Airport services and how do fares vary around the UK

[busestrains]

In regards to Glasgow Airport that was discussed earlier on in this thread i have found out the 77 fares.

The 77 costs £5.40 Single (no Return available) from Glasgow Airport to Glasgow City Centre or vice versa. Every other journey anywhere on First Glasgow costs £1.70 Single or £2.50 Single (which one depends on the distance) so this bus fare is over double the cost of the maximum bus fare anywhere else on their network even for much longer distances.

However there is a trick you can do to get it cheaper by using split tickets like on the railway. A bus ticket from Glasgow Airport to the first stop after the airport costs £1.70 Single and then a bus ticket from the first stop after the airport to Glasgow City Centre costs £2.50 Single so all together than is £4.20 total. So you can reduce it from £5.40 to £4.20 saving £1.20 by splitting and buying two tickets on this bus. A rare example of split ticketing working on buses.

You can get it for £2.50 total by walking from the airport to the first stop after the airport if you are happy with walking but unfortunately unlike at Bristol and Luton this one is actually quite a far walk and takes at least twenty to thirty minutes depending on your walking speed. So it is more difficult to avoid the surcharge at Glasgow Airport here.

In regards to the rip off hotel buses it looks like Gatwick and Stansted both have similar rip off hotel buses just like the Hotel Hoppa service that Heathrow has (although not quite as expensive).

Gatwick Airport has the Gatwick Hoppa route GH1 bus. It charges £3.50 Single and £7.00 Return (which is very odd as normally a Return ticket gives a discount over buying two Single tickets). However the local Metrobus routes (3/4/5/10/20/21/22/100/200/400/420/460) or Southdown PSV routes (422/424) to all these hotels are over half price cheaper at £1.70 Single (no Return tickets available). Just like at Heathrow Airport using the local Metrobus and Southdown PSV is cheaper and quicker and more frequent and larger buses. So again another rip off scheme that Gatwick Hoppa (whoever own them now NSL withdrew the service) are running.

There also appears to be the I7 and I8 hotel buses at Gatwick Airport but no information on them and what they charge.

Stansted Airport has the unnumbered hotel shuttle buses too (and i have no idea who runs them as Bus Times suggests it is Stansted Airport but some other sources say it is "Bus 4 Us" so who knows) running to a couple of local hotels. It costs £4.00 Single (no Return tickets available). However the local Arriva buses routes (309/508/509/510) cost you just £1.60 Single or £2.50 Return (so again much cheaper). Again like at Heathrow and Gatwick the local Arriva bus is cheaper and quicker and more frequent and has larger buses. So another rip off scheme.

On the point about the Hotel Hoppa at Heathrow Airport working on the bases of convenience i can not say that i agree with that. The local buses are far more convenient. The local buses run at least every ten minutes while the Hotel Hoppa runs once an hour. The local buses reach most hotels within ten minutes or so while the Hotel Hoppa often takes up to thirty or fourty minutes. The local buses stop right outside the airport building while the Hotel Hoppa stops are slightly further away. So i fail to see how the Hotel Hoppa works on the basis of convenience. I think anyone at Heathrow Airport would find the local buses to be far more convenient.

 

[TheGrandWazoo]

On the point about the Hotel Hoppa at Heathrow Airport working on the bases of convenience i can not say that i agree with that. The local buses are far more convenient. The local buses run at least every ten minutes while the Hotel Hoppa runs once an hour. The local buses reach most hotels within ten minutes or so while the Hotel Hoppa often takes up to thirty or fourty minutes. The local buses stop right outside the airport building while the Hotel Hoppa stops are slightly further away. So i fail to see how the Hotel Hoppa works on the basis of convenience. I think anyone at Heathrow Airport would find the local buses to be far more convenient.

It depends how you're looking at convenience, and how others perceive it.

You're quite happy and able to walk out and get the local bus. Your circumstances and knowledge enable you to do that. That's a knowledge that is atypical.

Many people aren't regular bus users. They're perhaps not familiar with where buses go or even how to find out the information. So for them, the convenience is a dedicated service that arrives outside their hotel foyer and takes them directly to where they want to go.

 

[Deerfold]

Half hourly on the 703 (Reading Buses operated Greenline) by the looks of it? Though you do have to walk half a mile first. Surprisingly bad but not impossible. Probably an Uber job.

Doable, but definitely the worst connected. My wife's stay was before the 703 started.

 

[Bletchleyite]

It depends how you're looking at convenience, and how others perceive it.

You're quite happy and able to walk out and get the local bus. Your circumstances and knowledge enable you to do that. That's a knowledge that is atypical.

Many people aren't regular bus users. They're perhaps not familiar with where buses go or even how to find out the information. So for them, the convenience is a dedicated service that arrives outside their hotel foyer and takes them directly to where they want to go.

Agreed. They also probably don't know what a bus fare typically is (at least before the shouting around the £2 thing) so won't necessarily know whether it's poor value or not.

Before the Hoppa hotels tended to operate their own minibuses, but these were in my understanding banned from Heathrow once it was introduced. I was actually on a trip to the US across its introduction - we did a "park and stay" deal at one of the hotels (couldn't tell you which) and it was their shuttle on the way out and the new Hoppa on the way back.

 

[duncombec]

Is it not also the case that Hotel Hoppa services are still running a relatively restricted timetable in comparison to pre-Covid times, hence why the frequencies seem so low?

I've just fished my 2016 leaflet out of the cupboard (when still operated by National Express), and most hotels have a 30 minute daytime service increased to 20 minutes in the peaks (early mornings and end of working day), with separate services from Terminals 2/3, 4, and 5.

It also looks to me, from the lists of hotels served on the current website, that those closest to the terminals are served by multiple routes, so it isn't actually an hour's wait at all.

I think most passengers expect to pay a premium for anything at the airport. The bus is still cheaper than long-term parking, food and drink past security is expensive... it's just a "standard cost" on the budget, just as at some airports you know if you fly with a cheaper carrier, you will be bussed around the airfield standing next to someone's armpit.

 

[Hophead]

Gatwick Airport has the Gatwick Hoppa route GH1 bus. It charges £3.50 Single and £7.00 Return (which is very odd as normally a Return ticket gives a discount over buying two Single tickets). However the local Metrobus routes (3/4/5/10/20/21/22/100/200/400/420/460) or Southdown PSV routes (422/424) to all these hotels are over half price cheaper at £1.70 Single (no Return tickets available). Just like at Heathrow Airport using the local Metrobus and Southdown PSV is cheaper and quicker and more frequent and larger buses. So again another rip off scheme that Gatwick Hoppa (whoever own them now NSL withdrew the service) are running.

There also appears to be the I7 and I8 hotel buses at Gatwick Airport but no information on them and what they charge.

But neither Metrobus nor Southdown actually go to any of these hotels. They may pass close to some of them, and there may be stops some walk away, but most folk off on their holidays really aren't going to traipse around the local roads in search of a bus stop, no matter how much they save. If a family regards the fares (for such a group the charge is £9 single) as a "rip-off", then I daresay a minicab can be arranged.

 

[Deerfold]

But neither Metrobus nor Southdown actually go to any of these hotels. They may pass close to some of them, and there may be stops some walk away, but most folk off on their holidays really aren't going to traipse around the local roads in search of a bus stop, no matter how much they save. If a family regards the fares (for such a group the charge is £9 single) as a "rip-off", then I daresay a minicab can be arranged.

Metrobus would beg to differ that they don't go to these hotels with plenty of hotels having their own named stop. They're keen to let people know the fares too, unusually for many bus companies.

Gatwick Hotels we serve

If you are travelling between Gatwick Airport and a local hotel this guide may be of use to you.

www.metrobus.co.uk

Gatwick Hotels we serve

If you are travelling between Gatwick Airport and a local hotel this guide may be of use to you.

Follow signs showing 'Local Public Buses (Metrobus)' to the bus stops at both terminals.

If you are unfamiliar with the area our buses are fitted with 'next stop' information that announce the name of the next bus stop - both visually and audibly.

...

ARORA INTERNATIONAL GATWICK (Southgate Avenue, Crawley, RH10 6LW)
From South Terminal (southbound) bus stop:
Fastway 10 (towards Bewbush/Broadfield)
Fastway 20 (towards Bewbush/Broadfield)
Get off at Arora bus stop.

...

BEST WESTERN SKYLANE HOTEL (34 Bonehurst Road, Horley RH6 8QF)
From South Terminal (northbound ) bus stop:
Fastway 100 (towards Redhill)
Route 400 (towards Caterham)
Route 460 (towards Epsom)
get off at Skylane Hotel bus stop.

Adult single fare £3.

...


COPTHORNE HOTEL LONDON GATWICK (Copthorne Way, Copthorne, RH10 3PG)
From South Terminal (southbound) bus stop:
Route 400 (towards East Grinstead)
Get off at Copthorne Hotel bus stop.

Adult single fare £2.60.

...

CROWNE PLAZA HOTEL (Tushmore Roundabout, London Road, Crawley, RH11 7SX )
From South Terminal (southbound) bus stop:
Route 4 or 5 (towards Pound Hill)
Get off at Crowne Plaza bus stop.

Adult single fare £2.60.

...

FELBRIDGE HOTEL (London Road, East Grinstead)
From South Terminal (southbound) bus stop:
Route 400 (towards East Grinstead)
Get off at Felbridge Hotel bus stop.

Adult single fare from £4.40.

...

PREMIER INN GATWICK MANOR HOTEL (London Road, Lowfield Heath, Crawley, RH10 9ST)
From South Terminal (southbound) bus stop:
Fastway 100 (towards Maidenbower)
Route 4 or 5 (towards Pound Hill)
Get off at Gatwick Manor Hotel bus stop.

Adult single fare £2.60.

Their Crawley map clearly shows their stops at hotels:

https://images-metrobus.passenger-website.com/2022-07/METROBUS%20CRAWLEY%20%26%20HORLEY%20NETWORK%20JULY%202022%20A4%20Proof%202%20RGB%20for%20web.pdf

 

[route101]

In regards to Glasgow Airport that was discussed earlier on in this thread i have found out the 77 fares.

The 77 costs £5.40 Single (no Return available) from Glasgow Airport to Glasgow City Centre or vice versa. Every other journey anywhere on First Glasgow costs £1.70 Single or £2.50 Single (which one depends on the distance) so this bus fare is over double the cost of the maximum bus fare anywhere else on their network even for much longer distances.

However there is a trick you can do to get it cheaper by using split tickets like on the railway. A bus ticket from Glasgow Airport to the first stop after the airport costs £1.70 Single and then a bus ticket from the first stop after the airport to Glasgow City Centre costs £2.50 Single so all together than is £4.20 total. So you can reduce it from £5.40 to £4.20 saving £1.20 by splitting and buying two tickets on this bus. A rare example of split ticketing working on buses.

You can get it for £2.50 total by walking from the airport to the first stop after the airport if you are happy with walking but unfortunately unlike at Bristol and Luton this one is actually quite a far walk and takes at least twenty to thirty minutes depending on your walking speed. So it is more difficult to avoid the surcharge at Glasgow Airport here.

In regards to the rip off hotel buses it looks like Gatwick and Stansted both have similar rip off hotel buses just like the Hotel Hoppa service that Heathrow has (although not quite as expensive).

Gatwick Airport has the Gatwick Hoppa route GH1 bus. It charges £3.50 Single and £7.00 Return (which is very odd as normally a Return ticket gives a discount over buying two Single tickets). However the local Metrobus routes (3/4/5/10/20/21/22/100/200/400/420/460) or Southdown PSV routes (422/424) to all these hotels are over half price cheaper at £1.70 Single (no Return tickets available). Just like at Heathrow Airport using the local Metrobus and Southdown PSV is cheaper and quicker and more frequent and larger buses. So again another rip off scheme that Gatwick Hoppa (whoever own them now NSL withdrew the service) are running.

There also appears to be the I7 and I8 hotel buses at Gatwick Airport but no information on them and what they charge.

Stansted Airport has the unnumbered hotel shuttle buses too (and i have no idea who runs them as Bus Times suggests it is Stansted Airport but some other sources say it is "Bus 4 Us" so who knows) running to a couple of local hotels. It costs £4.00 Single (no Return tickets available). However the local Arriva buses routes (309/508/509/510) cost you just £1.60 Single or £2.50 Return (so again much cheaper). Again like at Heathrow and Gatwick the local Arriva bus is cheaper and quicker and more frequent and has larger buses. So another rip off scheme.

On the point about the Hotel Hoppa at Heathrow Airport working on the bases of convenience i can not say that i agree with that. The local buses are far more convenient. The local buses run at least every ten minutes while the Hotel Hoppa runs once an hour. The local buses reach most hotels within ten minutes or so while the Hotel Hoppa often takes up to thirty or fourty minutes. The local buses stop right outside the airport building while the Hotel Hoppa stops are slightly further away. So i fail to see how the Hotel Hoppa works on the basis of convenience. I think anyone at Heathrow Airport would find the local buses to be far more convenient.

I think the £5.40 fare applies on trips from Glasgow to Hamilton too. As for the 77 there is nothing stopping anyone using a city day ticket to the airport!

 

[Hophead]

Metrobus would beg to differ that they don't go to these hotels with plenty of hotels having their own named stop. They're keen to let people know the fares too, unusually for many bus companies.

Gatwick Hotels we serve

If you are travelling between Gatwick Airport and a local hotel this guide may be of use to you.

www.metrobus.co.uk

Their Crawley map clearly shows their stops at hotels:

https://images-metrobus.passenger-website.com/2022-07/METROBUS%20CRAWLEY%20%26%20HORLEY%20NETWORK%20JULY%202022%20A4%20Proof%202%20RGB%20for%20web.pdf

I stand partially corrected and serves me right for just getting my information from Gatwick Hoppa & Google Maps. However, of the 5 hotels which GH serve, only 2 are also on Metrobus's list and the Hoppa stop is right outside both, rather than a trek out to Povey Cross Road for the 100.

Obviously, Metrobus are to be commended for their efforts to promote travel to the airport terminals, but it is clear to me that the Hoppa has its place for a subset of the Gatwick hotels. And a quick perusal of some of the hotel websites on their list suggests that Metrobus haven't made much progress there, sadly.

 

[Tetchytyke]

I'll say here what I said about the Heathrow Express fares.

The last time I flew from Heathrow was on a honeymoon that cost £4000. In that context, I couldn't give the tiniest toss about being "overcharged" a tenner.

In a similar vein, the last time I flew from here to Bristol it was about £100 return and the hotel cost £90 a night. In that context, I'm not fretting about First "overcharging" me by a fiver.

 

[TheGrandWazoo]

I'll say here what I said about the Heathrow Express fares.

The last time I flew from Heathrow was on a honeymoon that cost £4000. In that context, I couldn't give the tiniest toss about being "overcharged" a tenner.

In a similar vein, the last time I flew from here to Bristol it was about £100 return and the hotel cost £90 a night. In that context, I'm not fretting about First "overcharging" me by a fiver.

I think that's the common view of most people. To be honest, when I'm with my better half (and she's not a high maintenance babe and is fairly public transport friendly), the idea of yomping half a mile to save a tenner simply doesn't cut any ice.

It's obviously different for airport workers but then again, they tend to have discounted travel passes.

 

[busestrains]

I stand partially corrected and serves me right for just getting my information from Gatwick Hoppa & Google Maps. However, of the 5 hotels which GH serve, only 2 are also on Metrobus's list and the Hoppa stop is right outside both, rather than a trek out to Povey Cross Road for the 100.

Obviously, Metrobus are to be commended for their efforts to promote travel to the airport terminals, but it is clear to me that the Hoppa has its place for a subset of the Gatwick hotels. And a quick perusal of some of the hotel websites on their list suggests that Metrobus haven't made much progress there, sadly.

One of the hotels that the GH1 serves is a five minute walk from the South Terminal building and one of the hotels that the GH1 serves is a five minute walk from the North Terminal building. So those two are obviously not on the Metrobus list as there is no other bus to them. Taking a bus to reach these hotels is a complete and utter joke. You can walk to these hotels in less than five minutes. Why would you pay for a bus when you can walk there in five minutes saving yourself money and probably saving you time too.

The various hotels in Hookwood are just a sixty second walk out the bus stops on Povey Cross Road so i would not call that a trek. If you can walk from your hotel room to the front of the hotel then you can walk an extra sixty seconds or so out to the bus stops on the road to catch the local bus. So i think the local bus to and from these hotels is very convenient.

All of the hotels around Gatwick have bus stops with local buses on the road outside the hotels. It might not be outside the front door but it is within sixty second walk from the hotels. So it is very convenient and not exactly a long or complicating walk or anything.

Also note that Metrobus hotel page has the wrong fares for many hotels. Some of them cost £2.70 but yet some of them (such as the Povey Cross Road ones around the Hookwood area) only cost £1.70 to get there. None of them cost £2.60 any more as the fares increased almost a year ago. So that page needs to be updated.

 

[Tetchytyke]

It's obviously different for airport workers but then again, they tend to have discounted travel passes.

Experience from my younger days is that airport wages (like motorway services wages) tended to reflect the fact it was more expensive to get to work.

It's been a while since those days, mind!

 

[busestrains]

I'll say here what I said about the Heathrow Express fares.

The last time I flew from Heathrow was on a honeymoon that cost £4000. In that context, I couldn't give the tiniest toss about being "overcharged" a tenner.

In a similar vein, the last time I flew from here to Bristol it was about £100 return and the hotel cost £90 a night. In that context, I'm not fretting about First "overcharging" me by a fiver.

That is fine if you are happy to pay it and i am sure there are many other people who have the same view as you. However there are also many people who find these airport fares very expensive and do care about these extra charges. Many people that are travelling to and from the airport are travelling on a budget and do not have much money therefore for them an extra five or ten pounds than what it would normally cost is a far bigger issue for them. Not everyone is on an expensive holiday. Plus regardless of if you have the money or not it just comes across as a bit dishonest for bus companies to charge these higher airport fares. It is like they are just trying to take advantage and make more money. They would not get away with it anywhere else. It gives a very poor first impression of an airport and a city when the first thing you are greeted with is a rip off public transport service.

 

[GusB]

That is fine if you are happy to pay it and i am sure there are many other people who have the same view as you. However there are also many people who find these airport fares very expensive and do care about these extra charges. Many people that are travelling to and from the airport are travelling on a budget and do not have much money therefore for them an extra five or ten pounds than what it would normally cost is a far bigger issue for them. Not everyone is on an expensive holiday. Plus regardless of if you have the money or not it just comes across as a bit dishonest for bus companies to charge these higher airport fares. It is like they are just trying to take advantage and make more money. They would not get away with it anywhere else. It gives a very poor first impression of an airport and a city when the first thing you are greeted with is a rip off public transport service.

I get the point you're trying to make here, but I'm not sure it's fair to criticise the bus companies for passing on what are additional charges levied by the airport; are they supposed to absorb the cost, thereby hitting their own bottom line? It might just be feasible if there are enough passengers to make it profitable, but if the charge imposed by the airport for using its facilities is more than the profit margin that the bus company can make, it effectively becomes a subsidy to the airport and the bus company loses money for every journey if they cannot pass that cost on.

 

[Tetchytyke]

Plus regardless of if you have the money or not it just comes across as a bit dishonest for bus companies to charge these higher airport fares.

I get your point, but there is a cost to providing these services that is higher than your usual city buses. Is it a "rip off" to charge a premium fare for a premium service that might not otherwise run?

Liverpool is an interesting example. It used to have dedicated non-stop express buses to the city centre which charged a premium fare. Thr service no longer charges a premium fare but, also, it is no longer a non-stop express bus and the frequency is half of what it once was.

As for "expensive holidays", the days of 99p Ryanair flights are long gone. If you're paying sixty quid to fly, and the same again per night in a budget hotel, an extra fiver is neither here nor there.

 

[RJ]

Either by walking from Luton Airport to Luton Airport Parkway (a quick and easy walk to do and the cheapest option) or by taking the Arriva bus (A/100/757) which is almost half the price of the shuttle bus (888) service.

I think if it was genuinely a quick and easy walk, there wouldn’t be a bus service that is often oversubscribed. It takes the best part of 30 minutes - and more than a few people travelling to an airport might just have luggage and children in tow.

 

[Bletchleyite]

I think if it was genuinely a quick and easy walk, there wouldn’t be a bus service that is often oversubscribed. It takes the best part of 30 minutes - and more than a few people travelling to an airport might just have luggage and children in tow.

I wouldn't call it a quick and easy walk with luggage - it's a fair way and uphill. However I do recommend the Arriva bus instead, that's what I do. Exit the station on the other side and there it is.

However, most people won't know the area and will just use the default option - see also Tube travel from Leicester Square to Covent Garden.

 

[TheGrandWazoo]

I think if it was genuinely a quick and easy walk, there wouldn’t be a bus service that is often oversubscribed. It takes the best part of 30 minutes - and more than a few people travelling to an airport might just have luggage and children in tow.

I wouldn't call it a quick and easy walk with luggage - it's a fair way and uphill. However I do recommend the Arriva bus instead, that's what I do. Exit the station on the other side and there it is.

However, most people won't know the area and will just use the default option - see also Tube travel from Leicester Square to Covent Garden.

Absolutely. For me, a fit person on his own, a mile walk uphill with a small case is absolutely fine. Factor in stuff like age, fitness, kids, cases - it's no wonder why people use the dedicated facilities.

I really do appreciate @busestrains position and that works for him - he has both the personal circumstances, fitness and knowledge to be able to act in that way. Most people simple don't have that (and that's why it becomes a captive market). We can say the same about the cost of concessions at airports, or the cost of petrol at motorway service stations, or snacks in cinemas. You can get around all of these but the perceived "convenience" and "value" is different for different people.

As an aside, I had a day exploring locally about this time last year. The weather was supposed to be unsettled but I decided to try the 54/55 services via Bristol Airport from Clevedon to Hengrove. That morning was constant rain from about 0830 to 1100 - if I'd been flying to/from Bristol Airport that day, I'd have paid the extra to travel to the airport rather than being drenched!

That is fine if you are happy to pay it and i am sure there are many other people who have the same view as you. However there are also many people who find these airport fares very expensive and do care about these extra charges. Many people that are travelling to and from the airport are travelling on a budget and do not have much money therefore for them an extra five or ten pounds than what it would normally cost is a far bigger issue for them. Not everyone is on an expensive holiday. Plus regardless of if you have the money or not it just comes across as a bit dishonest for bus companies to charge these higher airport fares. It is like they are just trying to take advantage and make more money. They would not get away with it anywhere else. It gives a very poor first impression of an airport and a city when the first thing you are greeted with is a rip off public transport service.

I don't think it's dishonest - that's the price. It's what is levied onto them and they have to pass it to the passenger; in Bristol, with the A1/A3, they don't even set the fares.

As has been said before, it's either that or a) it's incorporated into your airfare but if you do that then b) you may not have the range of flights from that airport. Which do you prefer?

As for poor impressions of an airport or city, when arriving in Budapest in 2012, the public transport option was a bus to some bus station underneath a Tesco before a Soviet era metro into the city centre. Cheaper than a taxi but not a great first impression!

 

[johncrossley]

Airport hotels in other countries often have a free shuttle to the airport, which means you can save money on the service bus. For example, Brussels airport has premium fares on some local buses and on trains, but you can get a free bus to the Ibis. I was staying at the Ibis anyway, but it did occur to me that a loophole from the airport to the city centre (or anywhere else in the city) is available by using that hotel bus and then catching the tram from Eurocontrol which is next to the Ibis. Amsterdam airport is similar. There is a cluster of hotels south of the airport, for example Moxy, Bastion, Best Western, which have free shuttles to the airport. But they are only about every half hour. There is a bus stop on the BRT system next door with buses every few minutes, but you have to pay.

Thinking about it, I don't think I've ever paid for a dedicated hotel shuttle anywhere. For London airports I travel direct to/from home.

 

[neilmc]

As for poor impressions of an airport or city, when arriving in Budapest in 2012, the public transport option was a bus to some bus station underneath a Tesco before a Soviet era metro into the city centre. Cheaper than a taxi but not a great first impression!

View attachment 121495

Well you can now get an express bus to the city centre from Budapest Airport for 900 HUF (around £2) though you can also buy a book of tickets (ten for 3000 HUF) and use two as described above in the event that your destination is more convenient for the metro.

On our recent visit we were staying out in the sticks and rather than lug cases across Budapest we approached from Szolnok, alighted at the airport railway station and used above tickets for the shuttle to the terminal. Transport in Hungary is charged on a mileage basis, plus a small increment for express services which require pre-booking. It's a joy travelling in a country which sees public transport as an essential service rather than a profit base, and you can cross the entire country for the price of the Heathrow Shuttle.

 

[Deerfold]

I stand partially corrected and serves me right for just getting my information from Gatwick Hoppa & Google Maps. However, of the 5 hotels which GH serve, only 2 are also on Metrobus's list and the Hoppa stop is right outside both, rather than a trek out to Povey Cross Road for the 100.

Obviously, Metrobus are to be commended for their efforts to promote travel to the airport terminals, but it is clear to me that the Hoppa has its place for a subset of the Gatwick hotels. And a quick perusal of some of the hotel websites on their list suggests that Metrobus haven't made much progress there, sadly.

Metrobus's list is rather longer - I only quoted the ones with their own named stop. The only hotel they don't serve is the Marriott.

As Gatwick Hoppa only serves hotels and the airport, they seem to be somewhat slapdash - they can't spell "Premier" as in "Premier Inn" - they also don't mention which of the 2 Premier Inns in the area they serve.. The Holiday Inn is a Holiday Inn Express. And they have the oddest way of showing their times I've seen in a long time.

 

[TheGrandWazoo]

Well you can now get an express bus to the city centre from Budapest Airport for 900 HUF (around £2) though you can also buy a book of tickets (ten for 3000 HUF) and use two as described above in the event that your destination is more convenient for the metro.

Comparing prices is a bit of a misnomer when you consider the difference in wages and cost of living.

We accept the basic premise that premium products attract higher fares, or that convenience costs. In the same way that it may be cheaper to get the tube the Heathrow from central London on the tube vs Heathrow Express, then the same occurs with bus fares. However, I would say that, as in any market, the premium/convenience aspect has to have value in the eyes of the consumer.

 

[ctrh136]

One thing I just noticed was that it looks like all National Express services from Gatwick to London operate via Heathrow - this seems very roundabout to me! I remember they used to operate via Wallington so is this just a recent thing because of Covid or just because the traffic in South London is so bad that it's not worth going that way? I wonder also how much of an effect Oyster to Gatwick has had.

 

[Deerfold]

One thing I just noticed was that it looks like all National Express services from Gatwick to London operate via Heathrow - this seems very roundabout to me! I remember they used to operate via Wallington so is this just a recent thing because of Covid or just because the traffic in South London is so bad that it's not worth going that way? I wonder also how much of an effect Oyster to Gatwick has had.

This is a post Covid thing. It's replaced the Brighton to Heathrow via Gatwick and the Brighton to London services which were both up to hourly. I assume it's due to less traffic.

It also provides an hourly service Heathrow to Victoria. Previously this was a route of variable frequency and many of the previous routes no longer run or run less frequently.

 

[route101]

One thing I just noticed was that it looks like all National Express services from Gatwick to London operate via Heathrow - this seems very roundabout to me! I remember they used to operate via Wallington so is this just a recent thing because of Covid or just because the traffic in South London is so bad that it's not worth going that way? I wonder also how much of an effect Oyster to Gatwick has had.

I wonder if National Express will ever bring the Brighton to London services back that don't go via Heathrow. There was also a dedicated Gatwick to London Victoria service too that went via Sutton I believe.

 

[busestrains]

One thing I just noticed was that it looks like all National Express services from Gatwick to London operate via Heathrow - this seems very roundabout to me! I remember they used to operate via Wallington so is this just a recent thing because of Covid or just because the traffic in South London is so bad that it's not worth going that way? I wonder also how much of an effect Oyster to Gatwick has had.

This is a post Covid thing. It's replaced the Brighton to Heathrow via Gatwick and the Brighton to London services which were both up to hourly. I assume it's due to less traffic.

It also provides an hourly service Heathrow to Victoria. Previously this was a route of variable frequency and many of the previous routes no longer run or run less frequently.

I wonder if National Express will ever bring the Brighton to London services back that don't go via Heathrow. There was also a dedicated Gatwick to London Victoria service too that went via Sutton I believe.

The Brighton - Gatwick - Heathrow - London coach service is incredibly slow these days now they have combined multiple services in to the one 025 route!

The journey time from Gatwick to London is 3 hours (180 minutes) in the peak times or 2 hours and 30 minutes (150 minutes) off peak!

The journey time from Brighton to London is 4 hours (240 minutes) in the peak times or 3 hours and 30 minutes (210 minutes) off peak!

You can take a train from Brighton to London in one hour or a train from Gatwick to London in thirty minutes!

It looks like National Express have no interest in bringing back the old faster routes and more frequent routes. I guess it probably gets very little usage with such frequent train services.

It is not even cheaper. The coach costs £11.00 Single or £21.00 Return for a Gatwick to London journey. But you can get the train for £9.00 direct or £7.30 if you split or even £6.90 if you split further.

Interestingly it seems Gatwick to Heathrow is £28.00 Single or £55.00 Return so it is cheaper to buy a Gatwick to London ticket and alight at Heathrow instead.

The fares are shown here:

National Express Coaches - Coach Guide Pages

www.nxagents.com

Certainly some odd pricing where travelling further is cheaper.

 

[miklcct]

I think that's the common view of most people. To be honest, when I'm with my better half (and she's not a high maintenance babe and is fairly public transport friendly), the idea of yomping half a mile to save a tenner simply doesn't cut any ice.

It's obviously different for airport workers but then again, they tend to have discounted travel passes.

That is fine if you are happy to pay it and i am sure there are many other people who have the same view as you. However there are also many people who find these airport fares very expensive and do care about these extra charges. Many people that are travelling to and from the airport are travelling on a budget and do not have much money therefore for them an extra five or ten pounds than what it would normally cost is a far bigger issue for them. Not everyone is on an expensive holiday. Plus regardless of if you have the money or not it just comes across as a bit dishonest for bus companies to charge these higher airport fares. It is like they are just trying to take advantage and make more money. They would not get away with it anywhere else. It gives a very poor first impression of an airport and a city when the first thing you are greeted with is a rip off public transport service.

If the saving is 10p I won't go out of the way to walk half a mile, but if it is £10? I won't get ripped off.

I get your point, but there is a cost to providing these services that is higher than your usual city buses. Is it a "rip off" to charge a premium fare for a premium service that might not otherwise run?

Liverpool is an interesting example. It used to have dedicated non-stop express buses to the city centre which charged a premium fare. Thr service no longer charges a premium fare but, also, it is no longer a non-stop express bus and the frequency is half of what it once was.

As for "expensive holidays", the days of 99p Ryanair flights are long gone. If you're paying sixty quid to fly, and the same again per night in a budget hotel, an extra fiver is neither here nor there.

The extra £5 per journey is a significant amount for me to decide if I go on a trip or not, or to choose an alternative airport (such as Stansted which is a rip-off compared to Luton with cheap Thameslink services using contactless off-peak). My typical airfare is below £30, sometimes in the range of £10 - £20, and the hostel normally costs about single digit per night.

Airport hotels in other countries often have a free shuttle to the airport, which means you can save money on the service bus. For example, Brussels airport has premium fares on some local buses and on trains, but you can get a free bus to the Ibis. I was staying at the Ibis anyway, but it did occur to me that a loophole from the airport to the city centre (or anywhere else in the city) is available by using that hotel bus and then catching the tram from Eurocontrol which is next to the Ibis. Amsterdam airport is similar. There is a cluster of hotels south of the airport, for example Moxy, Bastion, Best Western, which have free shuttles to the airport. But they are only about every half hour. There is a bus stop on the BRT system next door with buses every few minutes, but you have to pay.

Thinking about it, I don't think I've ever paid for a dedicated hotel shuttle anywhere. For London airports I travel direct to/from home.

I have never seen free airport hotels in other countries, for example, the one in Norway I stayed in last year. It was also the only instance I paid for a rip-off dedicated hotel shuttle as it was an impromptu trip that I didn't plan it properly.

 

[TheGrandWazoo]

If the saving is 10p I won't go out of the way to walk half a mile, but if it is £10? I won't get ripped off.

The extra £5 per journey is a significant amount for me to decide if I go on a trip or not, or to choose an alternative airport (such as Stansted which is a rip-off compared to Luton with cheap Thameslink services using contactless off-peak). My typical airfare is below £30, sometimes in the range of £10 - £20, and the hostel normally costs about single digit per night.

So you're a lot more price sensitive that most people AND I guess you're a fit and healthy single guy in his 20s or 30s, and possibly travelling on his own?

That gives you the wherewithal to be more master of your own destiny. However, many passengers will simply pay the extra money for convenience, whatever convenience actually represents to them or because, that £10 is not that big a deal in comparison to the overall cost of the holiday.

If you're paying buttons by being able to travel very flexibly and staying in hostels, then £10 is a fair proportion of your spend but I'd suggest, not being mean, that you're not the typical traveller.

 

[Tetchytyke]

My typical airfare is below £30, sometimes in the range of £10 - £20, and the hostel normally costs about single digit per night.

I think it's fair to say that you are unusually price conscious, and all credit to you for that.

I'm a Yorkshireman so I'm no fan of spending money I don't need to, but I'm not that price-conscious- I prefer mid-range hotels and I prefer to take luggage with me. Of course I'll choose an airport according to the whole package- air fare, timings, airline, travel costs, etc. If it's a nice day and I've got light bags I may well walk, but otherwise a fiver is neither here nor there.

It's fair to say I'm used to higher air fares living here, when it's costing me £100+ return to get off the island I can't get grumpy about an airport bus costing a fiver more than a city bus.

The airports that seem to get people exercised are Edinburgh and Bristol. A taxi from the Bristol Airport to the city centre is £40 each way; in that context, £13 return on the bus isn't so expensive.