Another North Downs Closure Planned

[Deepgreen]

There is a BBC News article which tells me that my line, the North Downs line, is to close between Guildford and Gatwick from 1 February until 16 February. It states that the prime reason for the closure is the renewal of bridge timbers at the bridge over the Wey at Shalford, but I had thought those were done during a previous closure a couple of years back? It is also planned to upgrade signalling and four level crossings (the crossings to become full, rather than half, barriers. I live on Burrows Lane, Gomshall and there has been a lot of work done to the crossing there of late, including a Christmas road closure, so can I assume it is one of those to have full barriers?

The article is here: https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c0rn2ldgpvdo

A railway line between Surrey and Sussex will close for 16 days so that "critical upgrades" can be carried out.

Network Rail said no trains will run between Guildford and Gatwick Airport from 1 February to 16 February.

During the closure, engineers will be laying new wheel timbers – the blocks that carry tracks over bridges – on the railway bridge over the River Wey, to the south of Guildford.

The new wheel timbers, which are made out of a synthetic alternative, will last 30 years longer than the old wooden versions and will mean fewer closures are needed in the future.

 

[TT-ONR-NRN]

Makes a change that it's the GWR service that'll be suspended through Ash. So many times the Farnham - Guildford SWR is replaced by buses these days, the Turbos often seem to be the only stock you see on weekends.

 

[GW43125]

Makes a change that it's the GWR service that'll be suspended through Ash. So many times the Farnham - Guildford SWR is replaced by buses these days, the Turbos often seem to be the only stock you see on weekends.

Surely GWR will still run between Reading & Guildford if the block is Gomshall end?

 

[TT-ONR-NRN]

Surely GWR will still run between Reading & Guildford if the block is Gomshall end?

Oh yes of course, it will. I didn't read the full thing.

 

[Minstral25]

Was originally announced earlier this year and the BBC must have just picked up on this. The replacement bus between Redhill and Guildford will be very slow and is hourly instead of half hourly as usual. It will create major difficulties for those using the service to get to and from work and school as it did last time.

 

[Nicholas Lewis]

It was closed for 7 days in Nov 23 for works on the River Wey bridge yet just over a year later it now needs to be closed two weeks. OK Feb is lower traffic time of the year but a two week closure seems excessive.

Edit: Looking at the EAS it was originally down as a 1wk closure from 1st Feb. There is also another 11day closure showing from 18/9. So hopefully they've condensed it down to 14 days now and this item will be removed once it reaches CPPP (Confirmed Period Possession Plan)

 

[Deepgreen]

It was closed for 7 days in Nov 23 for works on the River Wey bridge yet just over a year later it now needs to be closed two weeks. OK Feb is lower traffic time of the year but a two week closure seems excessive.

Edit: Looking at the EAS it was originally down as a 1wk closure from 1st Feb. There is also another 11day closure showing from 18/9. So hopefully they've condensed it down to 14 days now and this item will be removed once it reaches CPPP (Confirmed Period Possession Plan)

That was my thinking. I have no knowledge of the detailed works required at Shalford bridge, but it does seem odd to have two such lengthy closures so close together for works there. The level crossing upgrades have seen much preparatory work, at least at my 'new' local one (since we moved in October) down our lane. I must remember to get a photo before the works. The replacement buses are far from adequate, which is a feature of the line's geography in terms of directness, but not in terms of frequency.

 

[Meerkat]

Which are the four crossings - I'm guessing Tangley (Chilworth A248), Brook, Burrows Lane, and.......?
And does this involve new signals as they are conversions from AHBC?

 

[MasterPhillips]

What are the chances GWR still cancel services due to “shortage of train crew” during this work?

 

[JN114]

What are the chances GWR still cancel services due to “shortage of train crew” during this work?

Probably quite high, crew diagramming rules mean it is highly unlikely any crew would be saved by terminating short at Guildford.

 

[MasterPhillips]

Probably quite high, crew diagramming rules mean it is highly unlikely any crew would be saved by terminating short at Guildford.

Could you elaborate on these rules. Surely if less crew are required there can be more sitting spare.

 

[JN114]

Could you elaborate on these rules. Surely if less crew are required there can be more sitting spare.

5 hour block maximum without a break, positioning of breaks within turns, maximum diagram differences vs base diagram, number of trips over same route within a diagram, other work in the base diagram that is unaffected by the block.

Short of it all is, yes, the crew can out and back to Reading faster than if they were doing the full trip; but still not quickly enough to be all that more productive - they won’t get another round trip to Guildford in before needing a break; they likely wouldn’t squeeze anything else practical before their ordinary rostered break after North Downs; a three trip job (3 trips divided with 2 breaks between them) wouldn’t be allowed for maximum trips over the line rule.

It isn’t practical to rewrite most/all of Reading’s diagrams just to take advantage of a couple of weeks of lower driver utilisation; and shifting around unaffected work wouldn’t be allowed anyway.

 

[MasterPhillips]

It isn’t practical to rewrite most/all of Reading’s diagrams just to take advantage of a couple of weeks of lower driver utilisation; and shifting around unaffected work wouldn’t be allowed anyway.

Thank you for the detailed reply, very helpful.

However, I was under the impression that during large blocks such as these, that are planned way in advance, diagrams, and therefore shifts lengths etc, would be based on the engineering work taking place. Rather than it just being modified to arrive back at Reading earlier (due to not reaching gatwick) and then having to wait for your next working as if you had been to Gatwick? hope that makes sense lol

 

[Deepgreen]

Which are the four crossings - I'm guessing Tangley (Chilworth A248), Brook, Burrows Lane, and.......?
And does this involve new signals as they are conversions from AHBC?

I now live on Burrows Lane, so that was part of my question, too.

 

[Big Jumby 74]

However, I was under the impression that during large blocks such as these, that are planned way in advance, diagrams, and therefore shifts lengths etc, would be based on the engineering work taking place

Afraid not. Any STP (which is what this engineering work is) alterations to crew diagrams will require those diagrams to be based upon the base diagrams as JN114 has explained above, any changes have to be incorporated within the basic framework of the base diagram. For some TOCs there is a small amount of flexibility to move certain aspects of diagram content by a few minutes, to encompass STP changes, but a complete re-write wouldn't be permitted in such cases as this.

 

[MasterPhillips]

Afraid not. Any STP (which is what this engineering work is) alterations to crew diagrams will require those diagrams to be based upon the base diagrams as JN114 has explained above, any changes have to be incorporated within the basic framework of the base diagram. For some TOCs there is a small amount of flexibility to move certain aspects of diagram content by a few minutes, to encompass STP changes, but a complete re-write wouldn't be permitted in such cases as this.

Interesting , thank you.

 

[ex-probationer]

There is a BBC News article which tells me that my line, the North Downs line, is to close between Guildford and Gatwick from 1 February until 16 February. It states that the prime reason for the closure is the renewal of bridge timbers at the bridge over the Wey at Shalford, but I had thought those were done during a previous closure a couple of years back? It is also planned to upgrade signalling and four level crossings (the crossings to become full, rather than half, barriers. I live on Burrows Lane, Gomshall and there has been a lot of work done to the crossing there of late, including a Christmas road closure, so can I assume it is one of those to have full barriers?

The article is here: https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c0rn2ldgpvdo

This is the link to the Network Rail website, which may provide the answers you are looking for....

https://www.networkrail.co.uk/runni...s/wessex/north-downs-line-signalling-upgrade/

 

[Meerkat]

Why are the two in Chilworth CCTV rather than OD?
I assume the Chilworth one on the A248 going from half barrier to full barrier will mean longer closures, which won’t be popular!

 

[Nicholas Lewis]

This is the link to the Network Rail website, which may provide the answers you are looking for....

https://www.networkrail.co.uk/runni...s/wessex/north-downs-line-signalling-upgrade/

Umm shutting the line for over two weeks and then say they need more closures in October to complete the works. These should be completed and commissioned in one closure like this which they would have been in BR days. This line has already had several closures this year already and several more are already planned with Sunday 23rd February straight after the blockade. Then not two weeks later the whole weekend of 8/9 March.

 

[Minstral25]

The complete failure to find coaches for the replacement buses despite the long notice has left schoolchildren unable to get to school two mornings in a row. I am sure commuters are not happy either.

 

[Paul180]

Does any one know if there is still a planned closure in September i've seen 15th to the 26th is looking likely?