Yet another Selby to Doncaster booking problem

[mikeg]

Trying to help someone get from Selby to Doncaster today. Unfortunately nothing whatsoever is showing as available in the journey planners. Any idea why this is? I know a way round this using split ticketing at Leeds indirectly but why can’t the direct services be booked or any service on a through ticket? Going via Gilberdyke also doesn’t help on a Sunday and given there’s perfectly good direct services would like to know why these aren’t bookable to Doncaster when they are to , say, Retford or London.

It seems irresponsible of Hull Trains monopolise this route and then not let people make local journeys.

 

[Silver Cobra]

RTT seems to show the stop at Doncaster for Hull Trains services for today as ‘pick up only’.

Realtime Trains | 1A91 0900 Hull to London Kings Cross | 19/01/2025

Real-time train running information for 1A91 0900 departure from Hull to London Kings Cross on 19/01/2025. From Realtime Trains, an independent source of train running info for Great Britain.

www.realtimetrains.co.uk

 

[Peterthegreat]

Trying to help someone get from Selby to Doncaster today. Unfortunately nothing whatsoever is showing as available in the journey planners. Any idea why this is? I know a way round this using split ticketing at Leeds indirectly but why can’t the direct services be booked or any service on a through ticket? Going via Gilberdyke also doesn’t help on a Sunday and given there’s perfectly good direct services would like to know why these aren’t bookable to Doncaster when they are to , say, Retford or London.

It seems irresponsible of Hull Trains monopolise this route and then not let people make local journeys.

For some reason the Doncaster stops on up Hull train services are shown as 'pick up' only.
Trains are diverted via Stevenage so have been retimed. I would suggest someone has made an error when inputting the new times.

 

[mikeg]

Thanks. That's officially ridiculous. Surely they should think about people making all kinds of journeys? Add to that the inability to go via other reasonable routes, it really is a case of stopping people from going where they need to. I'll be complaining to Hull Trains.

I've received a reply to my complaint:

Dear Michael,

Thank you for contacting us at Hull Trains regarding Local Journeys from Selby to Doncaster on a Sunday.

Please note during engineering works where we run into St Pancras our trains became severely overcrowded when we stop at Doncaster due to being the only direct link to London by train (other operators involve a change using rail replacement transport). In order to therefore serve the people of East and North Yorkshire, giving them a direct link to the capital, we took the difficult decision to remove the Doncaster stop. I understand that this has created a problem for yourself, but we do have to try to manage crowding sensibly and with a view to the majority needs of customers. We are also not a monopoly on the route, as Northern operates over the same route as we do, connecting Doncaster and Selby, although I appreciate that they are not running any direct services on Sunday.

I understand that my response may not have been the one that you were hoping for however, I hope that my email has explained our position in this matter.

Thank you for getting in touch.

Unforutnately this makes no sense whatsoever: The stop at Doncaster was set to pick up only, allowing passengers to still get on at Doncaster but not get off. Surely if that's what they wanted to achieve they'd either remove the stop complteltey or better set it to 'set down only', allowing local journeys to be made, yet no passengers to get on and overcrowd the train at Doncaster heading for London.

On a Sunday they do have a monopoly, at least on a through ticket, as there are no direct links found between Selby and Gilberdyke on a Sunday, making it impossible to make this journey on a through ticket. Any advice on how to reply to this non-logic?

 

[Peterthegreat]

---

Sorry this is 100% incorrect. Yesterday trains ran to King's Cross as normal, diverting via the Hertford loop.
It is next Sunday when trains are running to St Pancras.

 

[mikeg]

Sorry this is 100% incorrect. Yesterday trains ran to King's Cross as normal, diverting via the Hertford loop.
It is next Sunday when trains are running to St Pancras.

Good spot! I wasn't referring to trains running into St Pancras either, I was referring to the weekend last gone. Yet again it appears that customer service staff don't know what they're talking about.

 

[Kite159]

"We are also not a monopoly on the route, as Northern operates over the same route as we do, connecting Doncaster and Selby, although I appreciate that they are not running any direct services on Sunday."

Isn't it something like one Northern train a day in each direction (20:54 from Selby towards Sheffield & 20:40 arrival at Selby from Sheffield), when they run and are not diverted via Goole due to lack of route knowledge. Similar to the LNER token offering (1 train from Doncaster towards Selby & 2 trains from Selby towards Doncaster)

 

[mikeg]

"We are also not a monopoly on the route, as Northern operates over the same route as we do, connecting Doncaster and Selby, although I appreciate that they are not running any direct services on Sunday."

Isn't it something like one Northern train a day in each direction (20:54 from Selby towards Sheffield & 20:40 arrival at Selby from Sheffield), when they run and are not diverted via Goole due to lack of route knowledge. Similar to the LNER token offering (1 train from Doncaster towards Selby & 2 trains from Selby towards Doncaster)

Yes, that's also correct! To all practical extents they are a monopoly, with just a couple of LNER and one Northern service a day.

I sent a follow up email. I may have, to quote a former US president, misunderestimated them.

Thank you for your original email.

My apologies for my original response, there may have been some confusion on this as we have several weekends of engineering work upcoming where our timetable differs from normal. I now understand that the issue raised was that on Sundays, the 07:55 am departure from Hull (08:30 am departure from Selby) was not showing in retail systems to travel to Doncaster, as Doncaster was designated as ‘pick-up only’. We have since spoken with our Planning team, as well as Network Rail, and I can confirm the issue has been resolved and the 08:30 am Selby departure is now available for tickets to Doncaster.

You also raised the issue about ‘any permitted’ tickets and the other available routes. It is our understanding that options via Leeds are accepted. We do have a version of the National Routeing Guide and through some of the worked examples we do believe that Leeds, a ‘Routeing Point’ would be valid given that the Anytime single ticket between Leeds and Doncaster is less than the same ticket between Selby and Doncaster under any permitted. York, under this example, would not be a valid station given the equivalent Anytime single is higher for York to Doncaster than for Selby to Doncaster. However, we understand your question about the map permissions. I have spoken with our Commercial department who will speak with their contacts at the Rail Delivery Group to see what is possible about future changes.

I do apologise for any inconvenience caused and I hope the above information is helpful.

Thank you for contacting us at Hull Trains.

Yours sincerely,



Sufiyan

Customer Service Advisor

This is actually a pretty good result by the sounds of it. They semi-understand the Routeing Guide, but I have to give it to them, that's a lot better than most TOC customer service staff and they do seem to be going some way to trying to solve the problem.