Delay repay - "arrival" time was incorrect

[ondi]

Hi all, was wondering if anyone had any thoughts on this one.

Couple of weeks ago I was travelling from Berkhamsted to Euston. Scheduled arrival was 2331, but we didn't get into Euston until 0019. However, once we got to Euston, the driver told us that the platform we were on was already occupied, so he had to walk the length of the train, reverse the train, walk back and then drive into a new platform. We finally got off the train at around 0040.

I put in for delay repay, but only got a 50% refund due to the train having "arrived" only 48 minutes late. The delay after reversing out of the platform was not taken into account.

I'm going to appeal the decision, is there anywhere I can find the data to back up what happened?

Cheers

 

[Snow1964]

Surely the arrival time should be when doors are released
Obviously in most cases will be seconds after stopping, but clearly not in your case.

I am not sure how they log arrivals at Euston, but it clearly isn’t when whole train reached the platform.

 

[AlterEgo]

Probably won’t be on an open data feed but it’s also not on you to provide the data. This action would have been logged at Control.

 

[Haywain]

If the move to another platform shows up anywhere it won't be logged as the service you were on. However, as @AlterEgo has stated, it will have been recorded in the control log and possibly in locally maintained logs as well. Simply explain the reason you are appealing.

 

[robbeech]

Whilst we would all like to show this as an example of the railway being incompetent, it’s actually just the automated system taking the date it has available into account, we could suggest the creators of the system are incompetent but I think we have to draw the line somewhere.

A simple appeal should get your case looked at by a human who should use a little common sense and pay out the remainder of the compensation due.
Be clear and concise in your explanation.
It would be useful for you to update this thread when you receive an outcome.
good luck.

 

[ondi]

I have received a surprisingly fast response to my appeal, with an unsurprisingly unhelpful response. The appeal stated "We have checked your journey and on this occasion, we could not find a delay of 15 minutes or more.", this is despite having already refunded me based on a delay of 30 to 59 minutes.

I've emailed customer services, but they estimate a 20 day wait for a reply.

 

[Watershed]

I have received a surprisingly fast response to my appeal, with an unsurprisingly unhelpful response. The appeal stated "We have checked your journey and on this occasion, we could not find a delay of 15 minutes or more.", this is despite having already refunded me based on a delay of 30 to 59 minutes.

I've emailed customer services, but they estimate a 20 day wait for a reply.

Make sure your email to customer services is clearly indicated as a complaint. You thereby start the clock on being able to proceed to the Rail Ombudsman, should their response be unsatisfactory (or delayed!).

 

[WelshBluebird]

Whilst we would all like to show this as an example of the railway being incompetent, it’s actually just the automated system taking the date it has available into account, we could suggest the creators of the system are incompetent but I think we have to draw the line somewhere.

I'd say if a system in use is not fit for purpose (and based on the posts on this forum, the automated systems in place are absolutely not fit for purpose) then continuing to use that system is the railway being incompetent. The easy answer would be to remove the automated systems, or at least have the ability for a passenger to flag that this is a more complex case and it really needs a human being to look at it (though I guess this is potentially open for "abuse").

 

[gray1404]

At appeal stage a person should have looked at this

 

[AlterEgo]

Don’t they answer the phone? I’d always call, have a conversation, and get it dealt with there and then.

 

[MikeWh]

Don’t they answer the phone? I’d always call, have a conversation, and get it dealt with there and then.

My last experience with Southeastern was that the DR people never spoke on the phone. I gave up after 4 attempts to resolve an Oyster and contactless claim where the kids zip Oyster was logged on my account.

 

[robbeech]

I'd say if a system in use is not fit for purpose (and based on the posts on this forum, the automated systems in place are absolutely not fit for purpose) then continuing to use that system is the railway being incompetent. The easy answer would be to remove the automated systems, or at least have the ability for a passenger to flag that this is a more complex case and it really needs a human being to look at it (though I guess this is potentially open for "abuse").

Automated delay repay systems correctly handle the majority of claims. This enables people to be paid in a few days instead of weeks. So getting rid of them would be a terrible move. Where it goes wrong is what happens when the system cannot accept it.

They currently accept or reject whereas they should accept or refer to manual review. The trouble is there’s absolutely zero incentive to do this. The railway tried to place as many opportunities for a claim to fail as it can. The idea is that the more opportunities you provide for the passenger to give up the less you have to payout.

*Making it difficult to fill in the initial form.

*Rejecting initial claims that involve missed connections / off route alternatives etc.

*Making the process of appealing difficult.

*20 working days.

*Second Rejection

*No instructions on what to do next.

*20 working days after customer services email.

*fob off reply saying it’s too late to claim.

*20 working days after reply

*Reply asking for photo of tickets they’ve already got

*20 working days to reply.

*generic hollow apology and a request for bank details to pay funds to.

*20 working days to reply

*email to say payment will be there in 10 working days.

Plenty of tedious opportunity for the passenger to give up. And it’s well worth it fir the operator.

 

[ondi]

Pretty much as @robbeech suggested. They replied on the 20 day deadline, saying payment would be made in 10 days.

"Having looked at the claim registered online and the additional detail provided below, I am happy to agree to a further payment for the additional delay encountered. For ease, I have now requested an additional "top up" payment on your original delay repay claim of a further £6.15

You will therefore receive a further email from the system stating the compensation was "incorrectly calculated" and an additional payment will be made."

So I got the correct refund in the end, taking just over a month to get it all sorted.

 

[robbeech]

Pretty much as @robbeech suggested. They replied on the 20 day deadline, saying payment would be made in 10 days.

"Having looked at the claim registered online and the additional detail provided below, I am happy to agree to a further payment for the additional delay encountered. For ease, I have now requested an additional "top up" payment on your original delay repay claim of a further £6.15

You will therefore receive a further email from the system stating the compensation was "incorrectly calculated" and an additional payment will be made."

So I got the correct refund in the end, taking just over a month to get it all sorted.

Good to see it settled, but overall absolutely appalling attitude and behaviour from them. How many people will be in a similar position and will have given up? It’s a game to them.