Historic National Express Routes

[185]

Leeds Sheffield was the 070, which I think Yorkshire Rider Leeds (YRL) operated.

Up to a point, the 360 later 060 was two coaches from YRL and three coaches from Express Travel (ETL, formerly Amberline) of Woodend Avenue Speke.

If I recall, this was (I'm told) until a prop shaft came off one of YRLs badly maintained Dennis Javelins partially going through the floor of the coach...

 

[NorwichRailFan]

I swear Norwich used to have so many more NX routes, up to around 2019 I recall there was a Norwich to Bangor route(forgotten the number but I think it was operated by Ambassador Travel). Now in terms of coach travel, going west your only option is the Birmingham Megabus M37 and that only runs a few days a week at inconvenient times.

 

[Titfield]

I think it was the late 80s or the early 80s when National Express operated a London Victoria <> Birmingham Digbeth shuttle (branded and marketed as such) that went hourly just turn up and go.

Not sure how long it lasted.

 

[Deerfold]

Thinking back when the express shuttle first started, either late 95 or early 96, one of the routes was 360 Liverpool to Manchester & 361 Manchester to Leeds merged & became the 060 Liverpool to Leeds via Manchester.

The idea behind it was to introduce a daily hourly express shuttle between cities, so that passengers can turn up & go, & don't have to prebook.

I remember a Leeds to Sheffield express shuttle that didn't last long.

What were the other express shuttle routes?

Leeds to Sheffield was the 070 and upped the frequency between the cities to half hourly for most of the day. There were already a lot of long distance routes that served both so there were only a handful of 070s that were added when there was a larger gap in the frequency (Leeds to Nottingham and beyond were hourly for much of the day and there were occasional other services).

I think it was the late 80s or the early 80s when National Express operated a London Victoria <> Birmingham Digbeth shuttle (branded and marketed as such) that went hourly just turn up and go.

Not sure how long it lasted.

There was one of those in the early 2000s with (I think) a half hourly service. I think it was the only service operated with NX-owned coaches.

 

[route101]

Thinking back when the express shuttle first started, either late 95 or early 96, one of the routes was 360 Liverpool to Manchester & 361 Manchester to Leeds merged & became the 060 Liverpool to Leeds via Manchester.

The idea behind it was to introduce a daily hourly express shuttle between cities, so that passengers can turn up & go, & don't have to prebook.

I remember a Leeds to Sheffield express shuttle that didn't last long.

What were the other express shuttle routes?

Often think this should be done on a few free routes. Citylink has this for the 900.

I swear Norwich used to have so many more NX routes, up to around 2019 I recall there was a Norwich to Bangor route(forgotten the number but I think it was operated by Ambassador Travel). Now in terms of coach travel, going west your only option is the Birmingham Megabus M37 and that only runs a few days a week at inconvenient times.

Surprised there is not a route from Norwich to Birmingham. I reckon it would go A11 and A14 though.

 

[Martin2013]

Think the Norwich to Bangor route might have been 375 and was worked by Llew Jones. I managed a ride on one of their own liveried coaches on it on a quick trip between Coventry and Birmingham in February 2020.

From what I understand it last ran in March 2020 and has never returned since?

 

[route101]

Think the Norwich to Bangor route might have been 375 and was worked by Llew Jones. I managed a ride on one of their own liveried coaches on it on a quick trip between Coventry and Birmingham in February 2020.

From what I understand it last ran in March 2020 and has never returned since?

I lot of routes never returned after Covid.

Does anyone have a pre covid route list or timetables?

 

[Murray J]

East Grinstead used to be served by a London-Eastbourne route I believe, numbered 24, despite ceasing several years ago it's still marked on the East Grinstead War Memorial stop.

 

[route101]

East Grinstead used to be served by a London-Eastbourne route I believe, numbered 24, despite ceasing several years ago it's still marked on the East Grinstead War Memorial stop.

Eastbourne is on the list to come back, I wonder if its via Brighton though.

 

[Murray J]

Eastbourne is on the list to come back, I wonder if its via Brighton though.

Wasn't even aware Eastbourne wasn't served anymore actually, i'd imagine it will be via Brighton though, or maybe Hastings if that's on the cards too.

 

[Statto]

Think the Norwich to Bangor route might have been 375 and was worked by Llew Jones. I managed a ride on one of their own liveried coaches on it on a quick trip between Coventry and Birmingham in February 2020.

From what I understand it last ran in March 2020 and has never returned since?

The 375 was a headscratcher of a route & didn't see the point if it, didn't the 375 partly replace the 545 which was Pwllheli & North Wales Coast or Birkenhead to London?

 

[Flying Snail]

London through Bristol, South Wales and Pembroke Dock to Rosslare, Wexford, Waterford and Cork.

Dropped a little before COVID so unlikely to return.

 

[route101]

London through Bristol, South Wales and Pembroke Dock to Rosslare, Wexford, Waterford and Cork.

Dropped a little before COVID so unlikely to return.

Was that a through bus on the ferry?

402 service that went from Newbury along A4 to Bath.

 

[Martin2013]

London through Bristol, South Wales and Pembroke Dock to Rosslare, Wexford, Waterford and Cork.

Dropped a little before COVID so unlikely to return.

It was actually dropped in early February 2020 a week after Brexit. Not sure if there was any connection or not

 

[E-Rail]

There was a NX 068 on summer Saturdays that ran Dymchurch via Camber Sands and Rye to London. It was run by East Kent from Folkestone depot. One up, one back. I think it lasted until the mid 90s.

 

[pitdiver]

I dont know about historical more hysterical. The MK1 service from the Old coachway at Milton Keynes to Canary Wharf. I helped with the development of this service as I was the manager at the Coachway at that time.

 

[Titfield]

There was a NX 068 on summer Saturdays that ran Dymchurch via Camber Sands and Rye to London. It was run by East Kent from Folkestone depot. One up, one back. I think it lasted until the mid 90s.

The excellent books (2 volumes) by Tom Mclachlan, Grey Green and Contemporaries, goes into some detail about the history of the London to Kent Coast Resorts services. It is astonishing how many services ran during the 1950s and 1960s from all over London to the Kent resorts.

 

[Magdalia]

If you want to know where people (usually demographics D and E) go on holiday by coach (in general - these were the main flows)....

• East Midlands go to Skegness
• Greater Glasgow go to Blackpool
• West Midlands go to either Weston super Mare or Rhyl (or Minehead at a push)
• Mancs go to Blackpool or Scarborough
• Londoners go to Great Yarmouth (Hemsby) or Brighton for a day trip
• North East go to Blackpool
• Leeds to Scarborough/Bridlington

Most of these associations were established by the railways, before long distance coach travel was a thing. Coaches replaced trains in the 1960s when British Railways effectively withdrew from the market after Beeching by withdrawing most of the pre-Nationalisation rolling stock that was used for many of the summer Saturday holiday and day excursion trains.

Skegness and Mablethorpe are Nottingham and Derby but less so for Leicester, which has a strong association with North Norfolk dating back to the M&GN. Sheffield's strongest association was with Cleethorpes.

Many of these associations are handed down through the generations: parents take their children to the places they themselves remember from childhood. This doesn't apply in London where the population has changed so much that historic associations have disappeared.

 

[TheGrandWazoo]

Most of these associations were established by the railways, before long distance coach travel was a thing. Coaches replaced trains in the 1960s when British Railways effectively withdrew from the market after Beeching by withdrawing most of the pre-Nationalisation rolling stock that was used for many of the summer Saturday holiday and day excursion trains.

Skegness and Mablethorpe are Nottingham and Derby but less so for Leicester, which has a strong association with North Norfolk dating back to the M&GN. Sheffield's strongest association was with Cleethorpes.

Many of these associations are handed down through the generations: parents take their children to the places they themselves remember from childhood. This doesn't apply in London where the population has changed so much that historic associations have disappeared.

Can't disagree with that historical view - I'm sure you're right.

I think with Leicester, it might be easier for the coach service to travel via the A46/A158 to get to Skegness (rather than North Norfolk), and in those days, NX also had a tie-in with Butlins. However, friends in Northamptonshire (when I lived there) definitely defaulted to Sunny Hunny

 

[GusB]

This is a discussion about historic National Express routes. If anyone wishes to discuss express services prior to the existence of National Express, feel free to start a new thread, but it's outwith the scope of this one.

 

[Flying Snail]

Was that a through bus on the ferry?

Yes, through coach from Cork with connections from other Bus Eireann routes in Cork and Waterford. Since about 2007 it was operated by Bernard Kavanagh Coaches, latterly with a pair of NX liveried Jonckherre coaches. Bus Eireann had been the contractor before that.

Bernard Kavanagh 161-D-9266

Bernard Kavanagh, Urlingford, Volvo B11R, Jonckheere SHV 161-D-9266 is pictured at Rosslare Europort to route 890 from Cork to London. This vehicle now sports National Express livery.

flickr.com

It was actually dropped in early February 2020 a week after Brexit. Not sure if there was any connection or not

No, nothing to do with Brexit or Covid. Low numbers on the cross channel route and chronic unreliability due to issues, mainly weather related, with the ferry service particularly during winter 2019. Cross-channel passengers would be delayed on the coach whereas those from Wales were often left standing at the roadside early morning for hours on end.

 

[route101]

Yes, through coach from Cork with connections from other Bus Eireann routes in Cork and Waterford. Since about 2007 it was operated by Bernard Kavanagh Coaches, latterly with a pair of NX liveried Jonckherre coaches. Bus Eireann had been the contractor before that.

Bernard Kavanagh 161-D-9266

Bernard Kavanagh, Urlingford, Volvo B11R, Jonckheere SHV 161-D-9266 is pictured at Rosslare Europort to route 890 from Cork to London. This vehicle now sports National Express livery.

flickr.com

No, nothing to do with Brexit or Covid. Low numbers on the cross channel route and chronic unreliability due to issues, mainly weather related, with the ferry service particularly during winter 2019. Cross-channel passengers would be delayed on the coach whereas those from Wales were often left standing at the roadside early morning for hours on end.

Interesting, Irish registered coach in NX livery. I guess flying is far quicker.

 

[Flying Snail]

Interesting, Irish registered coach in NX livery. I guess flying is far quicker.

Flying has been quicker for a very long time, the route survived more than 20 years of low-cost air travel.

Maybe, despite all of the social media guff over sustainability, the younger generations are simply not interested in using these sorts of options when they can hop on a 737 and tick the box for 50p worth of fake carbon offsetting.

 

[Deerfold]

Came across a National Express 1989 Summer Timetable book (agent copy), if anyone has any questions (I'll be back in the same country as it is Thursday afternoon).

(Image below shows the front cover of the book)

 

[Ken H]

Came across this [National Express 1989 Summer Timetable book (agent copy)], if anyone has any questions (I'll be back in the same country as it is Thursday afternoon).

I have a 96/97 one (image of cover below). But mine has had the correction pages pasted over the original pages. has yours had that treatment?

 

[route101]

Came across a National Express 1989 Summer Timetable book (agent copy), if anyone has any questions (I'll be back in the same country as it is Thursday afternoon).

(Image below shows the front cover of the book)

I would be interested in the routes from Scotland and Southampton/Portsmouth.

The 596 will become a historical route soon. The 596 starts in Edinburgh and runs to London via Glasgow.

 

[ADB125]

Found a couple of timetables I have from 2009, I picked them up in the National Express travel office at Carlisle bus station at the time. They cover the routes from London to Glasgow/Aberdeen/Inverness, and from Manchester to Scotland (also showing the timings of the 538 services to/from Birmingham). Other services from Edinburgh/Glasgow to Birmingham at the time I believe were the 536 Edinburgh to Cardiff and 539 Edinburgh to Bournemouth, and from Carlisle there were also the 920/921 Ulsterbus routes from Belfast. Other Scottish routes not shown would have been the 534 Glasgow to Hull and 537 Glasgow to Corby.

 

[route101]

Found a couple of timetables I have from 2009, I picked them up in the National Express travel office at Carlisle bus station at the time. They cover the routes from London to Glasgow/Aberdeen/Inverness, and from Manchester to Scotland (also showing the timings of the 538 services to/from Birmingham). Other services from Edinburgh/Glasgow to Birmingham at the time I believe were the 536 Edinburgh to Cardiff and 539 Edinburgh to Bournemouth, and from Carlisle there were also the 920/921 Ulsterbus routes from Belfast. Other Scottish routes not shown would have been the 534 Glasgow to Hull and 537 Glasgow to Corby.


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Interesting. I do recall seeing that Wrexham service at Glasgow Buchanan Bus Station. The Ulsterbus routes to Belfast have not returned.

 

[TheGrandWazoo]

Interesting. I do recall seeing that Wrexham service at Glasgow Buchanan Bus Station. The Ulsterbus routes to Belfast have not returned.

There was also another Wrexham to Glasgow service in the mid 1990s. The 383 went from Wrexham to Manchester to Leeds, then north to Darlington and Newcastle, up through the Borders (e.g. Jedburgh) and to Edinburgh and then Glasgow.

I remember it latterly being a Selwyns diagram (which made sense). However, before that, it was operated by Western National and interworked with the 336 Penzance to Glasgow!

 

[Springs Branch]

Here's a bit of a niche question, which might need a kindly member with the right timetable from the right era to confirm . . .


In the late 1970s, every Friday at 7pm-ish, I would be waiting at a wayside bus stop outside Wigan for a local GMT service to take me to my regular Friday evening watering hole. Most times, a National Express coach would drive past, heading in the direction of Bolton and showing the destination "Leeds".

I assumed at the time this was some kind of National Express 'all shacks' coach between Liverpool (or just maybe from Southport) which stuck to A-roads and passed through all the towns along the way, rather than the faster 'inter-city' option along the M62, which was fully open by that time.

I have it in mind this route was numbered X58, but I might be confusing this with the A58 road which the coach would have followed most of the way.

Does anyone have any info on this Liverpool / Leeds via Wigan, Bolton, etc. etc. service from the 1970s (which passed through Wigan around 7pm)?