SWR Windsor contactless extension

[Chriso]

Hi everyone. Just had a great day in Windsor with a paper ticket from London . All of the new contactless kit was available at all stations uncovered but unlike Chilterns High Wycombe extension I can’t see any publicity that it’s actually live yet.

guess my question is can I use contactless on the Windsor line? yet as it all seems available but been SWR anything could be the case

 

[Benjwri]

Hi everyone. Just had a great day in Windsor with a paper ticket from London . All of the new contactless kit was available at all stations uncovered but unlike Chilterns High Wycombe extension I can’t see any publicity that it’s actually live yet.

guess my question is can I use contactless on the Windsor line? yet as it all seems available but been SWR anything could be the case

No it will be coming as part of Project Oval but until announced it is not available, and you should not try to tap in/out, as this is not a valid ticket.

 

[cool110]

Those are currently just for flexi seasons and tap2go on ITSO cards.

 

[Haywain]

yet as it all seems available but been SWR anything could be the case

It is all available and in use for SWR's Tap2Go but not for TfL contactless payment.

 

[Bungle965]

I’m almost certain that it was a possibility to add Railcard discounts to Contactless, however such option wasn’t taken up by TfL.

The cynic in me thinks that a whole load more people would suddenly apply to add their Railcard discount onto their payment cards compared to the number that currently go through the rather laborious process currently and that would be a hit to TfL revenue.

 

[Haywain]

I’m almost certain that it was a possibility to add Railcard discounts to Contactless, however such option wasn’t taken up by TfL.

I expect that it is possible to do, but the challenge is how to deal with the revenue protection aspect of confirming that the contactless card user is also the railcard holder without being able to place any sort of 'marker' on the card.

 

[bakerstreet]

I expect that it is possible to do, but the challenge is how to deal with the revenue protection aspect of confirming that the contactless card user is also the railcard holder without being able to place any sort of 'marker' on the card.

In the same way that contactless cards can be listed and then blocked for failed revenue checks, why can’t the same system be used to list (not to bkock) railcard discounts attached to a credit card?

 

[Watershed]

In the same way that contactless cards can be listed and then blocked for failed revenue checks, why can’t the same system be used to list (not to bkock) railcard discounts attached to a credit card?

Indeed. It is - in the scale of things - a trivial exercise. But no end of excuses have been used for postponing the introduction of Railcard discounts on contactless. Meanwhile the paper fares - the only one's Railcard holders can get discounts on - are "adjusted" to add ever more time restrictions. Funny how these sorts of changes always seem to favour the industry...

 

[Chriso]

Thanks for all your informative responses and all very interesting

 

[MikeWh]

I expect that it is possible to do, but the challenge is how to deal with the revenue protection aspect of confirming that the contactless card user is also the railcard holder without being able to place any sort of 'marker' on the card.

I maybe wrong, but my understanding is that discounts on contactless will be provided by issuing a dumb card linked to a payment card in the back office.

In the same way that contactless cards can be listed and then blocked for failed revenue checks, why can’t the same system be used to list (not to bkock) railcard discounts attached to a credit card?

I think the issue is that handling a black or white list is basically off the shelf functionality, but changing that to something more complex would require major software development. Again, I might be wrong. When contactless was in testing mode with real people (including me) using it, the system was set to white mode. When it went live it was switched over to black mode.

 

[MrJeeves]

I maybe wrong, but my understanding is that discounts on contactless will be provided by issuing a dumb card linked to a payment card in the back office.

As in something that is essentially like an Oyster/ITSO smartcard exclusively for the TfL-powered PAYG areas? Sounds interesting, and a decent overall solution.

Who knows, maybe they'd even actually use ITSO!

 

[CyrusWuff]

I believe that work to extend discounts to Contactless is going to have to wait until TfL's next revenue collection contract.

The interesting part will be if a company other than Cubic gets it!

 

[MrJeeves]

The interesting part will be if a company other than Cubic gets it!

Hahahaha, good one!

 

[CyrusWuff]

Hahahaha, good one!

Whilst I suspect I have more chance of winning the Euromillions jackpot than someone other than Cubic getting in, stranger things have happened!

 

[MrJeeves]

Whilst I suspect I have more chance of winning the Euromillions jackpot than someone other than Cubic getting in, stranger things have happened!

I think we'd all win the Euromillions before this happens, though

 

[Haywain]

I maybe wrong, but my understanding is that discounts on contactless will be provided by issuing a dumb card linked to a payment card in the back office.

So something like a postpaid Oyster rather than prepaid.

 

[MikeWh]

So something like a postpaid Oyster rather than prepaid.

Yes.

 

[Haywain]

Yes.

They could just combine it with KeyGo and Tap2Go. They won't, of course...

 

[signed]

You can add a bank card to the TfL app and you have a clear journey history, why can't that be used to link the discount to you?

It could be a very simple switch done in-person to your TfL account to entitle you to the discount, on either a registered Oyster card or any bank card you added.

 

[Haywain]

You can add a bank card to the TfL app and you have a clear journey history, why can't that be used to link the discount to you?

It could be a very simple switch done in-person to your TfL account to entitle you to the discount, on either a registered Oyster card or any bank card you added.

Because it doesn't provide a method of verification during ticket checks.

 

[signed]

Because it doesn't provide a method of verification during ticket checks.

What method of verification does Oyster add that a bank card doesn't?

It's registered the same way, and an Oyster card doesn't have your name printed on it, I fail to see how it doesn’t provide a method?

 

[MrJeeves]

A scanner cannot know whether a contactless card has a Railcard associated with it at the point it's scanned.

Not like I've ever had my Railcard checked on Oyster though...

 

[Haywain]

Not like I've ever had my Railcard checked on Oyster though...

I have, a couple of weeks ago. It was a very thorough check on the Overground with several people asked to produce railcards.

What method of verification does Oyster add that a bank card doesn't?

An Oyster card has the discount applied to the card, so it shows up on a ticket check. That cannot be done with a bank card.

 

[signed]

I see your point, that's fair

This could be done provided proper IT systems are in place, which could do a lookup on TfL servers for that, and it shouldn't take more than one or two second if done properly (and securely of course).

AFAIK direct server contact is already done for Oyster topups at barriers.

 

[Haywain]

I see your point, that's fair

This could be done provided proper IT systems are in place, which could do a lookup on TfL servers for that, and it shouldn't take more than one or two second if done properly (and securely of course)

Subject to connectivity all over a complex transport system, much of it in tunnels.

 

[infobleep]

I have, a couple of weeks ago. It was a very thorough check on the Overground with several people asked to produce railcards.

An Oyster card has the discount applied to the card, so it shows up on a ticket check. That cannot be done with a bank card.

What will they do about the minimum fares on Network Railcards? That is rhe reason that discount doesn't apply to Oyster journeys.

 

[Haywain]

What will they do about the minimum fares on Network Railcards? That is rhe reason that discount doesn't apply to Oyster journeys.

Continue as now, I guess.

 

[Hadders]

Not like I've ever had my Railcard checked on Oyster though

I have - twice. Once on the Piccadilly Line between Holborn and Leicester Square. The other while interchanging at Kings Cross St Pancras.

 

[Benjwri]

A scanner cannot know whether a contactless card has a Railcard associated with it at the point it's scanned.

I don’t see any reason why it couldn’t though… The new scanners can see if a contactless card is tapped in…

 

[Sonic1234]

The new scanners can see if a contactless card is tapped in…

Has this changed? I thought all the scanners could do was see if a contactless card had been previously blocked.

Not that I've ever seen a ticket check within the London Zones.