Goldfish62
Established Member
- Joined
- 14 Feb 2010
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That's quite amusing.Interesting to see 8008 with ‘First Group’ programmed into its blinds (see the images in the below link)
That's quite amusing.Interesting to see 8008 with ‘First Group’ programmed into its blinds (see the images in the below link)
Given that they've generally pared back networks across the country (especially in the North East and North Wales), exited mid Wales, Guildford, Cannock, Burton and Scotland, lost Bolton to the Bee Network, and even some of the modest acquisitions (e.g. Wardle and Centrebus Huddersfield) have been sold on, then it's a pretty sure fire bet.I'm pretty sure that Arriva UK bus will have fewer vehicles when sold to I Squared than it did when purchased by DB.
Arriva also exited Eastern and Mid Cheshire within the last 12 months.Given that they've generally pared back networks across the country (especially in the North East and North Wales), exited mid Wales, Guildford, Cannock, Burton and Scotland, lost Bolton to the Bee Network, and even some of the modest acquisitions (e.g. Wardle and Centrebus Huddersfield) have been sold on, then it's a pretty sure fire bet.
It wasn’t meant to be an exhaustive list - that would take too longArriva also exited Eastern and Mid Cheshire within the last 12 months.
The latest I’m seeing, also taken from buslistsontheweb.co.uk:According to buslistsontheweb.co.uk, the registrations for some more of the Wrightbus Electroliners (Midlands batch) have been identified:
8001 - BK73ACX
8002 - BK73ACY
8003 - BK73ACZ
8004 - BK73ADO
8005 - BK73ADU
8006 - BK73ADV
8007 - BK73ADX
66 Waltham Cross Circular Via Loughton Underground Station
Arriva
Timetable changes to improve punctuality.
From 07.01.24.
310 Hertford to Waltham Cross
Arriva
Timetable changes to improve punctuality.
From 07.01.24.
323 Hertford to Haldens - Welwyn Garden City
Arriva
New service route as part of the Herts Connect (BSIP) Bus Service Improvement Plan. This new service will serve Welwyn Garden City Bus Station, Blackmore Manor Estate, Great Gannett, QEII Hospital, Chequers Field and Broadwater Road. The 323 will replace sections of the 400 and 403 route. The 323 will run up to every 30 minutes Mondays to Saturdays.
From 07.01.24.
324 Ware/Hertford to Welwyn Garden City
Arriva
Service have been withdrawn. Replacement service are being investigated.
From 07.01.24.
401 Welwyn Garden City circular via Panshanger
Arriva
Timetable changes to improve punctuality.
From 07.01.24.
403 Welwyn Garden City circular via Great Gannett
Arriva
Service withdrawn. Great Gannett and Halden section of the route to be covered by the new 323 service. Woodhall Farm shops to be coved by the new 402 service route registration awaits.
From 07.01.24.
410 Harlow to Cheshunt Brookfield Centre
Central Connect
Service route number change to 25/25B. Timetable change on all service days including additional journeys.
From 02.01.24.
500 Aylesbury to Watford
Arriva
Service withdrawn. Service will be replaced by new X5 service.
From 07.01.24.
724 Harlow to Heathrow Airport
Arriva
Timetable changes to improve punctuality. Additional overnight journeys.
From 07.01.24.
821 Luton to Townsend School via Harpenden
Arriva
New School Service open to the public.
From 07.01.24.
X5 Aylesbury to Hemel Hempstead
Arriva
The service replacing service 500.
From 07.01.24.
Buslists.uk is usually fairly good but these 80xx buses have yet to appear there.The latest I’m seeing, also taken from buslistsontheweb.co.uk:
8008 - BK73ADZ
8009 - BK73AEA
8010 - BK73AEB
8011 - BK73AEC
8012 - BK73AED
8013 - BK73AEE
8014 - BK73AEF
Working in partnership with Transport Northeast (TNE), Nexus, local councils, and other operators, are introducing some new adult day tickets.
These new adult day tickets are valid across all bus operators, as well as Metro and Ferry, in the relevant areas.
You can now travel with the:
£6.80 TNE Day Saver
Valid on all local bus services throughout Tyne and Wear, Northumberland, and County Durham, plus Metro & Ferry.
£6.00 Tyne and Wear Day Rover
Valid on all local bus services across Tyne and Wear, plus Metro & Ferry.
£5.00 Northumberland Day Rover
Valid on all local bus services across Northumberland.
£4.00 Durham Day Rover
Valid on all local bus services across County Durham
Please see below full details of services that travel into other ensure to ensure that tickets you purchase are valid to your final destination:
Service 43: T&W Day Rover eligible for journeys as far as Dudley Lane - Northern Terrace from Newcastle. Northumberland Day Rover is eligible for journeys from Dudley Lane-Northern Terrace to Morpeth. If crossing the boundary in either direction the only valid BSIP adult fare is the TNE Day Saver.
Service 44: T&W Day Rover eligible for journeys as far as Dinnington – Masons Arms from Newcastle. Northumberland Day Rover is eligible for journeys from Dinnington – Masons Arms to Stannington. If crossing the boundary in either direction the only valid BSIP adult fare is the TNE Day Saver.
Service 57: Northumberland Day Rover eligible for journeys as far as Holywell village (Nursery) from Ashington. T&W Day Rover eligible for journeys as far as Seaton Delaval Avenue Head. TNE Day Saver eligible for entire route. If travelling from Tyne & Wear north of Seaton Delaval Avenue Head the only valid BSIP adult fare would be the TNE Day Saver. If travelling from Northumberland south of Holywell village (Nursery) the only valid BSIP adult fare would be the TNE Day Saver.
Service 308: T&W Day Rover eligible for journeys as far as Whitley Bay Caravan Park from Newcastle. Northumberland Day Rover is eligible for journeys from Whitley Bay Caravan Park to Blyth. If crossing the boundary in either direction the only valid BSIP adult fare is the TNE Day Saver.
Service X7: T&W Day Rover eligible for journeys as far as Annitsford Roundabout / County Boundary from Newcastle. Northumberland Day Rover is eligible for journeys from Annitsford Roundabout / County Boundary to Blyth. If crossing the boundary in either direction the only valid BSIP adult fare is the TNE Day Saver.
Service X8: T&W Day Rover eligible for journeys as far as Annitsford Font Street from Newcastle. Northumberland Day Rover is eligible for journeys from Annitsford Font Street to Blyth. If crossing the boundary in either direction the only valid BSIP adult fare is the TNE Day Saver.
Service X9: T&W Day Rover eligible for journeys as far as Seaton Burn Services / Arcot Lane from Newcastle. Northumberland Day Rover is eligible for journeys from Seaton Burn Services / Arcot Lane to Blyth. If crossing the boundary in either direction the only valid BSIP adult fare is the TNE Day Saver.
Service X10 / X11: T&W Day Rover eligible for journeys as far as Gosforth - Brunton Lane from Newcastle. Northumberland Day Rover is eligible for journeys from Southfield Green – Barns Park to Blyth. If crossing the boundary in either direction the only valid BSIP adult fare is the TNE Day Saver.
Service X14 / X15 / X16 / X18: T&W Day Rover eligible for journeys as far as Gosforth - Brunton Lane from Newcastle. Northumberland Day Rover is eligible for journeys from Clifton to Morpeth, Thropton, Alnwick and Berwick. If crossing the boundary in either direction the only valid BSIP adult fare is the TNE Day Saver.
Service X20: T&W Day Rover eligible for journeys as far as Gosforth - Brunton Lane from Newcastle. Northumberland Day Rover is eligible for journeys from North Seaton – South Side to Alnwick. If crossing the boundary in either direction the only valid BSIP adult fare is the TNE Day Saver.
Service X21 / X22: T&W Day Rover eligible for journeys as far as Seaton Burn Services / Arcot Lane from Newcastle. Northumberland Day Rover is eligible for journeys from Seaton Burn Services / Arcot Lane to Ashington and Newbiggin. If crossing the boundary in either direction the only valid BSIP adult fare is the TNE Day Saver.
Service X30: T&W Day Rover eligible for journeys as far as Gosforth - Brunton Lane from Newcastle. Northumberland Day Rover is eligible for journeys from Gosforth - Brunton Lane to Blyth. If crossing the boundary in either direction the only valid BSIP adult fare is the TNE Day Saver.
Service 1: Durham Day and TNE Day Saver's only applicable for journeys wholly within TNE zone. If boarding or alighting outside of zone the products are not valid
Service 5: Durham Day and TNE Day Saver's only applicable for journeys wholly within TNE zone. If boarding or alighting outside of zone the products are not valid
Service 7: Durham Day and TNE Day Saver's only applicable for journeys wholly within TNE zone. If boarding or alighting outside of zone the products are not valid
Service 8: Durham Day and TNE Day Saver's only applicable for journeys wholly within TNE zone. If boarding or alighting outside of zone the products are not valid
Service 22: T&W Day Rover eligible for journeys between Sunderland and Seaham Grange. Durham Day Rover eligible for journeys between Durham and Seaham Grange. If travelling from Tyne & Wear south of Seaham Grange the only valid BSIP adult fare would be the TNE Day Saver. If travelling from County Durham north of Seaham Grange the only valid BSIP adult fare would be the TNE Day Saver.
Service 23: T&W Day Rover eligible for journeys between Sunderland and Seaham Grange. Durham Day Rover eligible for journeys between Crimdon Dene and Seaham Grange. If travelling from Tyne & Wear south of Seaham Grange, the only valid BSIP adult fare would be the TNE Day Saver. If travelling from County Durham north of Seaham Grange, the only valid BSIP adult fare would be the TNE Day Saver No TNE ticket products are valid south of Crimdon Dene.
Service 24: Durham Day and TNE Day Saver's only applicable for journeys wholly within TNE zone. If boarding or alighting outside of zone the products are not valid this is any journey South of Crimdon Dene.
Service X12: T&W Day Rover eligible for journeys between Newcastle and Barley Mow. Durham Day Rover eligible for journeys between Barley Mow and Sedgefield. If travelling from Tyne & Wear south of Barley Mow the only valid BSIP adult fare would be the TNE Day Saver. If travelling from County Durham north of Barley Mow the only valid BSIP adult fare would be the TNE Day Saver No TNE ticket products are valid south Sedgefield.
Service X22: Durham Day and TNE Day Saver's only applicable for journeys wholly within TNE zone. If boarding or alighting outside of zone the products are not valid
Services X75/X76: Durham Day and TNE Day Saver's only applicable for journeys wholly within TNE zone. If boarding or alighting outside of zone the products are not valid
Well, for an exile, that's interesting.Something that has slipped under the radar, a new range of day rover tickets for County Durham, Tyne & Wear, & Northumberland have been launched, valid on all operators as well as the Metro & Shields Ferry.
Arriva Bus
www.arrivabus.co.uk
On the Transport North East website it has a list of operators accepting the tickets including Hodgsons, Weardale and a number of other independents.Well, for an exile, that's interesting.
So I can get an TNE DaySaver that means any bus in Northumberland, T&W and Co Durham but not into Darlington or the rest of Tees Valley.
Or I can get an Explorer NE ticket that means most buses i.e. Stagecoach, Arriva, Go North East and Travelsure but not the indies like Weardale, Hodgsons or GCT (though I think @darloscott has said before that Explorers are supposedly valid on tendered services in Co Durham but you can't find anything to tell the public that)
I can see a trip around County Durham coming up and revisiting some places that had dropped off the map as Arriva (especially) and Go North East have retreated.
Toby France (commercial manager for the area) is a regular reader of and correspondent to the Oxford Chiltern Bus Page (oxford-chilern-bus-page.co.uk), albeit (not unreasonably) a strident defender of his employer, and returns blunt brickbats with blunt fire. The latest fleetlist uploaded there - which I believe comes courtesy of him - gives an allocation of 34, not including any loans from elsewhere.The quality of service provided in High Wycombe remains very poor. [...]
[Quite snipped for easier reading]
That's good. I am sure he is aware of the level of performance far better than me - my actual observations are fairly limited but, with a few exceptions for buses not tracking, back up what is shown on BusTimes. A response would be interesting. I have no doubt that the team on the ground are doing their best, but the timetables are not achievable in the peaks, not helped by very variable traffic congestion - although outside peak times on some routes there is plenty of spare time. The fleet is old and, because there is no time for anything to get maintained during the day, I suspect everything runs until it drops (legal minimum maintenance checks excepted).Toby France (commercial manager for the area) is a regular reader of and correspondent to the Oxford Chiltern Bus Page (oxford-chilern-bus-page.co.uk), albeit (not unreasonably) a strident defender of his employer, and returns blunt brickbats with blunt fire. The latest fleetlist uploaded there - which I believe comes courtesy of him - gives an allocation of 34, not including any loans from elsewhere.
I suspect that a slightly revised version of your report (making clear what was personally experienced versus what was tracked on bustimes) may generate a response to some of your more operationally minded queries.
The quality of service provided in High Wycombe remains very poor. I paid a brief visit on Tuesday to see if the tracking on BusTimes is reliable. Not entirely, but mostly.
The depot has 33 vehicles, the PVR is 28 or 29, I'm still not sure, but 28 vehicles are required full-time between the peaks.However:...
No SB200s. The single deckers are Citaros, Versas, one SB180 and three Streetlites. The Citaros seem pretty good, but the Versas get the bulk of the town work which probably has the greatest hill content. I don't know how good they are on the hills to be honest.Does Wycombe have any SB200's? Haven't been around the area for a while. They are usually good on the hills.
I imagine the Y reg DLAs (DB250s) have long gone by now...
Hopefully Arriva London can send you some of their 4** series DB300s as some for the 123 are due to be replaced by (slightly newer) ones off the 307. They are quite quick compared to the DB250s and with a Voith 4 speed box, you won't have to hear the engine screaming at 50 on country lanesNo SB200s. The single deckers are Citaros, Versas, one SB180 and three Streetlites. The Citaros seem pretty good, but the Versas get the bulk of the town work which probably has the greatest hill content. I don't know how good they are on the hills to be honest.
Yes the Y reg DLAs have long gone but there is a DB250 - 06 plate ex Leicester - on the books, although it is broken in the yard. Underpowered for the hills I think. Leicester still have a dozen or so of these and with electric deckers coming there soon they may be for cascade.
The cycle on the 2/12 is every 1hr 45mins and two boards are regularly missing, so one journey missing an hour is about normal. It's usually the same two boards - departing Wycombe at 9.00 and 9.45 on the 2 - so I guess people get used to it.I was in High Wycombe last week. The 2 seemed to be missing one bus an hour all day for at least 3 days (including 2 I wanted to catch).
I think DB300s are good buses, much more like a double deck SB200 with a lively Cummins engine, certainly the Arriva North West ones I have been on. That would be great, but cascades from London seem less usual these days.Hopefully Arriva London can send you some of their 4** series DB300s as some for the 123 are due to be replaced by (slightly newer) ones off the 307. They are quite quick compared to the DB250s and with a Voith 4 speed box, you won't have to hear the engine screaming at 50 on country lanes
Some of the DB300's might need some TLC prior to use, DW418 has had more suspension problems than Cristian Romero at Spurs as more electric buses take over the 307, some cascades and shuffles of stock might begin soon, hopefullyThe cycle on the 2/12 is every 1hr 45mins and two boards are regularly missing, so one journey missing an hour is about normal. It's usually the same two boards - departing Wycombe at 9.00 and 9.45 on the 2 - so I guess people get used to it.
During the day today there have been 2 boards missing out of 7 on the 2/12, 2 out of 4 on the 10/13 - although a third one has come out this afternoon with 3020 which has been revived after three weeks off the road, and one missing out of 9 on the 11/800/850. The last I have personally verified, I went into Reading at the time of the missing and it definitely did not run, there were a good number of disgruntled passengers waiting for the 850 at 14.05 who will have had to wait for another hour. This stop in central Reading is about the only one without a 'live times' display as well.
The position is worse than I thought as in fact there seems to be a requirement for 30 buses in the morning peak, 28 between the peaks and 29 in the evening peak. There still appear to be 33 buses based at Wycombe but five - 2790, 2953, 3007, 4212 and 4749 - have been off the road for over a week.
I think DB300s are good buses, much more like a double deck SB200 with a lively Cummins engine, certainly the Arriva North West ones I have been on. That would be great, but cascades from London seem less usual these days.
The X4 timetable at 0925 has the wrong times after Aylesbury.Interurban routes in Buckinghamshire getting a renumbering similar to that with Wycombe urban routes from January. The news item on the website has various mistakes and is hard to understand at the best of times, but essentially:
- 150 (Aylesbury-MK) becomes X4 with no change to timetable, school day 250 becomes X40.
- 500 (Aylesbury-Hemel) becomes X5, taking a faster routing between Aylesbury and Tring.
- X60 (Aylesbury-Buckingham-MK) becomes X6 with no change to timetable.
- 280 (Aylesbury-Thame-Oxford) becomes X7 and X8. The X7 is the full route via Wheatley every 30 minutes, the X8 is shorts every 30 minutes from Oxford to Thame skipping Wheatley (the shorts existed before but went via Wheatley).
- 300 (Aylesbury-Wycombe) becomes X9 with timetable tweaks.
Timetables here. Important to note that Arriva faces competition from local independents on many of these routes (X4 paralleled by Red Rose 100, X7/8 by Redline X20, X9 by Redline 130). Perhaps naively hoping this might signal some improvements in the quality of service - in Oxford the Arriva 280 is a clear poor relation to both local operations, with old and crowded single-deckers entirely unsuited to interurban work.
Oh, not sure why I thought the X5 was a change. Saw the error on X7/X8 and sent an email to Arriva about it, but doubt they'll do anything about it. Interesting that the X4/X6 are moving, definitely doesn't sound good for Aylesbury.There is no revised route on X5, other than the remocal of the school day variation south of Tring.
The X7 X8 timetables have incorrect "automatics" on the direction to Aylesbury.
All in all .... not good at all.
I am advised that the X4 and X6 are likely to be normally worked from Milton Keynes (possibly Leighton Buzzard?) .... so that leaves Aylesbury Garage with around 22 PVR now .... is that enough to survive?
I predict another "Guildford" .....
Interurban routes in Buckinghamshire getting a renumbering similar to that with Wycombe urban routes from January. The news item on the website has various mistakes and is hard to understand at the best of times, but essentially:
- 150 (Aylesbury-MK) becomes X4 with no change to timetable, school day 250 becomes X40.
- 500 (Aylesbury-Hemel) becomes X5, taking a faster routing between Aylesbury and Tring.
- X60 (Aylesbury-Buckingham-MK) becomes X6 with no change to timetable.
- 280 (Aylesbury-Thame-Oxford) becomes X7 and X8. The X7 is the full route via Wheatley every 30 minutes, the X8 is shorts every 30 minutes from Oxford to Thame skipping Wheatley (the shorts existed before but went via Wheatley).
- 300 (Aylesbury-Wycombe) becomes X9 with timetable tweaks.
Timetables here. Important to note that Arriva faces competition from local independents on many of these routes (X4 paralleled by Red Rose 100, X7/8 by Redline X20, X9 by Redline 130). Perhaps naively hoping this might signal some improvements in the quality of service - in Oxford the Arriva 280 is a clear poor relation to both local operations, with old and crowded single-deckers entirely unsuited to interurban work.
There is no revised route on X5, other than the [removal] of the school day variation south of Tring.
The X7 X8 timetables have incorrect "automatics" on the direction to Aylesbury.
All in all .... not good at all.
I am advised that the X4 and X6 are likely to be normally worked from Milton Keynes (possibly Leighton Buzzard?) .... so that leaves Aylesbury Garage with around 22 PVR now .... is that enough to survive?
I predict another "Guildford" .....
Saw the error on X7/X8 and sent an email to Arriva about it, but doubt they'll do anything about it.
Little bit confusing/misleading for potential bus users using the "X" when actually neither the X4 or the X6 are the express route between Aylesbury and Milton Keynes, that actually being the 100 which goes direct not via Buckingham or Leighton Buzzard and the X9 is slower than the 130 with the X90 peak times only
Thanks, happy to be surprised! You've fixed the times on the X7, but not on the X8 (edit: that's fixed too, well done Arriva). Very valuable to have your perspective, definitely interesting to have the insight.The very minor error on the X7/X8 was picked up on Friday evening and resolved this morning at first opportunity. Our apologies for this, but on the contrary, we do address these issues when raised.
We've had a very insightful and interesting debate internally on the best nomenclature of the new services. Ultimately, we can't control the numbering system used by other operators, but our desire to create a simple, cohesive network of interurban services that is both easy to transition for our current customer base as well as being a fresh proposition for potential new bus customers has, in our view, been achieved in the "X" unifier, with our future customer messaging focused around this theme. This'll always be subjective in this community and that's always going to be a creative discussion, but there's no right answer - for us, it's about what is right for our customers, and the ambition to attract new folks to bus is a desire for any company, so we've applied a logic that has been successful elsewhere in the country not only for Arriva but for other networks too.
Sadly, I think you may be in the minority on this one. Any previous attempt to get through to customer service results in being fobbed off and now I have gotten through to the right managers to report wrong or missing bus open data, emails get ignored and with thanks to certain Arriva managers neglect of the operations, some customers have been being given the wrong information for well over 2 years now and there is no hope of that changing.We actively encourage constructive feedback through Arriva's usual channels
I can safely say that I have never had a satisfactory response to 'if it's not achievable, we will always explain why', it has always been a fobbed off answer such as 'we will consider this in the future', years later, same issues remain, no change (basic one of changing a timetable, timetable gives 1 minute between timing points and there are 8 intermediate stops, it's physically impossible, local Arriva division don't care and are happy for the bus to run late every day for the past.... 5+ years I think we are on since the last timetable change. Refusal to work in the quality partnership to harmonise the timing points. One operator has timing points at one stop, Arriva has theirs at the stop after for no reason other than making a confusing timetable etc etc) or no answer at all which is a lot more common than you think.We see every suggestion made, and if not achievable, we will always explain why.