Class 701 'Aventra' trains for South Western Railway: progress updates

[NSEWonderer]

Boringly, 5ART and 10ART, as they are branded as Arterios. Less boringly, to be abbreviated to F(ive)ART and T(en)ART

I like 5BOR and 10ING

 

[Towers]

I like 5BOR and 10ING

 

[wickham]

OK, back to the serious stuff !!
Which 701s have not yet been delivered to SWR, I make it the following:
701017 701501 701502 at Worksop. 701001 701058 701060 701503 701504 at Derby. 701003 at Wembley.
In addition to these 701007 701008 have been delivered and returned, now at Worksop, 701005 has been delivered and returned, now at Derby.
Of all of these 701001 seems to have taken the lowest profile and I have not seen it mentioned for ages - I assume it is at Derby but it could possibly be elsewhere.
Any comments on any of this would be useful.

 

[strimmer]

I like 10WEN.

 

[Milo T.K]

By any chance has the mainline driver training started yet or no?

 

[3973EXL]

OK, back to the serious stuff !!
Which 701s have not yet been delivered to SWR, I make it the following:
701017 701501 701502 at Worksop. 701001 701058 701060 701503 701504 at Derby. 701003 at Wembley.
In addition to these 701007 701008 have been delivered and returned, now at Worksop, 701005 has been delivered and returned, now at Derby.
Of all of these 701001 seems to have taken the lowest profile and I have not seen it mentioned for ages - I assume it is at Derby but it could possibly be elsewhere.
Any comments on any of this would be useful.

701010

Realtime Trains | 5Q09 0856 Worksop Down Yard to Wembley Inter City Depot | 07/02/2024

Real-time train running information for 5Q09 0856 departure from Worksop Down Yard to Wembley Inter City Depot on 07/02/2024. From Realtime Trains, an independent source of train running info for Great Britain.

www.realtimetrains.co.uk

701003

Realtime Trains | 5Q11 1504 Wembley Inter City Depot to Eastleigh Trsmd | 07/02/2024

Real-time train running information for 5Q11 1504 departure from Wembley Inter City Depot to Eastleigh Trsmd on 07/02/2024. From Realtime Trains, an independent source of train running info for Great Britain.

www.realtimetrains.co.uk

Running late - diverted via Kenny O passed 1958 - Tooting 2027 - Wimbledon 2032

701017 moved to EH 05/01/22
701059 still to come

 

[D365]

I’ve noticed that 701 043 has been used the most on the public class 701 services. Is there any reason why this is?

Indeed. Don't know of any reason unless it's because it has the commemorative logo on it.

028 -3 outings
037 - 5 outings
039 - 8 outings (+1 cancelled because of disruption at Wraysbury)
043 - 13 outings (including today)

Nothing to do with livery/branding - the other units have required additional mods.

 

[norbitonflyer]

Nothing to do with livery/branding - the other units have required additional mods.

What mods are these?

 

[Goldfish62]

Nothing to do with livery/branding - the other units have required additional mods.

Reading somewhere else (forget where) SWR stated in January that they had 15 units ready for service. It's been suggested that the ones that haven't been used yet are simply being used for static training.

 

[transportphoto]

Doesn’t look like there’s any 701s out to play today, at least none showing on RTT. Does anyone know if they usually get allocated late?

 

[Goldfish62]

Doesn’t look like there’s any 701s out to play today, at least none showing on RTT. Does anyone know if they usually get allocated late?

Shown on RTT as running now.

 

[transportphoto]

Shown on RTT as running now.

The paths haven’t been cancelled but there’s no units allocated.

 

[bahnause]

Exactly but Stadler are used to 15kV 16 2/3Hz supplies that often struggle with regen, so regen thinking isn't near the top of their list, more at the "after thoughts" end.

I have never had any problems with regenerative braking below 15kV / 16.7 Hz (as long the OHLE was still in place...). For most of our vehicles, the braking force curve is identical to the tractive force curve as long as there are no national restrictions (the same FLIRT in german mode can have a very different braking characterisitc compared to the swiss mode). Regenerative braking has been a high priority for decades as an energy-saving measure and to minimise wear. In normal operation, a FLIRT or KISS will hardly need it except at speeds <10 km/h where blending is active or if you need high braking forces at higher speeds. But in this case you would be power limited anyway. The traction control is designed quite aggressively to optimise regenerative braking, which can have a noticeable effect on ride comfort.

 

[hwl]

I have never had any problems with regenerative braking below 15kV / 16.7 Hz (as long the OHLE was still in place...). For most of our vehicles, the braking force curve is identical to the tractive force curve as long as there are no national restrictions (the same FLIRT in german mode can have a very different braking characterisitc compared to the swiss mode).

I was primarily thinking about Germany!
Swiss and Austrian power supplies are generally much better than older German ones (especially in the East).

Regenerative braking has been a high priority for decades as an energy-saving measure and to minimise wear. In normal operation, a FLIRT or KISS will hardly need it except at speeds <10 km/h where blending is active or if you need high braking forces at higher speeds. But in this case you would be power limited anyway. The traction control is designed quite aggressively to optimise regenerative braking, which can have a noticeable effect on ride comfort.

Agreed, Aventra has lots of software to smooth out the latter issues.

 

[transportphoto]

The paths haven’t been cancelled but there’s no units allocated.

701043 now showing.

 

[bahnause]

Agreed, Aventra has lots of software to smooth out the latter issues.

30 years of liftime is enough time for a lot of software updates

The agressive traction control in our Stadler units is a feature, not a bug. What I'm really curious about is the next software release for the Re460. Especially when it comes to the compromises between ETCS (exact odometry) and optimising traction effort (controlled wheelslip) when both radars are not working.

 

[OneTrackMinded]

701043 now showing.

Yet again

 

[CB52]

Yes, flexible concertina type bellows as used on locomotives for 7+ decades. You can spot the motor bogies from the presence of a small radial duct fan unit a few feet inboard of the bogie on the under carriage (sometime with an air compressor mounted next to it so it is only visible from one side)

CL701 and the later CL730 have self ventilated traction motors. Force cooled were used on the AVENTRAs CL345, CL710 and CL720 only.

 

[Dr_Intoxicated]

I guess by using the same unit they are getting reliability data.

 

[Invincible]

I guess by using the same unit they are getting reliability data.

The tests for Eastleigh Waterloo, Poole and Staines 5Q51/2/3 and Waterloo Hounslow loop 5Q21/2/3 are continuing but RTT does not give the unit numbers, so presumably these units, if 701s, under test are still building up fault free mileage

 

[LUYMun]

Just out of curiosity, what SR EMU designation are we giving these?

I propose 5AVN/10TRA, though I've seen 5FKD/10FKD too

5/10WER (Won’t Ever Run)

 

[43096]

5/10WER (Won’t Ever Run)

5/10ALT (Alstom’s Late Trains)

 

[wickham]

Thanks 3973EXL (Post 8106) for the corrections regarding 701017/59 - missed these mainly due to my scribbled notes !
Can anyone confirm that 701001 IS still at Derby Works - very little seems to have been said about this one and after all it is "first of the class" (but quite possibly to be near the last coming !).

 

[Big Jumby 74]

Can anyone confirm that 701001 IS still at Derby Works - very little seems to have been said about this one and after all it is "first of the class" (but quite possibly to be near the last coming !).

Whilst I have no direct knowledge what so ever about the 701 introduction, it may be a case that 001 being the 'prototype' as such, may have remained at DY to act as test bed for any/all subsequent mods being made to other members of the class, and so may likely be the last/nearly last to enter passenger service. Just me thinking aloud!

 

[OneTrackMinded]

Anyone know why all the other Aventras that came after the 345s such as the 701 have slightly different motor sounds to the 345? I much prefer the 345 motor pitch, it's a lot more relaxing.

 

[Islineclear3_1]

Whilst I have no direct knowledge what so ever about the 701 introduction, it may be a case that 001 being the 'prototype' as such, may have remained at DY to act as test bed for any/all subsequent mods being made to other members of the class, and so may likely be the last/nearly last to enter passenger service. Just me thinking aloud!

Yes, most of "001" of anything doesn't enter service until most of the class have bedded in. I'm sure there have been exceptions of course

 

[NSEWonderer]

Anyone know why all the other Aventras that came after the 345s such as the 701 have slightly different motor sounds to the 345? I much prefer the 345 motor pitch, it's a lot more relaxing.

The 710(on AC) and 730 have that motor pitch you're talking about.

The 720s get noticeably closer from what I've heard to the 345s when in 10 car formation which I believe could mean its down to some form of power draw.

 

[norbitonflyer]

Yes, most of "001" of anything doesn't enter service until most of the class have bedded in. I'm sure there have been exceptions of course

The extreme case being the first two 2009 stock trains built for the Victoria Line, which never entered service - two other trains were added to the production run and took their numbers - doubtless some equipment was re-used.

 

[amazon1675]

Ayone know if 058/9/60 have been built yet?

 

[43OO4]

The extreme case being the first two 2009 stock trains built for the Victoria Line, which never entered service - two other trains were added to the production run and took their numbers - doubtless some equipment was re-used.

I wasn't aware of any extra trains and I can't seem to find any mention of them online. What's this about?