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June 2024 reopening of the line between Clitheroe and Hellifield for passenger trains

Bletchleyite

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This is very good news. Mancs will now be able to enjoy the Dales by train.

And because it's Saturday, Lancastrians who used to have DalesRail will be able to connect into it. This is a much better plan than the original (and the useless Lancashire Rambler service that was the biggest "one man, dog and bicycle" service I have ever seen - indeed when I used it I was the one man and didn't even have the dog and bicycle!)
 
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yorksrob

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And because it's Saturday, Lancastrians who used to have DalesRail will be able to connect into it. This is a much better plan than the original (and the useless Lancashire Rambler service that was the biggest "one man, dog and bicycle" service I have ever seen - indeed when I used it I was the one man and didn't even have the dog and bicycle!)

Yes, Saturday has to be the priority.
 

Horseman

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Wonder if they will introduce the service during the week/sundays further down the line if this proves to be a success.
 

Starmill

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This is very good news. Mancs will now be able to enjoy the Dales by train.
There has always been a relevant connection at Blackburn to be fair. However this form of the service is likely to be slightly more efficient
 

Bletchleyite

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There has always been a relevant connection at Blackburn to be fair. However this form of the service is likely to be slightly more efficient

More efficient, more likely to be chosen as a direct train is preferable to a connection for this sort of purpose (as a missed connection is a major problem on once-a-day services), larger direct catchment, larger connectional catchment due to being on a Saturday (e.g. you'll be able to connect with it from West Lancashire which you couldn't with the original DalesRail).

Very little to be said against it to be honest. Less use if you just want to ride all of the S&C, but in practice people doing that on DalesRail were a minority, most wanted to go for a walk (of which there were organised ones). And if you do want to do that you may be better served by popping over to Leeds to join it there, the scenery on which journey is almost as good.
 

Starmill

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More efficient, more likely to be chosen as a direct train is preferable to a connection for this sort of purpose (as a missed connection is a major problem on once-a-day services), larger direct catchment, larger connectional catchment due to being on a Saturday (e.g. you'll be able to connect with it from West Lancashire which you couldn't with the original DalesRail).

Very little to be said against it to be honest. Less use if you just want to ride all of the S&C, but in practice people doing that on DalesRail were a minority, most wanted to go for a walk (of which there were organised ones). And if you do want to do that you may be better served by popping over to Leeds to join it there, the scenery on which journey is almost as good.
Hopefully a relevant flexible fare on route Clitheroe is introduced from stations south of Blackburn. The previous 'DalesRail CDR' Northern Only tickets were withdrawn a couple of years ago.

Advance tickets have never been available from Manchester etc. to Settle / Horton-in-Ribblesdale / Ribblehead (Avanti West Coast have some but they're not relevant to Settle as there's no permitted route you can use them on). Presumably they will be added as Northern love them.
 

norbitonflyer

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I thought that generally only went as far as Clitheroe ?
There is a direct service from Manchester to Clitheroe. But he was refrring to the fact that when the Dalesrail services ran from Preston they connected with the (Rochdale)-Manchester-Clitheroe services at Blackburn.
 

Starmill

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There is a direct service from Manchester to Clitheroe. But he was refrring to the fact that when the Dalesrail services ran from Preston they connected with the (Rochdale)-Manchester-Clitheroe services at Blackburn.
Precisely yes.
 

Gaz67

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Primarily aimed at walkers but a 4 hour day trip to Carlisle is possible which appeals to me, praying for a metro camm on this service.
 

Jamesrob637

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Is there currently such a ticket? Can see a £39.80 (route "Any Permitted") Anytime Return. Is that the one you're referring to?

Just sell lots of cheap Advances on the morning trains out of. and evening trains back to Manchester, which are the most conducive to walkers.
 

Mcr Warrior

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Just sell lots of cheap Advances on the morning trains out of. and evening trains back to Manchester, which are the most conducive to walkers.
Advances for the return journey aren't necessarily the most ideal option for walkers. They'd almost certainly prefer a more flexible option.
 

Bletchleyite

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Advances for the return journey aren't necessarily the most ideal option for walkers. They'd almost certainly prefer a more flexible option.

As only one train each way is applicable to this (any low cost walk up tickets would be routed by these trains only, like DalesRail low cost tickets were) the only disadvantage of Advances is that they aren't refundable. Otherwise the train service doesn't provide for a more flexible option anyway!

So as long as the Advances are available on the day and have a big enough quota to fill the train (as in my observation Northern ones tend to be), that seems no big issue to me.
 

Jamesrob637

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As only one train each way is applicable to this (any low cost walk up tickets would be routed by these trains only, like DalesRail low cost tickets were) the only disadvantage of Advances is that they aren't refundable. Otherwise the train service doesn't provide for a more flexible option anyway!

So as long as the Advances are available on the day and have a big enough quota to fill the train (as in my observation Northern ones tend to be), that seems no big issue to me.

Even if not on the day, during the latter part of the preceding week when the weather forecast can be predicted somewhat more accurately.
 

lyndhurst25

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As only one train each way is applicable to this (any low cost walk up tickets would be routed by these trains only, like DalesRail low cost tickets were) the only disadvantage of Advances is that they aren't refundable. Otherwise the train service doesn't provide for a more flexible option anyway!

So as long as the Advances are available on the day and have a big enough quota to fill the train (as in my observation Northern ones tend to be), that seems no big issue to me.

Advances would prohibit break of journey e.g. stopping off in Settle or Clitheroe on the way home for a pint or fish & chips.
 

Bletchleyite

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Advances would prohibit break of journey e.g. stopping off in Settle or Clitheroe on the way home for a pint or fish & chips.

True, but almost nobody will do that - when I used DalesRail people just took the through journey in the vast majority of cases. Connections onto infrequent services are incredibly risky. The place for a pint will be the lovely little pub in Ribblehead.

Fair point on Clitheroe, though I doubt anyone will want to do it at Blackburn or Bolton! :)
 

Jamesrob637

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True, but almost nobody will do that - when I used DalesRail people just took the through journey in the vast majority of cases. Connections onto infrequent services are incredibly risky. The place for a pint will be the lovely little pub in Ribblehead.

Fair point on Clitheroe, though I doubt anyone will want to do it at Blackburn or Bolton! :)

Clitheroe would be ideal for a new branch of Wetherspoon, however I realise that's more suited to the 'Spoons thread in the General Discussion.
 

47434

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Guards still sign 150s (/1 and /2) at Skipton, but you're right that drivers do not. An interesting conundrum! The simplest option is for Manchester crews to sign as far as Hellifield, as they already sign the Clitheroe line as far as Horrocksford Jct. and 158s.
Are you sure? There is no booked work for Skipton on any diesels other than 158's. They used to.
 

Geeves

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Just from casual browsing it looks like both of the services are currently in the hands of Blackburn drivers and guards, obviously that can change but with them not currently signing anything other than 150s and 156s (and the time ticking by) you can hazard the traction will likely not be a 158. 150+156 is regular on all the Clitheroe work currently. The simple and most reliable way would be Blackburn doing all the work on the extension even it's only from Blackburn and back
 

Neptune

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I’ve just had a look at the J24 Traincrew diagrams and the services will be Blackburn conductors with a single 156 booked. Drivers not on the system yet but will assume the same depot.
 

InkyScrolls

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I’ve just had a look at the J24 Traincrew diagrams and the services will be Blackburn conductors with a single 156 booked. Drivers not on the system yet but will assume the same depot.
That makes the most sense given their location. Are there separate links at BBN? If not, will the whole depot sign CLH - RHD, or just a portion?
 

Neptune

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That makes the most sense given their location. Are there separate links at BBN? If not, will the whole depot sign CLH - RHD, or just a portion?
Not a clue about the ops side of it I’m afraid. Blackburn is a relatively new depot and West/Central isn’t my region. It does make complete sense for Blackburn to work it though.
 

InkyScrolls

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That needs sorting then! There aren't any diagrams for them. I know they used to when 150/2's worked the Lancasters.
To my knowledge they're retained purely for (very rare) 150s coming with a Leeds driver from there to Carlisle - I only worked a 150 once in my three years as a conductor.
 

TheSel

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Is it known whether the North West Rover and North Country Rover tickets' validity will be extended to cover this line?

At the moment, there's a gap between Clitheroe and Hellifield - very possibly because there's currently no passenger service!

(Image below taken from GB Rail Rover guide for the 'North West Rover' ticket.)

1708706978207.png
 
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Jack Hay

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Is it known whether the North West Rover and North Country Rover tickets' validity will be extended to cover this line?

At the moment, there's a gap between Clitheroe and Hellifield - very possibly because there's currently no passenger service!

(Image below taken from GB Rail Rover guide for the 'North West Rover' ticket.)

View attachment 153011
My understanding from the discussion at the stakeholder meeting where I first heard about this is that Northern will introduce new return fares from the Manchester/Lancashire area to the S&C stations valid only via Clitheroe, at a price considerably less than the current open return via the longer route. It would make sense to include it in the rover ticket you describe, I agree. But the question did not come up. Advance tickets were not mentioned. They also said the plan was to use a 156. I said that if this service takes off, that will not be enough.
 

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