Commuter coaches

[notadriver]

The Kent commuter coach firms sometimes use their vehicles for private hire work during the day. The Clarkes fleet seems to be superb with many Tourismos which are well turned out.

It can't be a good lot for a Kings Ferry commuter driver starting work at 5am, finishing between 7pm and 8pm and getting a maximum of £90 per day. True when they park up in Millwall they aren't driving but instead have to keep their coaches spotlessly clean which is subject to inspection and loss of bonus if not up to scratch. And in addition there's the pressure of those fill in journeys - I'm told sometimes its a all the way down to Dover with cruise passengers before a dash back to London, getting another legal break in whilst being in time for the commuter trip home.

A much better way but costly way is the way national express shuttle drivers work. An hourly service with the driver spending 1 or 2 hours at most in London then returning back. The working day is then kept to 9 hours at most. I have a friend whos recently returned to National express from working at Kings Ferry and hes a lot less tired and it was worth the £15 a day pay drop he says. Actually thinking about it this is how they operate the services from Oxford to London and the airports.

 

[pitdiver]

Nat Ex tried one from MK, I used it once, very comfortable (they used a brand new Caetano Levante with the leather seats, wifi and excellent legroom) but taking over 2 hours compared with less than an hour by train it really couldn't win and was withdrawn. Though I believe some people do commute using the existing Nat Ex coaches, particularly those living near the M1 Coachway rather than the station (e.g. in Broughton).

Neil

I use to be the Manager at MK Coachway. I can confirm that there was a Commuter Coach If I remember it was called MK1. It offered bottled water and a free newspaper to passengers. However as Neil states it was withdrawn as it was uneconomical to run as the coach sat in a garage all day doing nothing. I can also confirm there were and probably still are a quite large number of commuters who use the services into London from about 0545 onwards. These passengers would purchase season ticket which meant booking each individual journey. This was a very long winded process. I was always led to believe that we were the only MK site that would book season tickets.

 

[duncombec]

I use Kings Ferry to get to and from work every day, and will soon be reaching my 5 year anniversary. Nothing compared to some commuters, though, who have been travelling with them ever since they started.

Both for commuters and drivers it is very much a matter of choice, and you take certain things into account. Some people find they can't hack it and go to or return to the train - others find that despite the delays and general unpredictability of operation, they just can't stand being stuck against someone's left armpit.

From a commuter's point of view, it is more comfortable than the train (guaranteed seat, better climate control, etc), and more convenient. As others have commented, most of the Medway suburbs are quite some way away from the station. It is also much cheaper than the train - by about £1,000, even before adding getting to the station - and I don't drive. The Blackwall Tunnel is an absolute [insert curse of choice], but it does mean coaches can serve Canary Wharf directly - otherwise only accessible by changing.

Drivers also know what they are letting themselves in for - or do if they do their research. I have lost count of the amount of times I've heard the words "bus driver" and "I won't be going anywhere". They usually last about a fortnight. Yes, you don't have to take money and you're not driving round in circles, but it is a long day, the traffic is unpredictable and you have to do your own cleaning. It is for that reason that after a long period of merely taking from elsewhere, Kings Ferry have started training their own drivers again.

I imagine the situation is similar with other companies. Clarkes, Reliance and Chalkwell have all been in the business for years, from various areas of North Kent. Chalkwell do Sittingbourne (along with Kings Ferry) and Maidstone, Kings Ferry cover Sittingbourne, Sheerness and the Medway Towns, Clarkes cover the western Medway Towns, Snodland, Vigo and New Ash Green, whilst Reliance cover Gravesend 'proper'.
In recent years a number of other operators have taken off - Centaur started with a couple of coaches and now have about 6 from Sevenoaks and Tunbridge Wells, Brookline started with one return from Kings Hill and now have two (plus a Chalkwell service), Buzzlines have been running one journey a day from Folkestone for years, and have just got permission to run three shuttles as far as North Greenwich only.
The only real failure was Bayliss' service from Deal. They were persuaded to start by some disgruntled rail commuters but a journey of 3 hours+ on a good day meant it never really took off - in its final months it was operated by a Transit minibus.

Very much a question of "you pay your money and take your choice" - my journey regularly carries 40 people each day, and indeed the company claims to transport approximately 1,500 people across 38 coaches each day (averaging about 39).

 

[Busaholic]

I use Kings Ferry to get to and from work every day, and will soon be reaching my 5 year anniversary. Nothing compared to some commuters, though, who have been travelling with them ever since they started.

Both for commuters and drivers it is very much a matter of choice, and you take certain things into account. Some people find they can't hack it and go to or return to the train - others find that despite the delays and general unpredictability of operation, they just can't stand being stuck against someone's left armpit.

From a commuter's point of view, it is more comfortable than the train (guaranteed seat, better climate control, etc), and more convenient. As others have commented, most of the Medway suburbs are quite some way away from the station. It is also much cheaper than the train - by about £1,000, even before adding getting to the station - and I don't drive. The Blackwall Tunnel is an absolute [insert curse of choice], but it does mean coaches can serve Canary Wharf directly - otherwise only accessible by changing.

Drivers also know what they are letting themselves in for - or do if they do their research. I have lost count of the amount of times I've heard the words "bus driver" and "I won't be going anywhere". They usually last about a fortnight. Yes, you don't have to take money and you're not driving round in circles, but it is a long day, the traffic is unpredictable and you have to do your own cleaning. It is for that reason that after a long period of merely taking from elsewhere, Kings Ferry have started training their own drivers again.

I imagine the situation is similar with other companies. Clarkes, Reliance and Chalkwell have all been in the business for years, from various areas of North Kent. Chalkwell do Sittingbourne (along with Kings Ferry) and Maidstone, Kings Ferry cover Sittingbourne, Sheerness and the Medway Towns, Clarkes cover the western Medway Towns, Snodland, Vigo and New Ash Green, whilst Reliance cover Gravesend 'proper'.
In recent years a number of other operators have taken off - Centaur started with a couple of coaches and now have about 6 from Sevenoaks and Tunbridge Wells, Brookline started with one return from Kings Hill and now have two (plus a Chalkwell service), Buzzlines have been running one journey a day from Folkestone for years, and have just got permission to run three shuttles as far as North Greenwich only.
The only real failure was Bayliss' service from Deal. They were persuaded to start by some disgruntled rail commuters but a journey of 3 hours+ on a good day meant it never really took off - in its final months it was operated by a Transit minibus.

Very much a question of "you pay your money and take your choice" - my journey regularly carries 40 people each day, and indeed the company claims to transport approximately 1,500 people across 38 coaches each day (averaging about 39).

A very interesting post. Just one question - do all these coach services primarily exist for Canary Wharf and environs customers, or do some continue to the City?

 

[EM2]

From what I remember when I lived in Maidstone (moving away in 1991), they were running for a long time before Canary Wharf even existed.

 

[Busaholic]

From what I remember when I lived in Maidstone (moving away in 1991), they were running for a long time before Canary Wharf even existed.

Yes, sure, but then they were as much for West End customers as City ones weren't they? A lot went to Victoria.

 

[duncombec]

A very interesting post. Just one question - do all these coach services primarily exist for Canary Wharf and environs customers, or do some continue to the City?

To say they exist "just for Canary Wharf" would be an overstatement. A lot of passengers get off there, either because they work there or for onward connections (KF usually say about 40% of their traffic boards or alights at Canary), but there is a lot of City traffic as well.

In my experience, the later the coach, the further east the traffic - very early coaches will have few for Canary and more for the western city/Victoria, mid-coaches will have a mix of the two, and the later coaches are heavily Canary orientated. However, it also depends on the day of the week or where the coach has come from - one coach from Sittingbourne was passenger-less at Queen Victoria Street last week, whereas the one in front had passengers for Victoria Street/DTI (as was).

Thank you for your nice comments about my post!

 

[deltic]

I use Kings Ferry to get to and from work every day, and will soon be reaching my 5 year anniversary. Nothing compared to some commuters, though, who have been travelling with them ever since they started.

Both for commuters and drivers it is very much a matter of choice, and you take certain things into account. Some people find they can't hack it and go to or return to the train - others find that despite the delays and general unpredictability of operation, they just can't stand being stuck against someone's left armpit.

From a commuter's point of view, it is more comfortable than the train (guaranteed seat, better climate control, etc), and more convenient. As others have commented, most of the Medway suburbs are quite some way away from the station. It is also much cheaper than the train - by about £1,000, even before adding getting to the station - and I don't drive. The Blackwall Tunnel is an absolute [insert curse of choice], but it does mean coaches can serve Canary Wharf directly - otherwise only accessible by changing.

Drivers also know what they are letting themselves in for - or do if they do their research. I have lost count of the amount of times I've heard the words "bus driver" and "I won't be going anywhere". They usually last about a fortnight. Yes, you don't have to take money and you're not driving round in circles, but it is a long day, the traffic is unpredictable and you have to do your own cleaning. It is for that reason that after a long period of merely taking from elsewhere, Kings Ferry have started training their own drivers again.

I imagine the situation is similar with other companies. Clarkes, Reliance and Chalkwell have all been in the business for years, from various areas of North Kent. Chalkwell do Sittingbourne (along with Kings Ferry) and Maidstone, Kings Ferry cover Sittingbourne, Sheerness and the Medway Towns, Clarkes cover the western Medway Towns, Snodland, Vigo and New Ash Green, whilst Reliance cover Gravesend 'proper'.
In recent years a number of other operators have taken off - Centaur started with a couple of coaches and now have about 6 from Sevenoaks and Tunbridge Wells, Brookline started with one return from Kings Hill and now have two (plus a Chalkwell service), Buzzlines have been running one journey a day from Folkestone for years, and have just got permission to run three shuttles as far as North Greenwich only.
The only real failure was Bayliss' service from Deal. They were persuaded to start by some disgruntled rail commuters but a journey of 3 hours+ on a good day meant it never really took off - in its final months it was operated by a Transit minibus.

Very much a question of "you pay your money and take your choice" - my journey regularly carries 40 people each day, and indeed the company claims to transport approximately 1,500 people across 38 coaches each day (averaging about 39).

If the Silvertown tunnel gets built reliability should improve significantly - given the number of coaches coming up from Kent it is estimated more people travel through Blackwall tunnel by public transport than car in the morning peak

 

[ChathillMan]

Go North East had "two" a few years back. It was basically Tynemouth - Newcastle - Cobalt Park branded as "Commuter Club". It was marketed as two separate routes for two different markets using ex National Express coaches.

The Tynemouth - Newcastle part was withdrawn but the Newcastle - Cobalt Park part is now operated by normal buses and more express buses operate between the two at peak times than before the " Commuter Club" experiment.