Abellio wins West Midlands franchise

[brick60000]

Only a third of trains call at Old Hill and only a minority of trains are 5 and 6 cars long anyway. There is no reason not to do tickets between Stourbridge Junction and Cradley Heath, Cradley and Rowley Regis and so on. You have auto PA and CIS and door controls in every coach on the 172s. Northern guards seem to work without difficulty on its urban trains doing a coach between each station stop. If the number one priority is safety why do I see so many guards sat back down in the rear cab seat before the train is clear of the platform instead of keeping a check for anything untoward?

This is something that amazes me as being allowed. It certainly doesn't help the arguement that DOO isn't good as the driver can't observe the entirety of the departure...

 

[the sniper]

You see Northern guards out all the time on routes of exactly that type.

A lot of good it's done them too... They'll get their DOO/DCO demotion before the West Mids Guards do. Just shows what value there is in Guards doing tickets.

 

[Bletchleyite]

A lot of good it's done them too... They'll get their DOO/DCO demotion before the West Mids Guards do. Just shows what value there is in Guards doing tickets.

I doubt anyone at Northern will get a "DOO demotion". There may be a recruitment freeze, but there's enough existing stock that there will be a need for actual Guards for many years to come.

 

[LowLevel]

I doubt anyone at Northern will get a "DOO demotion". There may be a recruitment freeze, but there's enough existing stock that there will be a need for actual Guards for many years to come.

Do you really think that? Let's take a possible example. Northern make the Aire Valley lines out of Leeds DOO or whatever you want to call it. It's an intensive suburban service requiring a lot of traincrew.

Where do they all go bearing in mind there isn't an equivalent increase in service to replace all those? There are only so many trains around the Harrogate loop.

Relocating across the country to the vacancy is unlikely to be an attractive proposition on guard's wages.

So it very much depends where what is intended to happen, happens, as to whether that area is able to absorb large numbers of displaced guards.

 

[pt_mad]

Question about ex London Overground class 172s going to West Midlands Railway.

Do these operate on LO with a guard, or are they driver controlled?

 

[causton]

Question about ex London Overground class 172s going to West Midlands Railway.

Do these operate on LO with a guard, or are they driver controlled?

DOO. They used to have a guard but now they do not.

 

[pt_mad]

DOO. They used to have a guard but now they do not.

So do they have controls at doors for guard operation if needed?

 

[HLE]

I wouldn’t have thought they would have been removed to be honest.

 

[trains2064]

Question about ex London Overground class 172s going to West Midlands Railway.

Do these operate on LO with a guard, or are they driver controlled?

Sadly it’s as easy to change modern units from Guard Controlling the doors to DOO/DCO as it is to in reverse!

 

[6Gman]

Whilst I can't remember the last time my ticket was checked on the Snow Hill lines, but I get checked every day Birmingham to Crewe and quite frequently Crewe - Smethwick Galton Bridge. Mind you when I used to get the 07:15 Birmingham-Crewe, I didn't see a Virgin Guard for months and that was before New Street & Crewe had barriers.

Between Crewe & New Street I'd say ticket checked 80% with LM, 5% with VTWC.

 

[trains2064]

TBH I think the Snow Hill lines Guards are the best for tickets of the old LM areas. You could go Brum to Euston and back and never be checked!

 

[Kite159]

TBH I think the Snow Hill lines Guards are the best for tickets of the old LM areas. You could go Brum to Euston and back and never be checked!

Or never know there was a guard on board in some cases (ie they make no announcements nor leaving the rear cab between stations).

 

[pt_mad]

DOO. They used to have a guard but now they do not.

These ex London Overground 172s that are DOO. Are they fitted with bodyside cameras or is dispatch done with platform mirrors?

If it's bodyside cameras, does that mean west midlands trains are likely to want to run them in driver controlled operation on those routes, or will they just be set up for guard operation asap after the stock is acquired?

 

[Bletchleyite]

They appear to have cameras.

 

[strawbrick]

My experience on LM services into and out of EUS from HML has been that the number of Guards / Conductors who ever emerge from their "offices" has been in slow decline over the last five years until it has almost vanished. The majority never ever make any announcements, probably on the assumption that the train announcements will do the job for them, and spend the journey in the cab, except to step onto the platform to check that the train has indeed stopped at the platform and so they can open the doors. I would say that the vast majority of passengers do not even know the Guards are on the train.
The Travelling Inspectors who regularly appeared under Silverlink have completely disappeared. In addition to the absence of ticket checks on the trains, they are sparse at both ends of my journey as the gate-lines are generally unmanned in the very early morning (EUS), early morning (HML), afternoon onwards (HML) and early evening onwards (EUS).
Clearly LM had never heard of the approach to revenue protection that my son's school took to discipline outside the school gate - "Expectation & Vigilance" (We expect you to behave and we will be watching to see that you do - it works wonders!).
Many a time I have wondered why I bothered to buy a ticket ...
Let's hope that LNR can do better.

 

[Cletus]

I was on an Harrow & Wealdstone to Euston train this afternoon, and there a full ticket check, including checking my railcard. Never had happen to me with LM.

 

[trains2064]

These ex London Overground 172s that are DOO. Are they fitted with bodyside cameras or is dispatch done with platform mirrors?

If it's bodyside cameras, does that mean west midlands trains are likely to want to run them in driver controlled operation on those routes, or will they just be set up for guard operation asap after the stock is acquired?

It wouldn’t suprise me if the is a trip to derby and they return looking like the other ones with corridor cabs and toilets. The Camera’s removed but wires and everything else left in place for future use.

 

[causton]

I was on an Harrow & Wealdstone to Euston train this afternoon, and there a full ticket check, including checking my railcard. Never had happen to me with LM.

You have been very lucky today then. As of yet, no policies have changed! In time, maybe Abellio will realise what is going on and focus a bit more on revenue protection, we all hope!...

 

[gray1404]

Will LNR be re-introducing seat reservations on any of their services under the new franchise? Perhaps the Crewe-Euston services?

 

[Bletchleyite]

Will LNR be re-introducing seat reservations on any of their services under the new franchise? Perhaps the Crewe-Euston services?

Unless they can do it properly (longer turnarounds and placing them before the train is advertised and the doors unlocked) I hope not. When they did it was an utter shambles, they used to come through and turf commuters out a couple of minutes before departure. This is not OK.

 

[JordyWM]

Those ex London Underground stock that’s supposed to be coming to the West Midlands franchise truly look awful and dated. I’d rather have more 153’s than that junk.

 

[trash80]

I wouldn't, i've travelled on a lot of 153s and D78s and i know which one i found more comfortable.

 

[DenmarkRail]

Unless they can do it properly (longer turnarounds and placing them before the train is advertised and the doors unlocked) I hope not. When they did it was an utter shambles, they used to come through and turf commuters out a couple of minutes before departure. This is not OK.

Veservations could be given on the ticket, or mobile phone, therefore there would not be a need for paper waste on the train.

 

[ChrisHogan]

Veservations could be given on the ticket, or mobile phone, therefore there would not be a need for paper waste on the train.

And how would other passengers know the seat was reserved without a reserved ticket? Same scenario as in post #1370, surely?

Better to wait until 2022 and the new Aventras come and provide them with a 800 style reservation system.

 

[387star]

Have West midlands trains given assurances about guards ? Or will this company become the sixth to be in dispute

 

[sd0733]

no they haven't. They've committed to a second person as per all the others.
to be honest nobody has been told a thing about anything its quiet about everything from the new company.

 

[E_Reeves]

I don't think some staff are quite used to the franchise change yet. Just heard an announcement "Platform 3 for the xx:xx London... NorthWestern... Railway service to Crewe". I bet it must be tricky not to say London Midland if you've been working there a long time?

 

[capoldi]

You have been very lucky today then. As of yet, no policies have changed! In time, maybe Abellio will realise what is going on and focus a bit more on revenue protection, we all hope!...

Well something has changed. 5 years on the same route Canley to Birmingham, ticket checked 5 or 6 times in all those years. In the last three weeks? Every. Single. Day.

If policies haven't changed, then I don't know what the reason is!

 

[12guard4]

L

Well something has changed. 5 years on the same route Canley to Birmingham, ticket checked 5 or 6 times in all those years. In the last three weeks? Every. Single. Day.

If policies haven't changed, then I don't know what the reason is!

The policy would have always been to do tickets where possible. Nothing really Abellio can do to force the issue, offer extra incentives maybe. That wouldn't have happened though.

 

[capoldi]

L


The policy would have always been to do tickets where possible. Nothing really Abellio can do to force the issue, offer extra incentives maybe. That wouldn't have happened though.

So this complete change in ticket checks remains a mystery!