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Disruption on HS1 due to signalling problems caused by flooding in the Thames Tunnel.

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D6130

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Kent On-line is reporting the Eurostar and South Eastern Javelin services are suffering delays of up to 50 minutes this afternoon due to signalling issues caused by flooding in the Thames Tunnel between Stratford International and Ebbsfleet International. Has this ever happened before....or is it a side effect of Storm Gerrit?
 
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kentrailman

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I thought this would be a high up well used thread. Is there perhaps another post I missed ? Does anyone know what has caused the flooding ? An easily fixed burst pipe or something more long term and difficult to fix ?
 

800Travel

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They tweeted about it:

https://x.com/stevewhiterail/status/1740808818806898747

“Flooding in the tunnel near Ebbsfleet International has disrupted our high speed services since today. Work continues to allow us to reopen safely. We are seeking assurances from HS1 that a full service can operate tomorrow”

The reposted tweet contains an image of the flooding, and further down in the thread there is a video of the flooding too.

Looks like some kind of burst pipe?
 
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Dave W

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I was told at Gillingham that the 2224 back to town was reinstated (I had seen it cancelled) - so I'm on that. We've crawled through Gravesend and Ebbsfleet (stopping at both) and having departed are now sat just outside the station.

What next, no one knows. Driver/guard updates are usually pretty good on HS1 so I am surprised not to have heard anything - although perhaps they are keeping their powder dry (unlike the tunnel ho ho...)
 

Benjwri

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This video was posted by SouthEastern on Twitter.
⚠️ONGOING: Another video from the tunnel near #EbbsfleetInternational where the flooding has occurred
The video shows water sparing out a wall where a pipe enters. Obviously not just rainfall, and either that pipe has burst, whether it is carrying mains water or pump water, or the lining has failed and that is groundwater, although I’m not sure the tunnel is deep enough for that much water to enter that quickly from the ground.
 

Dave W

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This video was posted by SouthEastern on Twitter.

The video shows water sparing out a wall where a pipe enters. Obviously not just rainfall, and either that pipe has burst, whether it is carrying mains water or pump water, or the lining has failed and that is groundwater, although I’m not sure the tunnel is deep enough for that much water to enter that quickly from the ground.

Aha! We are now on the move and have just passed that very spot inside the tunnel!
 

TFN

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Now both Thames tunnels shut and Eurostar/southeastern not running from St Pancras this morning.
 

Taunton

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This video was posted by SouthEastern on Twitter.

The video shows water sparing out a wall where a pipe enters. Obviously not just rainfall, and either that pipe has burst, whether it is carrying mains water or pump water, or the lining has failed and that is groundwater, although I’m not sure the tunnel is deep enough for that much water to enter that quickly from the ground.
Thames Water engineers are reported working on the issue, which thus sounds like a water supply pipe problem rather than anything else.
 

Snow1964

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If only Ebbsfleet International was operational…
How long would it take to put St Pancras International staff on a Thameslink and SE train, and get them to do their shift at Ebbsfleet instead.

They were opened at same time, so not like the equipment is going to be different and wouldn't have a clue how to operate it.
 

andyrail

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Thames Water engineers are reported working on the issue, which thus sounds like a water supply pipe problem rather than anything else.
That figures for me.
I thought that it would be unlikely to be storm or river flooding - the tunnel must surely have been designed to withstand the latter.
 

Benjwri

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How long would it take to put St Pancras International staff on a Thameslink and SE train, and get them to do their shift at Ebbsfleet instead.

They were opened at same time, so not like the equipment is going to be different and wouldn't have a clue how to operate it.
Probably fairly long, but also all the equipment will have been mothballed, and probably be out of date. Was Ebbsfleet open for post Brexit? If not it might not have the equipment or setup for post Brexit checks.

Regardless there is nothing stopping Eurostar operating a limited service in the UK direction only to at least get some people back
 

popeter45

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is the thames tunnel bi-directionally signalled like the channel tunnel?
could use wennington crossover to allow single track working for a reduced service of eurostar?

also more crayon than realistic but could they still drag 373s with 73's via NLL to Fawkham Junction?
 

Alfie1014

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Thames Water engineers are reported working on the issue, which thus sounds like a water supply pipe problem rather than anything else.
Is this not far from where a water main burst earlier in the year that caused the A226 road to partly collapse? May of course be totally unconnected.
 

Failed Unit

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Probably fairly long, but also all the equipment will have been mothballed, and probably be out of date. Was Ebbsfleet open for post Brexit? If not it might not have the equipment or setup for post Brexit checks.

Regardless there is nothing stopping Eurostar operating a limited service in the UK direction only to at least get some people back
Covid was the excuse to shut it down, so it hasn’t operated during the later stages of Brexit.
 

Benjwri

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Covid was the excuse to shut it down, so it hasn’t operated during the later stages of Brexit.
So using Ebbsfleet or Ashford for departures wouldn’t be possible regardless of staffing and training issues.
 

Failed Unit

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Not quickly. I am sure if it was closed for a week, they would find a way of getting them open. I have never used Ebbsfleet so I don’t know how bit it is. St Pancras struggles at busy times. Eurostar don’t seem to have cancelled everything, for example the 1032 Paris is still showing as running. We will soon see for sure.
 

Trainguy34

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On KmFm radio and website, saw the video on there and it looks insanely bad. RTT's cancellation codes might actually be right - utility supplies problems.

Looks like Ramsgate - Medway - St Pancras services are terminating at Faversham and Margate - Canterbury - St Pancras services aswell as Ramsgate - Dover - St Pancras are terminating at Ashford Int'l.
 

Benjwri

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Thames Water engineers are reported working on the issue, which thus sounds like a water supply pipe problem rather than anything else.
I would’ve thought the tunnel is too deep for water supply lines. From a schematic I have it seems to be a pipe for the drainage pumps, so perhaps Thames Water is attending because the waste water is dealt with by them and it’s their part of the pipeing that burst?
 

John Webb

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I would’ve thought the tunnel is too deep for water supply lines. From a schematic I have it seems to be a pipe for the drainage pumps, so perhaps Thames Water is attending because the waste water is dealt with by them and it’s their part of the pipeing that burst?
Possibly mains water for fire protection purposes?
 

Horizon22

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Not quickly. I am sure if it was closed for a week, they would find a way of getting them open. I have never used Ebbsfleet so I don’t know how bit it is. St Pancras struggles at busy times. Eurostar don’t seem to have cancelled everything, for example the 1032 Paris is still showing as running. We will soon see for sure.

Also even if it was open, there’d have to be some mega bus operation to somewhere like Gravesend / Rochester / Dartford or Southeastern would have to be terminating at Ebbsfleet too and circulate down the line to get people moving.

Shifting a few thousand people from a station with no onward connections every hour or so is no small undertaking!
 

grinderx

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Not going to pretend that it is easy but you have to admit that eurostar falls way short of what you would reasonably expect of conventional railways or planes.

Eurostar has basically zero resiliency. It isn't good enough if more than half of paris London journeys depend on them.

We hear loads of excuses but much of this could be sorted through better planning and advance preparation.

There are other trains down to the coast. They could use different operators or surge somehow with different stock. They could negotiate in advance to do border checks at lille or Paris? Or have a way to reopen Ashford at short notice. Or run buses through le shuttle or ferries.

None of this should be hard. There are loads of possibilities but none are viable because there is no prep. So everytime we just get told that it isn't possible. It represents massive ignorance and greed to just not bother with contingency planning. Especially when fares are approaching or exceeding 500 quid return on trains with many hundreds of seats.

I'm of course not suggesting eurostar doesn't try to get some passengers to cancel or postpone to reduce load. But to do nothing is just inexcusable.
 
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