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Bridlington rationalisation and re-signalling
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D6130
Established Member
Wasn't that the section where the embankment had been badly-undermined by badgers?
Ploughman
Established Member
20 years ago I had a walkout with a Railtrack rep about the proposal to defer a relay between Brid and Sewerby by doing a 1 - 3 resleeper.
The resleeper was done around 1996 - 8.
mike57
Established Member
I dont know, but some upset people in our village today. Rail replacement buses finally in service at lunchtime, no trains for the rest of the day. A train of what looked like ballast wagons went very slowly northbound at about 2.30pm yesterday but nothing since. Northern website promises an update around 6pm tonight.
mike57
Established Member
All trains cancelled today as well according to Northern website (updated at 04:51 so refers to todays service). Does anyone know what has gone wrong?
Update: Local bush telegraph is saying problem is at Sewerby Crossing, but no further details.
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Falcon1200
Established Member
National Rail Enquiries website suggests that a derailment may have occurred, unless 're-railing equipment' refers to something else;
www.nationalrail.co.uk
Incident: Bridlington | National Rail
No trains between Bridlington and Scarborough today. Find details of all current incidents on National Rail Enquiries.
D6130
Established Member
I suspect that refers to the track renewal equipment....in which case they won't have been able to finish putting the new track down.
Falcon1200
Established Member
I agree, a derailment would surely have made the news by now!
When did the Brid - Scarborough line last make the news for anything?
It's very much a forgotten route outside of the local area.
Thankfully this did not occur during the main Summer season although it is schools half term week this week so some impact may be felt. The East Yorkshire 13 bus will be busy between the two places although the wet weather will put some off.
I initially had thought the overrun was possibly caused by the effects of Storm Babet last week.
I initially had thought the overrun was possibly caused by the effects of Storm Babet last week.
mike57
Established Member
And long may it stay that way, even during the bleakest times of the Northern meltdown the trains ran through our village with reasonable reliability.
From our village there has been steady year on year growth in passenger numbers apart from during Covid.
It gives a practical alternative to using a car for quite a few journeys, and connects with London services at Hull or Doncaster. Most of the north of Bridlington services are worked by class 170 units which are reasonably comfortable and a lot better than some rural branch lines.
mike57
Established Member
First train of the day to Scarborough went through here OK
They have now started using Platform 5 for northbound services, at Bridlington yesterday and the 10:00 arrival from Hull used 5 and the departure screens had most of the northbound services using 5 despite the tight timings between York departures at xx:56 and Scarborough arrivals at xx:02. This is helpful for passengers and the station staff who do not need to come out in case the foot crossing needs to be used.
The 14:03 to Scarborough used 4 as the RHTT was in 5.
mike57
Established Member
They seem to be in one of the "if we can we do" phases relating to Platform 5 at Brid for northbound services. Then you seem to get a period when all the northbound go into 4.
If there are disabled or people with impaired mobility then No5 is a sensible option at the moment, until the lifts are commissioned.
I feel the timetable would be better with a roughly 30 minute frequency, rather than the present 20, 40 minute unbalanced arrangements. In many hours, Bridlington departures are xx40 and xx56.
Scarborough departures could leave at xx05 to improve reliability at Hunmanby.
In general, speeds could be raised to shorten single line occupancy times.
The last Scarborough departure at 2113 seems too early to be useful for an evening out. 2205 would, perhaps, give a better fit?
I feel the timetable would be better with a roughly 30 minute frequency, rather than the present 20, 40 minute unbalanced arrangements. In many hours, Bridlington departures are xx40 and xx56.
Scarborough departures could leave at xx05 to improve reliability at Hunmanby.
In general, speeds could be raised to shorten single line occupancy times.
The last Scarborough departure at 2113 seems too early to be useful for an evening out. 2205 would, perhaps, give a better fit?
mike57
Established Member
Given current service unreliability (see https://www.railforums.co.uk/threads/northern-ad-hoc-cancellations.257189/page-2#post-6504723 ) I think during the winter the hourly Brid-Hull-York would be better running from either Beverley or Hull to York, as north of Beverley they are not well used. Scarboroughs could pick up the Nafferton and Hutton Cranswick stops, and only run the Brid - Hull stoppers during peak hours. This is what happened last winter. I was travelling mid morning on Friday, and saw two Brid - Hull stoppers, and both were nearly empty. On the other hand the Scarborough service I was on was well used. During the day all Scarboroughs could then use P5 lifts or not, as its easier access. Extend the York service to Brid from say Easter to end of the school holidays in September.
As for raising line speeds, currently its 60 from Bempton to Hunmanby, I would imagine the work involved wouldn't be justified and is only going to save a minute or two. The single line section to Hunmanby really is the major timetable constraint north of Brid.
The big issue with the evening service north of Brid is that the last service to Scarborough leaves Hull at 19.23. If travelling from further afield delays can quickly mean you have missed the last service and it precludes using the train for any evening events in Hull, unless we are prepared to drive to Brid and park, the last Brid service leaves Hull at 22.16 which isnt too bad. However there are occasions where driving is not appropriate.
However as a regular user of Brid - Scarborough route the improvement to the service to get an hourly day time service made a big different to usability, and passenger numbers have increased steadily. Whatever we would have on our 'wish' list I reckon the current service is probably as good as its ever going to get.
In 1978 I visited Cayton box and was invited in and had a long chat with the signalman. He told me that several thousand tons of ballast had been ordered by BR in theory to reballast this line but was in fact used on the ECML. So the line was loaded with costs but got no benefit.
Ploughman
Established Member
A large amount of the line between Hull and Seamer has been renewed with new rails and sleepers.
North of Brid From the LC at Quay crossing, through Sewerby, was resleepered 1 in 4.
From Sewerby through SPEETON to Hunmanby was full renewal.
Filey to Gristhorpe full renewal.
Seamer South to seamer Jcn renewed.
This was done in blockades around 2000 - 2007 following on from major works between Hull west Parade and Bridlington.
I think that approx 70% of the entire line has seen attention with a lot of it being Steel sleeper relays.
I believe some further works have since been undertaken but I do not know any details of that.
mike57
Established Member
There has been some more relaying with new track between Bridlington and Bempton at the end of last month, and there seems to be some ongoing work north of Bempton towards Speeton.
GardenRail
Member
Of course it could just be the Signaller that dare not do anything other than 'how it's booked'...... Or 'its booked that way, so that's what's happening'.
Thanks for the info on trackworks, ploughman. Jointed track seems to be sort sections between Filey and Hunmanby and at Carnaby. A 2 mile stretch on the down after Nafferton and a mile or so on the up at Beswick.
Speeds between Bridlington and Hunmanby ought to be raised by 10 mph to shorten occupation time.
Speeds between Bridlington and Hunmanby ought to be raised by 10 mph to shorten occupation time.
The hindrance on the line is the long, 10 mile, single section. If there was a loop at Bempton things would be eased but it would be expensive. Extending the double track north of Bridlington to Flamborough would significantly ease the problem too, but smarter running is a much cheaper solution.
In the BR days 17 minutes were allowed between Bridlington and Hunmanby. The long climb out of Bridlington was a struggle for underpowered DMUs. Today's 170s are heard applying the brakes after 2.5 miles of climb due to the 50 restriction and are timed for 15 minutes.
The 40 restriction for the first mile or so out of Brid was due to condition of track. Might the relaying now make 60 possible throughout? If it saves 2 minutes, that's quite a useful saving on occupation time. Similarly around Muston the speed restriction of 50 seems rather low.
I agree with Mike that the hourly service is a huge improvement. Comfort and quality have never been better. A later train from Scarborough at 2200 would be sensible and a later train from Hull north of Brid may be worth a try at weekends or ThFSO.
In 1932 the last train from Scarborough left after 2200!
On the Hull to Bridlington section there are absolute block section 10 minutes long which compound late running north of Beverley. Is there a case for IB signals to divide sections? Or is it that the timetabling is weak and there is little recovery time once an off-branch delay has been imported?
In the BR days 17 minutes were allowed between Bridlington and Hunmanby. The long climb out of Bridlington was a struggle for underpowered DMUs. Today's 170s are heard applying the brakes after 2.5 miles of climb due to the 50 restriction and are timed for 15 minutes.
The 40 restriction for the first mile or so out of Brid was due to condition of track. Might the relaying now make 60 possible throughout? If it saves 2 minutes, that's quite a useful saving on occupation time. Similarly around Muston the speed restriction of 50 seems rather low.
I agree with Mike that the hourly service is a huge improvement. Comfort and quality have never been better. A later train from Scarborough at 2200 would be sensible and a later train from Hull north of Brid may be worth a try at weekends or ThFSO.
In 1932 the last train from Scarborough left after 2200!
On the Hull to Bridlington section there are absolute block section 10 minutes long which compound late running north of Beverley. Is there a case for IB signals to divide sections? Or is it that the timetabling is weak and there is little recovery time once an off-branch delay has been imported?
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