P&O ships! P&O cruises carries pretty much 100% British passengers - much more modern everyday British than traditional. Cunard is probably 60/40 US vs UK passengers, and is very much built on a classic British ocean liner brand.
As a rail parallel, you'd be looking at moving 700s onto LNER services.
I think the P&O Cruises brand will survive (after all Carnival's Costa brand survived the Concordia), but if it doesn't, a new brand is much more likely than a merger with another.
brilliant!
Eyersey468
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Baboom Tisht!
Yes. Situated just in the timber lake
Agent_Squash
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At least Brittany Ferries aren't likely to pull the same stunt!
LNW-GW Joint
Veteran Member
"Great British Ferries" surely.
Except historically that was Sealink, and included French/Dutch operations in the brand.
The UK operation is now essentially part of Stena (who sold their Dover operation to P&O).
Actually I can't imagine this government wanting to buy a ferry operator.
It would expect other private operators to fill the void.
Except historically that was Sealink, and included French/Dutch operations in the brand.
The UK operation is now essentially part of Stena (who sold their Dover operation to P&O).
Actually I can't imagine this government wanting to buy a ferry operator.
It would expect other private operators to fill the void.
Baxenden Bank
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Did you mean:
It would
LNW-GW Joint
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No, it's a free market.
You'd expect DFDS and Irish Ferries to fill the gap, or another operator (Stena, Brittany?) could appear.
Why should the UK state fund a busy commercial (international) route?
It wouldn't be much different to Flybe going bust (though they are back in a smaller guise).
To be honest, I don't know how ferry routes like Dover-Calais are regulated, or at what point routes are up for grabs.
I think Baxenden Bank might have been referring to Grayling's contract with a certain ferry company.
As you say, it's a free market, there is no restriction on a new operator, or one pulling out. The only real restriction is port capacity, but there is probably more than adequate at both ends. As with other elements of the free market, the competition commission can get involved in the event of mergers - most recently when they prevented Stena taking over P&O's Liverpool - Dublin route.
Newhaven to Dieppe is operated with a subsidy from French local government, so there the situation is a little different, and Brittany Ferries is very complicated, but otherwise the UK - Europe and Ireland markets are free market.
Looks like they've selected a premium crew:
https://www.kentonline.co.uk/dover/news/seven-p-o-agency-workers-sacked-for-drinking-on-job-265792/
Appears to be at Dover.
https://www.kentonline.co.uk/dover/news/seven-p-o-agency-workers-sacked-for-drinking-on-job-265792/
Baxenden Bank
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The rush to the bottom seems to be a gift that keeps on giving.
Do you think this is how P & O Ferries though it would pan out? Is it another part of their cunning plan!
As I understand from someone who I used to work with who was a musician on Cruise ships befor the pandemic, after the Costa Concordia diaster it's strictly no drinking for staff on board even if you are not on shift just in case the worse happens.
Before it was supposedly one big party when you wern't working!
Before it was supposedly one big party when you wern't working!
Special Re-employment Operation?
Hard to say whether there was a plan. Maybe they thought the safety checks would be nodded through otherwise the timing - not long before Easter was wrong. What was wrong with mid January?
Maybe they thought the government would be distracted by other things, instead the government has acted tough (or appeared to) to try to distract us from a range of other matters (we all know what they are).
What would be interesting to know is whose idea/ plan it was. P & O Ferries must be losing even more money now. According to South East Today (BBC local TV), there are no plans to recheck the ferries currently and the replacements for the seven drunk staff will need to be recruited and trained.
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