Cardiff Bus/Coach Station

[dan5324]

Hopefully NX get to use the bus station. Last year when I took the 509, the stop was just a regular bus stop on a road.

You must’ve got on at Cardiff uni or Gabalfa?

Cardiff’s main coach stop for NX is located at Sophia gardens coach station.

 

[anthony263]

Hopefully NX get to use the bus station. Last year when I took the 509, the stop was just a regular bus stop on a road.

I'd refuse to take a tri axle in there; far too tight for my liking.

 

[158756]

Would any of the coach operators want to use the bus station? Presuming there will be fees for the bus station, Flixbus and Megabus at least might prefer the current situation. It might make more sense for National Express, I don't know how much the Sophia Gardens site costs. Is there a suitable on street stop nearby if some of the coaches won't fit in the bus station?

 

[markymark2000]

Would any of the coach operators want to use the bus station?

They may well move if the station was coach friendly, didn't have too much time penalty and was well organised as a combined stop rather than the stupid exclusivity agreements with NX that seem to keep going around.

Is there a suitable on street stop nearby if some of the coaches won't fit in the bus station?

Well... The current Megabus stop is in a decent location. The old Megabus stop on Kingsway was good too but they have stuck up stupid cycle pylons so buses cant get out of the stop now. Callaghan Square has plenty of bays for coaches but it's a bigger time penalty then the northern parts of the city. Other spaces could be available, such as Park Street, depending on when/if buses move into the bus station and what normal buses then require layovers there.

 

[route101]

You must’ve got on at Cardiff uni or Gabalfa?

Cardiff’s main coach stop for NX is located at Sophia gardens coach station.

I was on the coach heading to Swansea. I don't remember the coach stopping at Sophia Gardens.

 

[markymark2000]

Stagecoach have now confirmed that the 122 and 124 will be moving to the Cardiff Bus Interchange. They've just updated their service updates page.

Stand 1 for the 124 and Stand 2 for the 122 according to the timetables (downloadable via the link below)

ServiceUpdatesArticle

www.stagecoachbus.com

Cardiff Bus Interchange is opening on Sunday 30th of June 2024!
We can confirm services 122 & 124 will be running from there from Monday 1st July

 

[SW Buses]

So today was the day where live operations commenced. The first departure was by Cardiff Bus 267 operating the 07:10 94 service to Barry. The first Stagecoach departure was on the 122 at 09:47 in the hands of 26108.

 

[Caaardiff]

Would any of the coach operators want to use the bus station? Presuming there will be fees for the bus station, Flixbus and Megabus at least might prefer the current situation. It might make more sense for National Express, I don't know how much the Sophia Gardens site costs. Is there a suitable on street stop nearby if some of the coaches won't fit in the bus station?

It seems there's no plan for any coach operators to use it. Space is a premium already and many bus services still won't be using it, nevermind coach operators. Considering TFW's plans is for multi-modal, easy connect transport, it's still a mess in Cardiff.
NX using Sophia Gardens, which has no bus operator stopping there to connect with, it's out of the way and can't be nice to use at night time. Flix and Megabus are using another stop at the other end of the city centre near Greyfriars Road. It's all still completely unlinked.

I've not seen it in person, only photos online, and the bus station looks quite compact. On busy days I'd imagine it will become very congested with people. Not a win, and clearly the commercial and residential space was prioritised over the real reason for the bus station being built.

 

[Wuggie Norple]

I am one of the lucky ones in that most of the buses I catch (Cardiff Bus 24 inbound/25 outbound, 62, 63, and Stagecoach 122/124) are now using the bus station. However it is rather annoying that the Cardiff Buses use stands at the opposite end of the bus station to the Stagecoach ones, rather than adjacent ones. If you want to catch a bus to e.g Llandaff, where are you supposed to wait?



Another annoyance is the main departure screens which do not show both the scheduled departure time and the number of minutes to departure, but a mix of both. Personally, I always want to see a time rather than have to add (say) 28 minutes to the current time to work out the departure time.

 

[Envoy]

The main problem with the Transport Interchange is that when events take place at the stadium - it can’t be used due to the number of people in the area.

Long distance coaches have the additional problem of getting in and out of the central area and even Sophia Gardens - without getting stuck in traffic jams. Leckwith Road for example, is an absolute shambles with a new high school right on the road (so much for air pollution) plus a relatively new Lidl and loads of traffic lights. Even the bus stop by Jubilee Park has not been recessed into a lay-by with a bit taken off the park. This means that traffic backs up through the junction with Broad Street & Sloper Road whenever a bus stops at this location. This is by the way, the route National Express use between Sophia Gardens and the M4 to the west via the A4232.

It seems to me that the easiest way for long distance coaches to get in and out of the central area would be to complete the Eastern Bay Expressway (Rover Way) and for them to have a new coach station on the south side of the railway - possibly in the Callaghan Square area? Perhaps the powers that be are thinking that when/if Port Talbot gets a new electric arc furnace, that the one at East Moors steelworks will close and thus free up more land for the expressway? Goodness knows?

Two photos below of the new bus station / Transport Interchange taken just before opening:>

 

[Christian Schm]

@Envoy - I am surprised if the bus station will not be used during events, has that been confirmed? I thought it was deliberately constructed with an exit towards Penarth Road so that it could stay open?

 

[Dai Corner]

@Envoy - I am surprised if the bus station will not be used during events, has that been confirmed? I thought it was deliberately constructed with an exit towards Penarth Road so that it could stay open?

I was there the other day and it didn't look as though buses leaving could turn right towards Penarth Road. They had to turn left towards Wood Street / Westgate Street.

We waited quite a long time for the lights to change at that junction and I foresee major congestion when the bus station is operating at full capacity unless buses are given priority.

 

[markymark2000]

I was there the other day and it didn't look as though buses leaving could turn right towards Penarth Road. They had to turn left towards Wood Street / Westgate Street.

Using the southern entrance/exit, you can turn down St Mary's Street and go past the Cardiff Bus layovers, then right onto Penarth Road there. It will be a huge delay though unless the lights get sorted.

We waited quite a long time for the lights to change at that junction and I foresee major congestion when the bus station is operating at full capacity unless buses are given priority.

Sadly this is just Cardiff. The place is full of poorly timed traffic lights. The St Mary Street/Canal Street/Penarth Road/Customhouse Street junction is awful. I wouldn't get my hopes up on improvements.

 

[Envoy]

@Envoy - I am surprised if the bus station will not be used during events, has that been confirmed? I thought it was deliberately constructed with an exit towards Penarth Road so that it could stay open?

I may be wrong but if the buses come in & out via the southern entrance, they will have to cross the crowds of people going in and out of the train station - and that includes those using the local line platforms who are forced to walk under the Penarth Railway railway bridge.

Also note that buses that use Westgate Street and Wood Street for services to the west and north-west of the city will have those roads closed during events at the stadium.

 

[markymark2000]

Cardiff Bus have announced their September changes and, as promised, more services are moving into the interchange.

From Sunday 1st September we will be making changes to many of routes. These changes will see a restoration of weekday daytime frequencies for routes 17/18, 27, 44/45 and 49/50 to their pre-summer step-down. We will also be adding more routes to start and end at the Cardiff Bus Interchange as well as making changes to how we serve Barry Island. We will also be extending route 7 to Llandough Hospital and Penarth as well as reintroducing route 86 to Lisvane and retaining the extra late baycar back from Cardiff Bay for those taking in a show at the Wales Millennium Centre.

They haven't released an easy to quote stand list but I am going off their September 'Where to catch your bus in Cardiff' map and scraping data from there.

	Routes	Buses per hour
Stand 1	Stagecoach 124	1
Stand 2	Stagecoach 122	1
Stand 3	Cardiff 25, 62 & 63	4
Stand 4	Cardiff 21, 23 & 24	6
Stand 5	Cardiff 35	2
Stand 6	Cardiff 96	2
Stand 7	Cardiff 92, 93 & 94	6
Stand 8	Cardiff 95	2
Stand 9	Cardiff 13 & 136	2
Stand 10	Cardiff 61	4
Stand 11	Cardiff 28 & 29	2
Stand 12	Cardiff 27	5
Stand 13	Cardiff 32 & 86 & 305	1 (pus 86 & 305 infreq)
Stand 14	Cardiff & Newport 30	2

Plus 4 and 101/102 which Cardiff Bus has forgotten to put this on their Cardiff stop map but have referenced the extension on the changes page and in the accompanying timetable. Stagecoach stands are based off the current allocation, Stagecoach hasn't yet released finer details for their September changes and so these stand numbers may change.

I make this 41 buses per hour in the bus station. Just shy of 1/2 capacity based off my workings out of 6 buses per hour per stand. Some very strange stand allocations though. Stagecoach 122, 124 and Cardiff 62/63 could all go off the same stand considering they follow the same routing out to Danescourt. 96 is nowhere near the 13 which also goes out towards Ely. 136 is nowhere near the 23/24 which all go to Whitchurch. Stand 13 is just a bunch of random routes.

 

[Jellyfish261]

Cardiff Bus have announced their September changes and, as promised, more services are moving into the interchange.


They haven't released an easy to quote stand list but I am going off their September 'Where to catch your bus in Cardiff' map and scraping data from there.

	Routes	Buses per hour
Stand 1	Stagecoach 124	1
Stand 2	Stagecoach 122	1
Stand 3	Cardiff 25, 62 & 63	4
Stand 4	Cardiff 21, 23 & 24	6
Stand 5	Cardiff 35	2
Stand 6	Cardiff 96	2
Stand 7	Cardiff 92, 93 & 94	6
Stand 8	Cardiff 95	2
Stand 9	Cardiff 13 & 136	2
Stand 10	Cardiff 61	4
Stand 11	Cardiff 28 & 29	2
Stand 12	Cardiff 27	5
Stand 13	Cardiff 32 & 86 & 305	1 (pus 86 & 305 infreq)
Stand 14	Cardiff & Newport 30	2

Plus 4 and 101/102 which Cardiff Bus has forgotten to put this on their Cardiff stop map but have referenced the extension on the changes page and in the accompanying timetable. Stagecoach stands are based off the current allocation, Stagecoach hasn't yet released finer details for their September changes and so these stand numbers may change.

I make this 41 buses per hour in the bus station. Just shy of 1/2 capacity based off my workings out of 6 buses per hour per stand. Some very strange stand allocations though. Stagecoach 122, 124 and Cardiff 62/63 could all go off the same stand considering they follow the same routing out to Danescourt. 96 is nowhere near the 13 which also goes out towards Ely. 136 is nowhere near the 23/24 which all go to Whitchurch. Stand 13 is just a bunch of random routes.

Thanks for spotting.

Step in the right direction no doubt. I can understand the rationale behind the 7/8/9, 17/18 and 44/45/49/50s staying on the periphery stops - not ideal, but all within reasonable 'pointing' distance of the interchange.

Shame the Cardiff Bus 11s and 57/58s aren't going in yet, as St Mary St / John Lewis not the easiest to explain to those unfamiliar.

Surprised the 95 / 96s still on the separate stands as appears plenty of time between departures - but I guess leaves scope to combine if a next wave of services going in.

Assuming no talk of First X2 / 320 or the daily T1C using the interchange? (T1C in particular has been a guess-where affair for a while now, but seems to have settled on Tresilian Way)

 

[markymark2000]

Thanks for spotting.

Step in the right direction no doubt. I can understand the rationale behind the 7/8/9, 17/18 and 44/45/49/50s staying on the periphery stops - not ideal, but all within reasonable 'pointing' distance of the interchange.

Shame the Cardiff Bus 11s and 57/58s aren't going in yet, as St Mary St / John Lewis not the easiest to explain to those unfamiliar.

7/8/9 I don't understand being kept out on Canal Street. Canal Street is awful for buses, as it's more of a taxi dumping place and buses have to go stupidly slow to avoid hitting the taxis.

11s I am

Assuming no talk of First X2 / 320 or the daily T1C using the interchange? (T1C in particular has been a guess-where affair for a while now, but seems to have settled on Tresilian Way)

Nope. Vale of Glamorgan put out a proposed reduced 320 timetable to operate from September and that excludes the bus station. I believe there is no appetite from First to serve the bus station and sadly Vale of Glamorgan Council, as the council who issued the tenders, hasn't instructed First to serve the interchange. Funny as they were a bit upset that no one used the Barry Docks interchange after they spent all the money on it, yet they won't instruct operators to use Cardiff Bus Station!

T1C using the interchange could happen but would have to use stand 1 and would depend on space given the wheelchair lift is in the middle of the coach.

 

[Wuggie Norple]

A good point is that the buses that serve Llandaff (25, 62/63, 122, 124) will now leave from adjacent stands rather than from opposite ends of the bus station.

However, I see that the 25 and 62/63 will now share Stand 3 which could be interesting as at several times during the day they are timed to depart simultaneously. Goodness knows why they can’t retime one of the services to give a 15 minute service interval to Llandaff instead of every 30 minutes.

 

[markymark2000]

However, I see that the 25 and 62/63 will now share Stand 3 which could be interesting as at several times during the day they are timed to depart simultaneously.

Surely this is something that should have been thought about before promoting timetables to passengers?

Goodness knows why they can’t retime one of the services to give a 15 minute service interval to Llandaff instead of every 30 minutes.

See Saturdays. That works out every 15 minutes from Cardiff and nearly every 15 minutes into Cardiff. Sadly it doesn't work on Mon-Fri though.

 

[Jellyfish261]

7/8/9 I don't understand being kept out on Canal Street. Canal Street is awful for buses, as it's more of a taxi dumping place and buses have to go stupidly slow to avoid hitting the taxis.

11s I am



Nope. Vale of Glamorgan put out a proposed reduced 320 timetable to operate from September and that excludes the bus station. I believe there is no appetite from First to serve the bus station and sadly Vale of Glamorgan Council, as the council who issued the tenders, hasn't instructed First to serve the interchange. Funny as they were a bit upset that no one used the Barry Docks interchange after they spent all the money on it, yet they won't instruct operators to use Cardiff Bus Station!

T1C using the interchange could happen but would have to use stand 1 and would depend on space given the wheelchair lift is in the middle of the coach.

Didn't clock the 7/8 did the Canal St loop - agree don't see the need.

Could just turnaround via Park St & Havelock St and use the BBC stop as both arrival/departure.

Through journeys Grangetown to/from the library end of town would be covered by the 9 anyway.

 

[SW Buses]

25/62/63 has to be considered with the commonality it has with 21/23/24.

 

[markymark2000]

Just to add to my last post, the 4 and 101/102 services will be using Stand 13 meaning Stand 13 will just be a random assortment of routes that they couldn't fit into another stand.

 

[Christian Schm]

Overall I quite like the new Cardiff bus station. I think it looks like a good facility, the quality of the interior decor is much better than any other bus station in the area. When I was there, there was plenty of staff walking the concourse and answering queries. In fact, there is no information kiosk and staff effectively have to do this (or hide completely) is quite daring. But the two I spoke to where quite happy with that arrangement and approved of it, so that is great too.

A couple of things that could be improved though:

1. The bus departure screens aren’t very readable. The white-on-black train departure screens are much clearer than the black-on-white bus ones

1. The screen flip-over software needs more work. They have two separate screens for bus departures, normally one shows English the other Welsh. Both can flip over for other info, but at times both did it at the same time.

1. While the train departure screens showed both the scheduled and the real time departures (as is normal for train departure screens), the bus ones only showed the scheduled or the real time (as is unfortunately also far too common). It is just confusing, and I struggle to see any reason why the bus departure screens can’t show both at the same time.

1. I saw timetable leaflets for Cardiff Bus only. Why not TfW and Stagecoach and whoever else uses the bus station too? Similarly, the only city centre map I could find was the electronic one from Cardiff Bus? I think a generic & static one would be useful too.

1. I am a bit confused that some rather local Cardiff Bus routes use the bus interchange, and some longer distance once do not appear to use it? Surely routes like the T4 and X30 should have priority over e.g. the 62 or 63?

1. The toilets are not good. Toilets for men and women without a flip seat – who would want to sit on those bowls? The dryers are also problematic as they create a wet patch underneath. That type of dryer may be good enough for offices with relatively low use frequency, but for public conveniences a more closed hand dryer would surely help to keep the toilet more presentable.

1. The screen appeared to show that the bus station would be closed during an event at the millenium stadium. I am surprised by that as the bus station was deliberately constructed in this position so it could have a second entrance to enable it to stay open during stadium events.

1. The street layout on the south side is not too bad, but the traffic lights do not work. As is always the case where the frequency of vehicles is very low, they get ignored by pedestrians. An uncontrolled crossing for the bus station entrance and a zebra for the car park entrance would in my view make things much clearer for pedestrians and drivers thus reduce conflict.

 

[SSmith2009]

The toilets are not good. Toilets for men and women without a flip seat – who would want to sit on those bowls? The dryers are also problematic as they create a wet patch underneath. That type of dryer may be good enough for offices with relatively low use frequency, but for public conveniences a more closed hand dryer would surely help to keep the toilet more presentable.

If they're anything like the toilets at Haymarket Bus Station in Leicester the seats were removed here to avoid vandalism and the use of drugs on them.

 

[markymark2000]

1. The screen appeared to show that the bus station would be closed during an event at the millenium stadium. I am surprised by that as the bus station was deliberately constructed in this position so it could have a second entrance to enable it to stay open during stadium events.

I presume the issue is that the second entrance and St Marys Street - Penarth Road is where a lot of people walk to get to/from the station queues for the Valley lines. I agree though, what is the point in a bus station here if it is going to have to close multiple times per year for stadium events.

1. I am a bit confused that some rather local Cardiff Bus routes use the bus interchange, and some longer distance once do not appear to use it? Surely routes like the T4 and X30 should have priority over e.g. the 62 or 63?

Both are commercial routes and so it depends if those operators can justify the costs. T4 would either an extra bus or need layover removing in Merthyr. Traffic outside the castle is awful and so for the buses from North Road to extend into the bus station, you are sending the bus through a number of traffic hotspots, and it's all worthless when it has to change again anyway on event day.

62 & 63 stopped outside on Wood Street anyway so there wasn't really a diversion there. It also removed existing services from Wood Street so that the 17/18 could start/end there rather than Westgate Street. That in turn made Westgate Street better for passengers as with buses dumped there, often buses were picking up in the middle of the road.

 

[Jellyfish261]

Overall I quite like the new Cardiff bus station. I think it looks like a good facility, the quality of the interior decor is much better than any other bus station in the area. When I was there, there was plenty of staff walking the concourse and answering queries. In fact, there is no information kiosk and staff effectively have to do this (or hide completely) is quite daring. But the two I spoke to where quite happy with that arrangement and approved of it, so that is great too.

A couple of things that could be improved though:

1. The bus departure screens aren’t very readable. The white-on-black train departure screens are much clearer than the black-on-white bus ones
2. The screen flip-over software needs more work. They have two separate screens for bus departures, normally one shows English the other Welsh. Both can flip over for other info, but at times both did it at the same time.
3. While the train departure screens showed both the scheduled and the real time departures (as is normal for train departure screens), the bus ones only showed the scheduled or the real time (as is unfortunately also far too common). It is just confusing, and I struggle to see any reason why the bus departure screens can’t show both at the same time.
4. I saw timetable leaflets for Cardiff Bus only. Why not TfW and Stagecoach and whoever else uses the bus station too? Similarly, the only city centre map I could find was the electronic one from Cardiff Bus? I think a generic & static one would be useful too.
5. I am a bit confused that some rather local Cardiff Bus routes use the bus interchange, and some longer distance once do not appear to use it? Surely routes like the T4 and X30 should have priority over e.g. the 62 or 63?
6. The toilets are not good. Toilets for men and women without a flip seat – who would want to sit on those bowls? The dryers are also problematic as they create a wet patch underneath. That type of dryer may be good enough for offices with relatively low use frequency, but for public conveniences a more closed hand dryer would surely help to keep the toilet more presentable.
7. The screen appeared to show that the bus station would be closed during an event at the millenium stadium. I am surprised by that as the bus station was deliberately constructed in this position so it could have a second entrance to enable it to stay open during stadium events.
8. The street layout on the south side is not too bad, but the traffic lights do not work. As is always the case where the frequency of vehicles is very low, they get ignored by pedestrians. An uncontrolled crossing for the bus station entrance and a zebra for the car park entrance would in my view make things much clearer for pedestrians and drivers thus reduce conflict.

Agree, overall I am a fan of the new bus station - positive even if not all services go to/from, that there is a central place to be able to ask about buses. Some interesting and constructive points raised too.

In relation to the street layout in particular, I agree there are opportunities to improve access for buses into/from and avoid delay minutes.

The 61, for example, does a tortuous loop of Park St, frustrating if your destination is the Station which you'd have had a view of from the bridge - sometimes it stops to allow alighting on Park Street, sometimes it doesn't... there doesn't seem to be a consistency.

The light timings to exit the bus station seem to take an age for a full cycle, and presumably add an unpredictability for scheduling if it's just missed - I'm not sure why the North-South / East-West lights cannot run concurrently (in addition to the pedestrian phase), rather than what I believe at the moment is all phases running separately (with the pedestrian phase).

Given the frequency of bus movements here, suspect some minor tweaks to minimise delay minutes would quickly pay off.

(An extended right turn phase from Clare Road onto Tudor St too for the 7/8/9/92/93/94's please - but that's for another day...)

 

[markymark2000]

The light timings to exit the bus station seem to take an age for a full cycle, and presumably add an unpredictability for scheduling if it's just missed - I'm not sure why the North-South / East-West lights cannot run concurrently (in addition to the pedestrian phase), rather than what I believe at the moment is all phases running separately (with the pedestrian phase).

The issue is the amount of lights in this very small area, all of them seem to be linked up too and and most of them seem to act in the same way that that only one single road will be given a green at a time with no opposing movements at all. It's all rather annoying. Plus they can't let too much traffic come from Wood Street onto St Marys Street as the big junction there has lights which are just as slow and you'd end up clogging up St Marys Street.

 

[Dai Corner]

The issue is the amount of lights in this very small area, all of them seem to be linked up too and and most of them seem to act in the same way that that only one single road will be given a green at a time with no opposing movements at all. It's all rather annoying. Plus they can't let too much traffic come from Wood Street onto St Marys Street as the big junction there has lights which are just as slow and you'd end up clogging up St Marys Street.

If they're all linked up it should be quite possible to give buses a clear run at the cost of delay to other traffic. This seems very much in line with Cardiff Council policy.

 

[markymark2000]

If they're all linked up it should be quite possible to give buses a clear run at the cost of delay to other traffic. This seems very much in line with Cardiff Council policy.

The point where that logic fails is the fact that if it makes sense, Cardiff Council won't do it. They aren't the biggest fans of buses at the moment and their priority is on taxis. As proven with St Marys Street having 2 bus stops removed to make way for taxi ranks, and the fact St Marys Street still shuts Fri/Sat nights so that the wild west taxi drivers can have bigger ranks and completely block the place. Unrelated to this topic but relevant to show how poor the council is, when Flixbus told the council that their stop wasn't accessible for wheelchair users, the council refused to let Flixbus move to another stop (around 11 months later they let Flixbus move despite there being empty bus stops available close by for that whole time). Cardiff Council is happy to keep letting events rip apart the areas public transport network with no care in the world.

Plenty of ways that Cardiff Council are against buses.

 

[Dai Corner]

The point where that logic fails is the fact that if it makes sense, Cardiff Council won't do it. They aren't the biggest fans of buses at the moment and their priority is on taxis. As proven with St Marys Street having 2 bus stops removed to make way for taxi ranks, and the fact St Marys Street still shuts Fri/Sat nights so that the wild west taxi drivers can have bigger ranks and completely block the place. Unrelated to this topic but relevant to show how poor the council is, when Flixbus told the council that their stop wasn't accessible for wheelchair users, the council refused to let Flixbus move to another stop (around 11 months later they let Flixbus move despite there being empty bus stops available close by for that whole time). Cardiff Council is happy to keep letting events rip apart the areas public transport network with no care in the world.

Plenty of ways that Cardiff Council are against buses.

But they own the bus company.