Class 442s - Now at the end of the road and to be withdrawn permanently

[spark001uk]

Bournemouth and Fratton are two of the biggest crew depots and the majority of their staff have had to learn 442s for the sake of a few peak workings.

Iirc their workload was actually spread throughout the day last year, and that was when just a few pairs were in use.

 

[Peter Mugridge]

I'm doubtful some of the peak extras that needed this stock will ever come back. The current service provision is more than adequate for the numbers travelling, bar the bizarre lack of services via Epsom (has gone from 6tph in the peaks to 2tph all day)

It's been back to 4tph on Saturdays for quite a few weeks now, and loadings improved as a result - although I do agree that the main line additionals that the 442s were intended for are unlikely to be needed as those are weekday peak flows and it's the leisure loadings that are doing very well at the moment.

 

[DorkingMain]

Iirc their workload was actually spread throughout the day last year, and that was when just a few pairs were in use.

From what I remember there were 5 diagrams - 2 peak and 3 all day. But bear in mind those workings then displaced 12 car 450s to other peak workings which are now no longer running.

 

[Train Boy]

From what I remember there were 5 diagrams - 2 peak and 3 all day. But bear in mind those workings then displaced 12 car 450s to other peak workings which are now no longer running.

Diagram 1
1B90 05.45 POO-WAT
1P17 08.00 WAT-PMH
1P32 10.15 PMH-WAT
1P35 12.30 WAT-PMH
1P50 14.45 PMH-WAT
1G53 17.15 WAT-PMS (via CSD)

Diagram 2
1P20 07.14 PMH-WAT
1P23 09.30 WAT-PMH
1P38 11.45 PMH-WAT
1P41 14.00 WAT-PMH
1P56 16.15 PMH-WAT
1B95 18.48 WAT-POO

Diagram 3
5B92 05+41 XBM-SOA
1B92 06.51 SOA-WAT
1P19 08.30 WAT-PMH
1P34 10.45 PMH-WAT
1P37 13.00 WAT-PMH
1P52 15.15 PMH-WAT
1P55 17.30 WAT-PMH

Diagram 4
1G18 06.43 PMH-WAT (via CSD)
5Y16 08+48 WAT-XCY
5P53 15+52 XCY-WAT
1P53 17.00 WAT-PMH
1P66 19.15 PMH-WAT
1B69 21.05 WAT-POO

Credit to the Frequently Requested Diagrams thread

 

[theironroad]

It's a facetious suggestion based on the original plan for them to be dragged around by TPE in place of the Mk5s they got instead.

I do feel the amount of money spend on what is essentially a micro fleet is mind boggling. Bournemouth and Fratton are two of the biggest crew depots and the majority of their staff have had to learn 442s for the sake of a few peak workings. One wonders if the Aventra fleet could have been expanded a little bit to cover workings like Guildford - Farnham, Hounslow Loop etc enough so that there would be enough 450s anyway.

In terms of reintroduction even if they do come back, their time will be probably very limited.

Only about 20 drivers sign 442s at Bournemouth and a few more guards. Fratton is only link 2, though think there was talk PC of expanding to another link. Not sure how many , imagine less than 150 drivers and guards.

Not only peak time. The xx00 and xx30 off Waterloo to pmh were pretty much all to be 442 eventually.

Plan wasn't just about releasing more 450s but getting some more 2+2 stock for longer distances .

 

[Western Sunset]

Wasn't the (initial) idea to release some 444s for refurbishment too?

 

[theironroad]

Wasn't the (initial) idea to release some 444s for refurbishment too?

I'm not sure if bringing in 442s was related to the 444 refurb programme. The 444 have all been refurbed and only a handful of 442dc saw the !ight of day.

 

[spark001uk]

From what I remember there were 5 diagrams - 2 peak and 3 all day. But bear in mind those workings then displaced 12 car 450s to other peak workings which are now no longer running.

Currently not, no. Instead they are being used to lengthen as many services as possible, for social distancing. So to my mind, if they increase to full service, eg 2tph fast to pompey, they'll either need to bring in the 442s, or shorten some Desiros, lessening social distancing (something I can see being in place for some time yet).

 

[Mag_seven]

Can I remind posters this thread is to discuss Class 442 storage, refurbishment and redeployment. If you want to discuss anything else then please start or use an appropriate thread elsewhere.

thanks

 

[spark001uk]

I've noticed the use of 4 or 6 barriers from Wolverton, whereas in previous (storage) moves the rog locos always hauled just the bare unit. Is this to provide brake force where the new braking system is not yet commissioned?

 

[221101 Voyager]

Heres my shot of 442408 at Wolverton Works. The 3rd unit to have AC motors fitted, right? The last record of a 442 I have in Wolverton before this was June 29th, has it been that long since the last one came in?! How long are these mods taking?

 

[LOL The Irony]

Heres my shot of 442408 at Wolverton Works. The 3rd unit to have AC motors fitted, right? The last record of a 442 I have in Wolverton before this was June 29th, has it been that long since the last one came in?! How long are these mods taking?

I can take at guess at they're prioritising other work over 442 AC mods, since they're not going to be needed for a while.

 

[Journeyman]

Except that ETS support on these things is long gone, the plugs have been hacked off.

That frustrates the crayonistas!

 

[AM9]

I've not visited this thread for a while, but I've just walked past the siding at Portsmouth & Southsea station and there's 442423 sitting there fully powered up. Are these units actually running services anywhere?

 

[spark001uk]

I've not visited this thread for a while, but I've just walked past the siding at Portsmouth & Southsea station and there's 442423 sitting there fully powered up. Are these units actually running services anywhere?

They haven't been, no. Not required since March now.
The class is currently undergoing ac retractioning at Wolverton, there's a few done now.

 

[Nogoohwell]

You got to admit, regardless of whether they are needed/used by SWR/government, the 442's do look good after the repaint. They have that 60's boutique style to the cab which 444's just dont have. If only they fitted the covers back over the front connectors, sure there is a reason for that other than laziness.

 

[61653 HTAFC]

You got to admit, regardless of whether they are needed/used by SWR/government, the 442's do look good after the repaint. They have that 60's boutique style to the cab which 444's just dont have. If only they fitted the covers back over the front connectors, sure there is a reason for that other than laziness.

I believe there is: think it was mentioned on this site that in the early days they had a tendency to fly off at speed.

 

[J3053B]

I was at BMH depot recently speaking to drivers who said that the 442 wouldn't be returning to service.

 

[norbitonflyer]

I believe there is: think it was mentioned on this site that in the early days they had a tendency to fly off at speed.

I read that they also had a habit of not staying up in the open position, and crashing down onto the hands of whoever was working on the connections. Replacing them with lighter, flimsier ones might have been what led to the problem of them flying off.

 

[43096]

I was at BMH depot recently speaking to drivers who said that the 442 wouldn't be returning to service.

Why would you believe messroom gossip?

 

[AM9]

They haven't been, no. Not required since March now.
The class is currently undergoing ac retractioning at Wolverton, there's a few done now.

So it is coincidence that this unit was ostensibly powered-up and ready to go?

 

[pompeyfan]

So it is coincidence that this unit was ostensibly powered-up and ready to go?

442s don’t tend to get cut out unless there’s a possession on.

 

[Western Sunset]

2411 returning from Wolverton last week.

 

[AM9]

442s don’t tend to get cut out unless there’s a possession on.

Do I assume that this means the lights (internal and external), and on-board equipment with fans, are left running 24/7?

 

[TEW]

Do I assume that this means the lights (internal and external), and on-board equipment with fans, are left running 24/7?

Yes, which is pretty standard for DC EMUs.

 

[AM9]

Yes, which is pretty standard for DC EMUs.

Wow! Another hit to their poor* power efficiency.
* Relative to their ac equivalents.

 

[pigs bay]

You got to admit, regardless of whether they are needed/used by SWR/government, the 442's do look good after the repaint. They have that 60's boutique style to the cab which 444's just dont have. If only they fitted the covers back over the front connectors, sure there is a reason for that other than laziness.

I was reliably informed many years ago that when they were new the covers were removed because they were falling down and trapping depot staff and shunters hands. in 1991 they were replaced with a lighter weight cover and THEY were successful until they went for repaint and refurb at wolverton works. After that they started causing problems, dropping whilst travelling, then when southern had them for GatEX they were all refitted until they started dividing and joining trains in Victoria and Brighton, that they decided to just remove them just to save time, and since then a couple were refitted when they went into store but SWR has seen fit to again remove them siting H&S at work policy.

 

[TEW]

Wow! Another hit to their poor* power efficiency.
* Relative to their ac equivalents.

I must caveat that by saying I don't really know what's common practice for AC EMUs, so I wasn't comparing them. I said DC EMUs as that is what I familiar with.

 

[bramling]

I must caveat that by saying I don't really know what's common practice for AC EMUs, so I wasn't comparing them. I said DC EMUs as that is what I familiar with.

I’d say it’s normal practice to leave all EMUs powered up. The only time to trip them down is if the juice is going to be off for any reason. Even when powered down correctly trains are pretty temperamental when being powered back up again, especially if they’ve been left in the open and this subject to weather (especially cold / wet / snow), drained batteries is the most obvious problem. It isn’t just older EMUs that have a monopoly on being troublesome either!

 

[Nym]

I've noticed the use of 4 or 6 barriers from Wolverton, whereas in previous (storage) moves the rog locos always hauled just the bare unit. Is this to provide brake force where the new braking system is not yet commissioned?

The old braking system was twin pipe with EP, so operated in twin pipe from the loco. The new system won't talk to a brake pipe so barriers are needed.