Class 33s on Portsmouth-Bristol-Cardiff-Crewe (1980s)

[contrex]

Did the Class 33s run round their trains at what must have been reversing points (Bristol TM and Cardiff Central) or were 'turnover' locos provided?

 

[ANDREW_D_WEBB]

IIRC it was a mixture of both

 

[Richard Scott]

Mostly at Bristol a fresh loco took over. Don't remember the loco that came in running round at Bristol; not saying it never happened. Imagine it was a time saver just dropping a new loco on the front?

 

[Cowley]

Mostly at Bristol a fresh loco took over. Don't remember the loco that came in running round at Bristol; not saying it never happened. Imagine it was a time saver just dropping a new loco on the front?

I certainly remember at Temple Meads seeing a 33 at one end of the train and a Canton 37/4 coupling up to the other end, but I think I also saw 33s running around, so I think it was a bit of a mixture generally?

 

[Harpo]

Mostly at Bristol a fresh loco took over. Don't remember the loco that came in running round at Bristol; not saying it never happened. Imagine it was a time saver just dropping a new loco on the front?

Could have been timetable-led? The universal run-round or engine change (without reversal) was 10 minutes. If the Temple Meads reversals were 5-9 minutes that would have dictated a loco change.

However, if there were no suitable loco to go forward on a planned loco swap, control could decide on a run-round and take a small delay.

 

[Richard Scott]

Could have been timetable-led? The universal run-round or engine change (without reversal) was 10 minutes. If the Temple Meads reversals were 5-9 minutes that would have dictated a loco change.

However, if there were no suitable loco to go forward on a planned loco swap, control could decide on a run-round and take a small delay.

I think run rounds were rare as often the Devon end of platform was often occupied so precluded it!
Fairly sure standard procedure was to re-engine.

 

[The exile]

I can remember occasions when one would run into platform 6 closely followed by the train in the other direction running into 5. Train on 5’s loco would drop onto train in 6 while new loco was coupling at the other end. Loco which had arrived on train in 6 then got a rest for an hour until the process repeated itself. Also saw loco off 6 run straight round onto train in 5. Other arrangements also applied - especially if what came in from Cardiff wouldn’t have been welcome in Portsmouth….

 

[co-tr-paul]

The 33s were mostly swapped at BTM and refuelled at Bath Road Depot before continuing on another service. Crew change too. My favorite turns .

 

[Sun Chariot]

The 33s were mostly swapped at BTM and refuelled at Bath Road Depot before continuing on another service. Crew change too. My favorite turns .

That's how I recall them. Cromptons swap at Temple Meads; I've an August '88 shot of three lined up ready by Bath Road.

To the point by @Cowley - I saw the same "swap" with 37/4s for each leg.

At Cardiff, I always saw the inbound loco taking the stock off towards Canton, then bringing it back in for its return path.

 

[Harpo]

At Cardiff, I always saw the inbound loco taking the stock off towards Canton, then bringing it back in for its return path.

About the only thing re-engining at Cardiff in that era would be the odd service heading further west without a Swansea reversal, or traction that wasn’t signed by the relieving crew.

Westbound was also preferred over eastbound as it was a much simpler move to/from Canton.

 

[xotGD]

This has made me wonder whether one set of locos shuttled between Bristol and Cardiff, with a different set between Bristol and Portsmouth, with just the occasional swap, or did locos essentially work through, with just an hour's breather at Bristol?

We need someone to fish out a copy of 1H86 (or similar) to see what the official diagrams were.

 

[hexagon789]

This has made me wonder whether one set of locos shuttled between Bristol and Cardiff, with a different set between Bristol and Portsmouth, with just the occasional swap, or did locos essentially work through, with just an hour's breather at Bristol?

We need someone to fish out a copy of 1H86 (or similar) to see what the official diagrams were.

I have one of 'Loco Hauled Travel' books for 1986 if that's any good?

 

[Harpo]

This has made me wonder whether one set of locos shuttled between Bristol and Cardiff, with a different set between Bristol and Portsmouth, with just the occasional swap, or did locos essentially work through, with just an hour's breather at Bristol?

We need someone to fish out a copy of 1H86 (or similar) to see what the official diagrams were.

The 33 diagrams on the Western were organised to base them around Eastleigh for their cyclical exams.

The Southern were incredibly possessive of their 33s but the demands for EH locos were huge.

Scotland were extremely keen to obtain 33s but were denied. The Marylebone closure scheme then proposed 33/1s push-pulling A60s between Amersham & Aylesbury, but Marylebone stayed open.

The diagrams cycled around Eastleigh were a glorious fudge to appease the Southern when pressure for their wider use to eliminate steam heat couldn’t be resisted any more.

 

[xotGD]

I have one of 'Loco Hauled Travel' books for 1986 if that's any good?

If that includes the individual loco diagrams, then yes.

 

[hexagon789]

If that includes the individual loco diagrams, then yes.

It does, yes, class-by-class plus a by origin station index of services at the back.

 

[Magdalia]

The 33 diagrams on the Western were organised to base them around Eastleigh for their cyclical exams.

The Southern were incredibly possessive of their 33s but the demands for EH locos were huge.

The diagrams cycled around Eastleigh were a glorious fudge to appease the Southern when pressure for their wider use to eliminate steam heat couldn’t be resisted any more.

The Southern had a different exam cycle to the other regions, the locos had to get back to Eastleigh every 3-4 days.

The spread of class 33s was gradual, just Portsmouth-Bristol in 1980, with Cardiff-Crewe following in 1981. West and North Wales was not until 1982. In 1980 and 1981 Bristol-Cardiff was mostly worked by a mix of WR locos.

 

[Cowley]

It does, yes, class-by-class plus a by origin station index of services at the back.

View attachment 170093

Featuring a nice cover photo of a 33 possibly heading off to Barnstaple too?

 

[Gloster]

Featuring a nice cover photo of a 33 possibly heading off to Barnstaple too?

11 was the Brighton-Exeter headcode...but the Western Region didn’t use proper headcodes. (It can’t be the Brighton as you couldn’t get right across the layout to 6 from the Southern.)

 

[Sun Chariot]

Featuring a nice cover photo of a 33 possibly heading off to Barnstaple too?

Did Barnstaple have loco run round facility by 1986 @Cowley ? I wasn't local and my first Barnstaple visit was in summer 1991.

 

[Gloster]

Did Barnstaple have loco run round facility by 1986 @Cowley ? I wasn't local and my first Barnstaple visit was in summer 1991.

Barnstaple box closed in November 1987, just making its centenary, so the run-round facilities would probably have gone then, or possibly a bit earlier due to stage work.

 

[6Gman]

The 33s were mostly swapped at BTM and refuelled at Bath Road Depot before continuing on another service. Crew change too. My favorite turns .

As a former loco diagrammer I was going to point out that it might vary depending on how many miles the loco had done since last refuelling.

 

[Ashley Hill]

Barnstaple box closed in November 1987, just making its centenary, so the run-round facilities would probably have gone then, or possibly a bit earlier due to stage work.

A short run round loop is provided just outside the station. Was often used when LHS was used vice DMU or DMU drag.

 

[Magdalia]

Featuring a nice cover photo of a 33 possibly heading off to Barnstaple too?

The caption, inside the front cover of the book, says 1000 Exeter-Barnstaple.

There was a booked loco hauled turn on summer Saturdays until 1987.

 

[hexagon789]

Featuring a nice cover photo of a 33 possibly heading off to Barnstaple too?

Sorry, was away for a bit. @Magdalia has helpfully answered though

 

[Cowley]

Did Barnstaple have loco run round facility by 1986 @Cowley ? I wasn't local and my first Barnstaple visit was in summer 1991.

Yes, without dragging this too far off topic. The main run round loop in the station was removed around 1990 from what I remember, but you could still run a loco around a couple of coaches as @Ashley Hill says just outside the station. In fact maybe you could still do that now?

 

[Sun Chariot]

Thanks. Maybe we could expand the thread title to include "Barnstaple".
I'll get mi' coat

 

[Cowley]

Thanks. Maybe we could expand the thread title to include "Barnstaple".
I'll get mi' coat

Lots of stuff about the line in this thread.

Lapford station yard

Evening everyone. A bit of a long shot, but does anyone know when the last freight ran to Lapford and what was carried etc? The yard was cut back sometime in the 1980s but still received traffic quite late on. It's only recently (the last ten years) that the loop and remaining sidings were taken...

www.railforums.co.uk

 

[Richard Scott]

Other arrangements also applied - especially if what came in from Cardiff wouldn’t have been welcome in Portsmouth….

Wasn't uncommon for Cardiff to Bristol to be a 47 or a 50, don't remember one making its way off towards Portsmouth though but I expect they did escape from time to time?

 

[Cowley]

Wasn't uncommon for Cardiff to Bristol to be a 47 or a 50, don't remember one making its way off towards Portsmouth though but I expect they did escape from time to time?

I seem to remember that loco hauled trains were hastily reintroduced after the 155s suffered door problems and those were mainly 47s?

I used to love doing the 33s on that line. It was a really interesting run out of Bristol whichever direction you went.

 

[Sun Chariot]

The joy of this forum, it unlocks distant fond memories.

This thread, for example, has taken me back to my August 1988 All Line Rail Rover; which involved a 33 (number long lost) from Temple Meads to Cardiff - head out all the way through Severn Tunnel and the Sulzer dislodged the soot! - then 37426 Cardiff to Crewe - head out for most of that run, too.