Availability and pros & cons of paper / smart card / electronic barcode ticketing

[BluePenguin]

Moderator note: Split from https://www.railforums.co.uk/threads/how-do-you-buy-single-tickets-on-a-smart-card.223056

Each TOC is different, we for example have only enabled seasons and day Travelcards for fulfiment to Smartcards.

What is the reason for this? If the other ticket options can be loaded onto smartcard, why are you not allowing them to be? It seems LNER are a part of the problem and why smartcards are not catching on very well.

 

[Haywain]

What is the reason for this? If the other ticket options can be loaded onto smartcard, why are you not allowing them to be? It seems LNER are a part of the problem and why smartcards are not catching on very well.

LNER is primarily (and increasingly so, post COVID) a long distance leisure operator, and tickets with reservations do not work well on smart cards.

 

[BluePenguin]

LNER is primarily (and increasingly so, post COVID) a long distance leisure operator, and tickets with reservations do not work well on smart cards.

That is fair enough, although anyone with a seat reservation will be able to see it on their email.

Apart from business people, most people travel on advance tickets then use Oyster anyway. I can’t think why they would use a TravelCard

 

[Bletchleyite]

What is the point in single tickets on a smartcard? What do you gain over using paper or e-ticket?

Apart from business people, most people travel on advance tickets then use Oyster anyway. I can’t think why they would use a TravelCard

Outboundary day Travelcards are still widely used in the South East, but are issued on paper.

 

[BluePenguin]

What is the point in single tickets on a smartcard? What do you gain over using paper or e-ticket?



Outboundary day Travelcards are still widely used in the South East, but are issued on paper.

The point is convenience. Buying a ticket on your phone and loading it onto a card by tapping the back of your phone is a neat feature. Especially if in a rush or travelling on a whim and you need to buy ticket quickly before your train leaves

Yes travel cards are used a lot in the South East, although if using them frequently you might as well store them on your oyster card unless you have a season ticket that includes zones.

Most long-distance passengers use advance tickets. Although GWR allow flexible tickets on their cards yet LNER do not.

I think we’re getting a little off topic here. The question is not why and who would benefit, but if it is possible why not? That way anybody who wants to can.

There is zero uniformity across TOCas to which tickets and product can be put onto which smartcards. It’s a huge mess and the lack of consistency is what drives peoples away

 

[Haywain]

The point is convenience. Buying a ticket on your phone and loading it onto a card by tapping the back of your phone is a neat feature. Especially if in a rush or travelling on a whim and you need to buy ticket quickly before your train leaves

Buying a ticket on your phone and having it stored on the phone is even more convenient.

 

[BluePenguin]

Buying a ticket on your phone and having it stored on the phone is even more convenient.

Until that phone dies or you want to buy the ticket for someone else

 

[Haywain]

Until that phone dies

Yes, apparently that only ever happens after the ticket has been bought. It's actually a very tedious argument that ignores the fact that hundreds of thousands, if not millions, of people manage to convey all manner of aspects of their daily lives on one small electronic device, and overcome this alleged threat every single day.

you want to buy the ticket for someone else

Buy it and send them the pdf. They've almost certainly got a smartphone if they have a smartcard, and if they don't then you won't be buying that smartcard ticket for them.

 

[BluePenguin]

Yes, apparently that only ever happens after the ticket has been bought. It's actually a very tedious argument that ignores the fact that hundreds of thousands, if not millions, of people manage to convey all manner of aspects of their daily lives on one small electronic device, and overcome this alleged threat every single day.

Buy it and send them the pdf. They've almost certainly got a smartphone if they have a smartcard, and if they don't then you won't be buying that smartcard ticket for them.

I was thinking of a child or grandparents who did not have their own smart phone

 

[Haywain]

I was thinking of a child or grandparents who did not have their own smart phone

I am a grandparent and I have a smartphone, and my grandchildren have smartphones. You're struggling to make a case for this. In any event, they are still unlikely to have their own smartcards, especially children who cannot use a standard adult smartcard with child fares.

 

[Bletchleyite]

I was thinking of a child or grandparents who did not have their own smart phone

How many children are old enough to travel without an adult and don't have some form of smartphone or tablet? Even if it's a hand me down from the parents with no SIM card you can put an e-ticket on it. Or print it out and give them a printed copy.

And yes, I know a lot of schools ban phones. You would use a season ticket to go to school by train. If you don't you're paying over the odds.

This is heading down the route of the classic RUK theoretical person who has all 9 protected characteristics, never uses the telephone and always pays cash. These people barely exist, and paper tickets purchased at the station for cash are still a thing if they do.

Until that phone dies

Most modern smartphones have good battery life, but if yours doesn't stick a short USB cable in your wallet and you will certainly find somewhere to charge it these days, or even a battery pack if carrying a bag. Add it to the non-issue list.

 

[BluePenguin]

I am a grandparent and I have a smartphone, and my grandchildren have smartphones. You're struggling to make a case for this. In any event, they are still unlikely to have their own smartcards, especially children who cannot use a standard adult smartcard with child fares.

Well mine does not and has no interest in getting one. I am not struggling to make a case for anything, you simply disagree which is fine. If LNER can enable other tickets to be used then they should - other TOCs have. Some people may use some options, other people others.

Everyone is entitled to their own opinion and to make their own ticket purchasing decisions. It is nobody else’s business to dictate this sort of thing.

Everything is a non-issue unless it applies to you. If anyone at LNER would benefit from these smart cards they would enable the desired features themselves

 

[lancededcena]

To me, I use smart cards so I do not have to deal with the hassle of a magstripe ticket demagnitising in barriered stations, especially on a travelcard. Also so I don't have to rely on my phones battery for my tickets.

 

[Haywain]

Well mine does not and has no interest in getting one.

But they have a smartcard?

 

[Bletchleyite]

To me, I use smart cards so I do not have to deal with the hassle of a magstripe ticket demagnitising in barriered stations, especially on a travelcard.

That is only really a season ticket issue. If you're having it happen often on one-day tickets, you need to look at how you're storing them, e.g. is a phone case magnet wiping them or something.

 

[island]

But they have a smartcard?

I got an Oyster card in 2007 and got my first smartphone in 2013.

 

[Bletchleyite]

I got an Oyster card in 2007 and got my first smartphone in 2013.

I'm not clear what the relevance of that is to 2021, where "dumbphones" are not a substantial part of the mobile phone market.

 

[py_megapixel]

And yes, I know a lot of schools ban phones.

Do they? I'm aware of schools not allowing children to have them on during the school day, but I don't believe any of the schools where I live ban them from physically possessing them!

(Realistically, a child too young to figure out how to switch their phone on and off by themselves isn't going to be travelling on their own)

 

[mattdickinson]

The LNER smartcard appears to be available to order on their website, but it returns an error when I try to order one..