Conservative North Yorkshire mayoral candidate leaflet - dubious rail pledges?

[Northern158170]

I have looked at the Conservative’s North Yorkshire mayoral candidate and am displeased with his transport pledges including

reopening Haxby Station, restoring the Hellifield to Clitheroe link and securing half-hourly services to Scarborough

Scarborough is presumably from York but the poor wording could leave it open to attack. I feel like they have gone from vague vocabulary and typically worded messages to outright lies and misrepresentations. He would have had little to no say on at least 2 of these projects!
I’m not saying I’m surprised. Just disappointed and frustrated

The pledges in the leaflet

 

[Iskra]

At least they are realistic, rather than pie in the sky.

 

[Llandudno]

May have a marginally better chance of actually happening than Rishi’s bag of a fag packet plan to electrify the line from Crewe to Holyhead…!

 

[ainsworth74]

At least they are realistic, rather than pie in the sky.

That's what I was thinking, it makes a refreshing change for an election leaflet to contain things that might actually be achievable

 

[Northern158170]

My problem is that most of these projects will happen whether he does anything or not. It's basically taking claim for something that isn't his idea or responsibility. Clitheroe to Hellifield is already happening in June and Haxby station is already in advanced stages. 2tph to Scarborough will happen eventually

 

[bluenoxid]

The North Yorkshire mayor has a challenging task. The geography spread is huge compared to other areas with a relatively low population. They won’t be able to promise many rail improvements as they mostly link into other areas that will have other priorities. I’m surprised that the area hasn’t been carved between West Yorkshire, Humber/Yorkshire Coast and Teesside but I assume the Conservative government expect it to go blue.

 

[YorksLad12]

My problem is that most of these projects will happen whether he does anything or not. It's basically taking claim for something that isn't his idea or responsibility. Clitheroe to Hellifield is already happening in June and Haxby station is already in advanced stages. 2tph to Scarborough will happen eventually

That's politics. Everyone claims things that aren't theirs. It's priced in.

The North Yorkshire mayor has a challenging task. The geography spread is huge compared to other areas with a relatively low population. They won’t be able to promise many rail improvements as they mostly link into other areas that will have other priorities. I’m surprised that the area hasn’t been carved between West Yorkshire, Humber/Yorkshire Coast and Teesside but I assume the Conservative government expect it to go blue.

York would have been part of West Yorkshire's Combined Authority if the go-ahead had been given. There's a bit of North Yorkshire between the two areas though, which was the problem. Plus york regularly blew hot and cold over the idea.

In the original plan for local government reform in the 1970s, Harrogate would have been lumped in with West Yorkshire (as part of Leeds!). A chance missed I think, especially for commuters.

 

[deltic08]

I have looked at the Conservative’s North Yorkshire mayoral candidate and am displeased with his transport pledges including “reopening Haxby Station, restoring the Hellifield to Clitheroe link and securing half-hourly services to Scarborough (presumably from York but the poor wording could leave it open to attack). I feel like they have gone from vague vocabulary and typically worded messages to outright lies and misrepresentations. He would have had little to no say on at least 2 of these projects!

I’m not saying I’m surprised. Just disappointed and frustrated

He has also promised to help with the Harrogate-Ripon-Northallerton rail reinstatement campaign and more dualling of the A64 east of York. He is offering the World to be elected which all candidates do to get votes.

 

[Grumpy]

He has also promised to help with the Harrogate-Ripon-Northallerton rail reinstatement campaign and more dualling of the A64 east of York. He is offering the World to be elected which all candidates do to get votes.

All seems very worthwhile. At least he's not mentioning Skipton-Colne

 

[DynamicSpirit]

My problem is that most of these projects will happen whether he does anything or not. It's basically taking claim for something that isn't his idea or responsibility. Clitheroe to Hellifield is already happening in June and Haxby station is already in advanced stages. 2tph to Scarborough will happen eventually

And plus - is Clitheroe to Hellifield actually going to be a proper link with a regular service, or will it just be a couple of Sunday-only services for tourists?

 

[Ken H]

And plus - is Clitheroe to Hellifield actually going to be a proper link with a regular service, or will it just be a couple of Sunday-only services for tourists?

50% of the stations between Clitheroe and Hellifield are in Lancashire. I would bet 90% of people using these trains will be from Lancashire and Greater Manchester. Dont see the relevance to North Yorks council TBH

 

[Kite159]

And plus - is Clitheroe to Hellifield actually going to be a proper link with a regular service, or will it just be a couple of Sunday-only services for tourists?

Couple of Saturdays only services designed for tourists from Manchester.

 

[SteveM70]

“Expand rural, evening and weekend bus services”. Nothing vague there then. One extra service somewhere in North Yorkshire and hey presto he’s met his promise.

And where’s Clitherhoe?

We went to see him last Friday when his camper van tour came by ours and when I politely asked him a simple question he couldn’t or wouldn’t answer, and when I repeated it he turned his back on me and walked off

 

[norbitonflyer]

50% of the stations between Clitheroe and Hellifield are in Lancashire. I would bet 90% of people using these trains will be from Lancashire and Greater Manchester. Dont see the relevance to North Yorks council TBH

100% of the stations. Chatburn and Gisburn are both in Lancashire and there are no current propsals to open either.

 

[CaptainBen]

A certain London Mayoral candidate promised once that "No Londoner will pay a penny more for transport." That went well.

 

[sprunt]

While a regional mayor is obviously in a position to speak out and campaign for rail changes they'd like to see, are they actually in any real position to influence them?

 

[YorkRailFan]

Most of these are already happening, it's like Sunak and Hunt claiming inflation going down is their responsibility. Some of these promises give Lancashire more benefits and would need approval from Lancashire Councils. Yes they are realistic, but they're not his responsibility. I don't know what's worse, unrealistic promises or realistic promises that aren't down to the campaigner.

 

[scrapy]

As the Hellifield to Clitheroe link is already to be restored twice daily on a Saturday from June, he will happily have people believe that is his doing if he's elected in May.

50% of the stations between Clitheroe and Hellifield are in Lancashire. I would bet 90% of people using these trains will be from Lancashire and Greater Manchester. Dont see the relevance to North Yorks council TBH

Presumably as the rail service may bring tourists/daytrippers into the area from Lancashire and Greater Manchester benefitting local businesses.

 

[Ken H]

100% of the stations. Chatburn and Gisburn are both in Lancashire and there are no current propsals to open either.

Ah. I was thinking the 2 stations were Hellifield and Clitheroe. Oops.

 

[Viper]

How does that Mayor role differ to what councillors or MPs do? The promises on that leaflet don't look any different to the topics they usually cover.

 

[Snex]

The North Yorkshire mayor has a challenging task. The geography spread is huge compared to other areas with a relatively low population. They won’t be able to promise many rail improvements as they mostly link into other areas that will have other priorities. I’m surprised that the area hasn’t been carved between West Yorkshire, Humber/Yorkshire Coast and Teesside but I assume the Conservative government expect it to go blue.

Not sure I agree with that. Okay there won't be many rail upgrades (there probably isn't many needed anyway) but economically North Yorkshire is very different to both those places you've mentioned bar a few areas.

There's very little links between the likes of Northallerton and Teesside, for example.

Teesside has it's own problems aswell as Darlington has been lumped into Tees Valley when economically it's much more attached to Durham and Newcastle over Middlesbrough, similar with Hartlepool to an extent. It really doesn't need part of North Yorkshire to complicate things even more.

 

[norbitonflyer]

Ah. I was thinking the 2 stations were Hellifield and Clitheroe. Oops.

You said "between", so I assumed you didn't mean those two stations themselves.

 

[Kingston Dan]

There's very little links between the likes of Northallerton and Teesside, for example.

Teesside has it's own problems aswell as Darlington has been lumped into Tees Valley when economically it's much more attached to Durham and Newcastle over Middlesbrough, similar with Hartlepool to an extent. It really doesn't need part of North Yorkshire to complicate things even more.

Apart from the hourly train service?

Teesside south of the Tees is historically part of Yorkshire.

 

[Snex]

Apart from the hourly train service?

Teesside south of the Tees is historically part of Yorkshire.

I meant more economically rather than rail journeys, sorry wasn't clear.

Economically they're very very different places and the purpose of the Mayor isn't just for transport. The whole of the North East should be really together since currently there's places like Newton Aycliffe and Darlington which very connected currently in two different areas. The former even has a Darlington post code.

You could probably make a similar argument for the whole of Yorkshire aswell really. That's for another thread though.

 

[MisterSheeps]

50% of the stations between Clitheroe and Hellifield are in Lancashire. I would bet 90% of people using these trains will be from Lancashire and Greater Manchester. Dont see the relevance to North Yorks council TBH

I can imagine if the Hellifield terminator offers connections to Carlisle or Morecambe then useful journeys could be made to & fro Preston / Greater Manchester from North Yorksire stations (Garsdale & Bentham south to Long Preston are in North Yorkshire), though stations on the Settle Carlisle have always looked economically mainly to Airedale

 

[thejuggler]

How does that Mayor role differ to what councillors or MPs do? The promises on that leaflet don't look any different to the topics they usually cover.

Mayors are supposed to be about regional government and have responsibility for larger region wide projects, transport gets most attention, but they also support delivery of housing and assist business growth.

Apart from the Mayor its a largely unelected layer of Government as political control is made up of Councillors from the Councils making up the regions.

 

[yorksrob]

Surely one of the best things for passengers would be to bring York into the Metro area.

 

[YorksLad12]

Surely one of the best things for passengers would be to bring York into the Metro area.

You can't do that without lopping off the bit of North Yorkshire between the two areas. And, as I said, York kept blowing hot and cold over the matter. Better to leave them where they are, politically; I doubt fares from York to Leeds would come down to a per-mile ration similar to those within West Yorkshire.

 

[DynamicSpirit]

Surely one of the best things for passengers would be to bring York into the Metro area.

Trouble is, York isn't anywhere near the urban area that would normally make sense to be considered the 'metro' area. There's about 15 miles of pure countryside between York and the edge of Leeds.

 

[Snex]

Surely one of the best things for passengers would be to bring York into the Metro area.

Personally, I'd argue that there should be a combined travel authority, that brings all the Yorkshire's together rather than expanding Metro with fares across the whole area.

There's so many overlap areas, Barnsley to Leeds or Sheffield, Hull to anywhere etc that it doesn't make sense it all being split up. Otherwise it's just going to be a Metro goes to York, it should go to Harrogate, Metro goes to Harrogate it should go to Skipton. Cheap fares at York, why aren't we part of it in Selby. If Selby are in why aren't we getting this in Malton and so on.