Deltic allocations.

[Old_git55]

I wonder if any Deltic historians out there can help me? Both my brother and I have a vivid memory of Pinza hauling the Hook Continental, Liverpool St. to Parkeston Quay sometime around 1967 but a guy I met who worked at Stratford said this isn't possible. Any ideas?

 

[IanXC]

In terms of what their booked workings were this website is very useful:

Report Codes

Whether there could, for some reason, have been one working an additional/ad hoc move wouldn't be answered by that mind.

 

[Magdalia]

I wonder if any Deltic historians out there can help me? Both my brother and I have a vivid memory of Pinza hauling the Hook Continental, Liverpool St. to Parkeston Quay sometime around 1967 but a guy I met who worked at Stratford said this isn't possible. Any ideas?

I'm more of a historian of East Anglian rail operations than a historian of Deltics.

I'm in agreement with the guy who worked at Stratford.

The likely traction on the Hook Continental in 1967 would be an EE Type 3, later class 37. It is not unknown for people (particularly children) to mistake them for Deltics.

In terms of what their booked workings were this website is very useful:

Report Codes

Whether there could, for some reason, have been one working an additional/ad hoc move wouldn't be answered by that mind.

The Napier Chronicles website is a very good source for Deltic history.

 

[Big Jumby 74]

It is not unknown for people (particularly children) to mistake them for Deltics

I would concur about making mistakes in one's youth (personal experience etc), BUT, the OP mentions 'Pinza' in particular, as opposed to remembering just 'a Deltic', so did they witness the nameplate and/or number (D)9007? Deltics did visit the DRS at Stratford, and a couple of books I have, D.Brennand's 'London's East End Railways - part 1' has a photo of 9007 outside the DRS in March 1972 (page 31) and another of 9000 inside same in July 1970. Both taken by an Arthur Nugent, known to the author, as both worked there. Also in 'Diesels Nationwide' by Keith Montague plate 144 shows 'The Black Watch' approaching Stratford station from the South West (light engine) heading towards Temple Mills in 1976. All later dates wise than the OP's question I appreciate, but obviously the class did have a presence on that patch other than for open days at 30A.

 

[Magdalia]

9000 inside same in July 1970

9000 in July 1970 was a minor collision damage repair after running through the level crossing gates at Claypole. Railway Observer October 1970 described it as an "unusual visitor", which suggests that Stratford did not get Deltic visits very often in those days.

And, once repairs were complete, 9000 would almost certainly have headed back to Finsbury Park immediately, because it would be needed for ECML service. If test runs were required these were usually done on 1130 Kings Cross-Cambridge and 1330 back.

 

[Clarence Yard]

I would concur about making mistakes in one's youth (personal experience etc), BUT, the OP mentions 'Pinza' in particular, as opposed to remembering just 'a Deltic', so did they witness the nameplate and/or number (D)9007? Deltics did visit the DRS at Stratford, and a couple of books I have, D.Brennand's 'London's East End Railways - part 1' has a photo of 9007 outside the DRS in March 1972 (page 31) and another of 9000 inside same in July 1970. Both taken by an Arthur Nugent, known to the author, as both worked there. Also in 'Diesels Nationwide' by Keith Montague plate 144 shows 'The Black Watch' approaching Stratford station from the South West (light engine) heading towards Temple Mills in 1976. All later dates wise than the OP's question I appreciate, but obviously the class did have a presence on that patch other than for open days at 30A.

9007 was stopped on the 23rd March 1972 with a failed suspension tube (No5) and shopped to Stratford DRS for repair. (Source - KX Division Loco/DMU Shopping Book - in my possession)

Stratford DRS used to see Deltics for repair on odd occasions in the early to mid seventies. The locos were usually cycled via Finsbury Park and were not used on the GE. Control of Deltics was strict in those days - it was career limiting to muck around with them.

People forget that Finsbury Park didn’t have any lifting facilities (apart from the breakdown crane - a bit of a faff using that - seized wheelsets was what it tended to be used for) so there was a real focus on getting your maintenance and repairs arising right, first time.

So Stratford DRS was a valuable jobbing shop to carry out work, especially when Doncaster was full up. On the KX Division, we used to hand wash our locos but even the small mobile Warwick bogie washer wouldn’t shift all the muck off the underneath a Brush 2 so we used to send them in between shops to Stratford DRS for lift and wash. Vital when you have a loco or DMU that has a lot of start and stop work. If you didn’t, they had a tendency to catch fire. Looking at you, LMR!

 

[Old_git55]

I would concur about making mistakes in one's youth (personal experience etc), BUT, the OP mentions 'Pinza' in particular, as opposed to remembering just 'a Deltic', so did they witness the nameplate and/or number (D)9007? Deltics did visit the DRS at Stratford, and a couple of books I have, D.Brennand's 'London's East End Railways - part 1' has a photo of 9007 outside the DRS in March 1972 (page 31) and another of 9000 inside same in July 1970. Both taken by an Arthur Nugent, known to the author, as both worked there. Also in 'Diesels Nationwide' by Keith Montague plate 144 shows 'The Black Watch' approaching Stratford station from the South West (light engine) heading towards Temple Mills in 1976. All later dates wise than the OP's question I appreciate, but obviously the class did have a presence on that patch other than for open days at 30A.

We had spare time before departure so walked up to look at the loco and what sticks in both our minds is the name plate, years before either of us knew what a deltic was.

I'm more of a historian of East Anglian rail operations than a historian of Deltics.

I'm in agreement with the guy who worked at Stratford.

The likely traction on the Hook Continental in 1967 would be an EE Type 3, later class 37. It is not unknown for people (particularly children) to mistake them for Deltics.


The Napier Chronicles website is a very good source for Deltic history.

We arrived at the station well before departure and so both walked up to look at the locomotive and the strong memory we have is of the nameplate - long before either of us knew what a deltic was. I've checked with my other siblings and as children Liverpool Street is the only London station we visited other than Marylebone.

 

[Magdalia]

the strong memory we have is of the nameplate

as children Liverpool Street is the only London station we visited other than Marylebone.

These are the only stations that you remember visiting. That doesn't mean that you never visited Kings Cross, and it could be that your memory is muddling Liverpool Street and Kings Cross. The story of how the Hogwarts Express came to leave from Kings Cross and not Euston demonstrates that childhood memory is partial and fallible.

Logically, it doesn't follow that because you remember Pinza, and you remember Liverpool Street, that you saw Pinza at Liverpool Street.

The most likely explanation is that you saw Pinza at Kings Cross, even though none of you remember visiting there.

 

[6Gman]

I wonder if any Deltic historians out there can help me? Both my brother and I have a vivid memory of Pinza hauling the Hook Continental, Liverpool St. to Parkeston Quay sometime around 1967 but a guy I met who worked at Stratford said this isn't possible. Any ideas?

May I ask what age you would have been at that date?

 

[Old_git55]

These are the only stations that you remember visiting. That doesn't mean that you never visited Kings Cross, and it could be that your memory is muddling Liverpool Street and Kings Cross. The story of how the Hogwarts Express came to leave from Kings Cross and not Euston demonstrates that childhood memory is partial and fallible.

Logically, it doesn't follow that because you remember Pinza, and you remember Liverpool Street, that you saw Pinza at Liverpool Street.

The most likely explanation is that you saw Pinza at Kings Cross, even though none of you remember visiting there.

The only two London terminii we ever visited were Marylebone (coming into out of London from Great Missenden) and Liverpool Street (for our yearly trips to the Netherlands). I've asked my eldest sibling and she confirms that we never went anywhere else by rail.

May I ask what age you would have been at that date?

Twelve, which would've made my brother eight. It was the last year my father travelled with us.