Br Gas Turbine No. 18000

[EbbwJunction1]

I was at Didcot Railway Centre last week, and noticed that this loco is still where it has been for quite a while.

I understand that it's owned by the Waterman Railway Heritage Trust, although there's no mention of it on the Trust's web site. It looks rather tatty and I'd guess that it's unlikely to be fit for work at any time soon.

It wasn't a Running Day at Didcot when I went there, so there wasn't anyone around that I could ask. So, does anyone know anything about what's going to happen with it, please?

Thank you.

 

[Cowley]

I was at Didcot Railway Centre last week, and noticed that this loco is still where it has been for quite a while.

I understand that it's owned by the Waterman Railway Heritage Trust, although there's no mention of it on the Trust's web site. It looks rather tatty and I'd guess that it's unlikely to be fit for work at any time soon.

It wasn't a Running Day at Didcot when I went there, so there wasn't anyone around that I could ask. So, does anyone know anything about what's going to happen with it, please?

Thank you.

I don’t know how much it’s got in the way of innards these days but I’d be pretty sure that there’s no chance of it ever running again. It was substantially altered after it finished on BR and disappeared off to be used as some kind of test bed thingy in Europe for quite a few years I believe.
So destined to be a static exhibit for ever I’d imagine.

 

[EbbwJunction1]

Yes, as I said, it doesn't look as if it could run without substantial restoration work.

It's obviously been the subject of a paint job (green) some time in the past, but that's looking in need of refurbishment.

Thanks.

 

[Cowley]

Yes, as I said, it doesn't look as if it could run without substantial restoration work.

It's obviously been the subject of a paint job (green) some time in the past, but that's looking in need of refurbishment.

Thanks.

Yes I’ve seen a couple of photos of it looking a bit faded. It’s an amazing survivor, I hope it isn’t allowed to deteriorate further.

 

[EbbwJunction1]

I agree!

 

[superjohn]

The Didcot Railway Centre has a webpage about it with some pictures, including the rather empty interior.
https://didcotrailwaycentre.org.uk/article.php/88/18000-kerosene-castle
The gas turbine was removed before it went away to Switzerland and the remaining equipment was substantially altered when it got there.

 

[EbbwJunction1]

That's very interesting, thank you.

It's a shame that it looks so tatty, although it's good to see that they are planning on restoring it. It should be kept under cover once it's done, though, otherwise it'll deteriorate again and the hard work will be wasted. Having said that, I really don't know here this could be, though.

 

[Journeyman]

I went past the back of Didcot Railway Centre on a train yesterday, and spotted it as I passed - noticing you can see right through the bodyside windows.

 

[EbbwJunction1]

I was at ground level and, not being eight foot six, I couldn't … but having seen the one photo on the web site, I see what you mean!

 

[ArchieWoodbine]

All the traction equipment has long-since been removed: it'll never run again. Similarly, I've also heard that (not confirmed, mind), owing to general height and the fact that it's riding high on the suspension (given it's an empty shell), it's too tall to squeeze under the OLE wires that have been installed since it's arrival at Didcot. As there's no road acess to Didcot shed, I think it might effectively be marooned. Given that's it's owned by one party, but stuck in the depot of another, I suspect this could play a part in explaining how its come to be in a bad state of repair.

 

[EbbwJunction1]

Yes, that probably explains why it's parked at the "back of beyond" (an exaggeration, I know, but if you know where it is, you'll understand!) at Didcot.

There looks as if there is a rail connection at the eastern end of the Centre, but it leads out onto lines with OLE, so that probably wouldn't work. There's no road connection at all as far as I can see.

 

[Roast Veg]

Nothing a whole heap of ballast or a quick removal of the roof wouldn't solve.

 

[plarailfan]

This is a historic relic from the Great Western Rly. One end of the solebar, above the bogie, has been made wide at some point and I suspect the modified part of the loco might prove to be a problem in moving it away from Didcot to another home as it will be "out of gauge" which is a shame, really, in my view, it could do with being on display somewhere in the National collection.

 

[EbbwJunction1]

Nothing a whole heap of ballast or a quick removal of the roof wouldn't solve.

Not being technically minded, I can't say whether you're right or wrong. The question I have is "who's going to do it?".

This is a historic relic from the Great Western Rly. One end of the solebar, above the bogie, has been made wide at some point and I suspect the modified part of the loco might prove to be a problem in moving it away from Didcot to another home as it will be "out of gauge" which is a shame, really, in my view, it could do with being on display somewhere in the National collection.

Although it was commissioned by the GWR, it wasn't built until after Nationalisation in 1949, albeit because of the war. I don't know about the changes to the solebar, so I can't comment about that.

 

[ArchieWoodbine]

Nothing a whole heap of ballast or a quick removal of the roof wouldn't solve.

Yes, you could fill it with water bowsers to lower the suspension, but I think it may already be touching or even over the limit for overhead lines. I reiterate that’s just conjecture though - given it can’t move under its own power I suspect nobody’s really had to test the issue. Similarly, the Kings couldn’t go under wires nowardays without their chimneys lopped off, so it’s not unheard of for heritage stock to fall foul of the wires.

 

[Cowley]

Yes, you could fill it with water bowsers to lower the suspension, but I think it may already be touching or even over the limit for overhead lines. I reiterate that’s just conjecture though - given it can’t move under its own power I suspect nobody’s really had to test the issue. Similarly, the Kings couldn’t go under wires nowardays without their chimneys lopped off, so it’s not unheard of for heritage stock to fall foul of the wires.

It’s always looked to my (inexpert) eye to be quite a tall locomotive anyway even when in service. Would it have been slightly too large to have run anywhere other than on the slightly more generous loading gauge of the GW mainline back in those days?

 

[Merle Haggard]

The return from Switzerland was carried out by RfD very soon after the Tunnel opened, probably on the 'Channel Tunnel Publicity' budget, and, of course, it came back by rail, through the Tunnel and under wires. I thought that the gauge issue was width rather than height.

I'm also not sure how it came about that it was presented to Mr Waterman.

 

[Cowley]

The return from Switzerland was carried out by RfD very soon after the Tunnel opened, probably on the 'Channel Tunnel Publicity' budget, and, of course, it came back by rail, through the Tunnel and under wires. I thought that the gauge issue was width rather than height.

I'm also not sure how it came about that it was presented to Mr Waterman.

Very interesting. I didn’t realise it had got here that way?

 

[EbbwJunction1]

I've been thinking about the rail connection which i think that I identified from Google Maps (other mapping sites are available!).

Does anyone know whether this is generally used? The Saint wasn't there last week, and I note that it's going to be elsewhere (GCR?) soon - so how did it get off site? If it used the rail connection, it must be small enough not to foul the OLE, but (assuming that it didn't go by rail all the way) where's the nearest road connection for it to be transferred? There's nothing obvious near to the Centre in any of the three directions London, Oxford & Swindon).

 

[pdeaves]

I've been thinking about the rail connection which i think that I identified from Google Maps (other mapping sites are available!).

Does anyone know whether this is generally used? The Saint wasn't there last week, and I note that it's going to be elsewhere (GCR?) soon - so how did it get off site? If it used the rail connection, it must be small enough not to foul the OLE, but (assuming that it didn't go by rail all the way) where's the nearest road connection for it to be transferred? There's nothing obvious near to the Centre in any of the three directions London, Oxford & Swindon).

I think stuff to/from the railway centre gets 'tripped' from/to the Milton industrial estate where there is enough space for a lorry transfer.

 

[3973EXL]

I think stuff to/from the railway centre gets 'tripped' from/to the Milton industrial estate where there is enough space for a lorry transfer.

Milton hasn't been used in years.

Everything for the GW is tripped to/from Didcot West yard. Siding off the road into the DB Cargo shed.
GWS concreted this for road transport to load/off load on the siding.
Route is either from 6416 thro plat 4/5 behind 6407 on the UR and in at 920.
Normally 6416 into the yard at 6413 was used. Shunt at 920 needed to get over the handpoints to back into the GWS.

 

[pdeaves]

Milton hasn't been used in years.

Everything for the GW is tripped to/from Didcot West yard. Siding off the road into the DB Cargo shed.
GWS concreted this for road transport to load/off load on the siding.
Route is either from 6416 thro plat 4/5 behind 6407 on the UR and in at 920.
Normally 6416 into the yard at 6413 was used. Shunt at 920 needed to get over the handpoints to back into the GWS.

OK, good job I used (and emphasised) 'think'!

 

[xotGD]

Here is 18000 at Crewe Heritage Centre back in 1999:

 

[Merle Haggard]

I think xotGD's photo shows the gauging issue. It's the area of panelling below the number and over the front bogie, presumably added in Switzerland in connection with, perhaps, bogie suspension experiments. When in use in this country before export, the underframe was uniform along its length - it was like that seen at the rear all the way to the front.

 

[Merle Haggard]

I've just found a half forgotten book in my 'library'. It's ISBN 0-86299-541-8, ' The Great Western Railway Gas turbines - A myth exposed'. It's very scholarly and detailed about both 18000 and 18100, and includes details of the experimental work in Switzerland involving 18000. Mine is marked £3 inside so I must have bought it at a steam railway second-hand bookshop, bur possibly Amazon can supply. It's published 1989 so ends with 18000 on display at Vienna.

The book mentions that the power plant, generator, train heating boiler and control equipment (total weight 57 tonnes) were removed in the conversion for experimental use, but old rails and lead were placed between the frame members. Maybe this is why it rides high now - possibly, the weights were removed at some time. The book also mentions pannier tank 3711 which some may remember in the '60s as being a regular ECS loco at Paddington, and making little smoke but having an unusual smell. It was oil-fired and the book alleges that it was converted to use up the stocks of heavy oil left over at sheds after 18000/18100 were withdrawn.

I can recall that the repatriation of 18000 by RfD involved calling in some favours (possibly including the UIC), expenditure and a lot of planning, and I think it was stored at Crewe Electric; it seemed to be a very worthwhile project. Possibly (I can't be sure) that its disposal was just yet another hasty action by Wisconsin Central on takeover.

 

[Cowley]

I've just found a half forgotten book in my 'library'. It's ISBN 0-86299-541-8, ' The Great Western Railway Gas turbines - A myth exposed'. It's very scholarly and detailed about both 18000 and 18100, and includes details of the experimental work in Switzerland involving 18000. Mine is marked £3 inside so I must have bought it at a steam railway second-hand bookshop, bur possibly Amazon can supply. It's published 1989 so ends with 18000 on display at Vienna.

The book mentions that the power plant, generator, train heating boiler and control equipment (total weight 57 tonnes) were removed in the conversion for experimental use, but old rails and lead were placed between the frame members. Maybe this is why it rides high now - possibly, the weights were removed at some time. The book also mentions pannier tank 3711 which some may remember in the '60s as being a regular ECS loco at Paddington, and making little smoke but having an unusual smell. It was oil-fired and the book alleges that it was converted to use up the stocks of heavy oil left over at sheds after 18000/18100 were withdrawn.

I can recall that the repatriation of 18000 by RfD involved calling in some favours (possibly including the UIC), expenditure and a lot of planning, and I think it was stored at Crewe Electric; it seemed to be a very worthwhile project. Possibly (I can't be sure) that its disposal was just yet another hasty action by Wisconsin Central on takeover.

Some excellent detail there Merle. Thanks for that.

 

[a_c_skinner]

Off topic but the magazines reported that now Didcot has abandoned main line running its locos will be original height and will be moved via rail to the sidings mentioned, so there must be a way around height and OHLE.

 

[EbbwJunction1]

Milton hasn't been used in years. Everything for the GW is tripped to/from Didcot West yard. Siding off the road into the DB Cargo shed. GWS concreted this for road transport to load/off load on the siding. Route is either from 6416 thro plat 4/5 behind 6407 on the UR and in at 920. Normally 6416 into the yard at 6413 was used. Shunt at 920 needed to get over the handpoints to back into the GWS.

Where is Didcot West Yard, please? I've looked at Google Maps, and I can't see any road connection to any of the sidings in that area, but am I looking at the right place?

 

[3973EXL]

Where is Didcot West Yard, please? I've looked at Google Maps, and I can't see any road connection to any of the sidings in that area, but am I looking at the right place?

DB shed is between Foxhall car park & NR TVSC.
Basil Hill Road

 

[EbbwJunction1]

Ah, right, I know where you mean, now - thanks.

A few years ago, I walked from Pendon Museum to Didcot Parkway. It was mostly at first alongside the Moor Ditch, but I eventually found myself walking through and around the trading estates in that area. The (new) large car park hadn't been built, then, but I remember entering the old car park through the entrance off Basil Hill Road and through it to the station.