• Our new ticketing site is now live! Using either this or the original site (both powered by TrainSplit) helps support the running of the forum with every ticket purchase! Find out more and ask any questions/give us feedback in this thread!

Even more announcements on SWR

Sealink

Member
Joined
16 Aug 2006
Messages
346
I guarantee* these announcements (like "the train may stop suddenly") is because the train stopped suddenly and someone complained.
I'd also wager that things like feet off seats is to minimise staff interaction in an incident that could get out of hand.

*not guaranteed
 
Sponsor Post - registered members do not see these adverts; click here to register, or click here to log in
R

RailUK Forums

Lewisham2221

Established Member
Joined
23 Jun 2005
Messages
2,110
Location
Staffordshire
The front of the train had a prominent 92 so anyone could know where it was going.
Ah yes, train 92! Please remind Gladys from Tutbury what the ultimate destination of "92" is? And which station the train calls at immediately prior to the station where she is alighting?

Now when I go into Manchester I’m told we’re arriving in Stockport when we aren’t, presumably because “someone” decided it was appropriate to leave lots of time for collecting belongings etc.
As a local and fairly frequent traveller, I should rather expect you'd be aware of your imminent arrival into Stockport without any audible announcement whatsoever. Tyler from Frome is probably somewhat less familiar with the journey and the local area, and being somewhat unaware of where he is, rather appreciates the announcement that gives him sufficient time to put his iPad and charger away, put on his coat, grab his bag from the overhead rack and make his way towards the doors without having to do so in a mad panic and in fear of missing his stop and ending up at Piccadilly, facing a penalty fare or prosecution or whatever for travelling beyond the validity of his ticket and ending arriving at his intended destination significantly later than planned.

Worst I ever heard was when the auto announcements at Birmingham New Street were first turned on, but I think these were so bad that they’ve been curtailed somewhat since.
I'll agree that the barrage of automated announcements at some stations does indeed seem rather excessive, although it's easy to see the arguments for why most of it is felt as necessary to have, so it would perhaps be difficult to significantly reduce this without omitting some information that one person feels is not needed but others may argue is important.
 

canary fan

Member
Joined
8 Nov 2024
Messages
14
Location
Camberley
Speaking as train crew (not SWR), I have noticed the amount of litter left on late evening services and the number of passengers that think it’s acceptable to put their clodhoppers on the seats. Generally, I don’t tend to overdo the announcements, but on a recent late night service out of London I thought I’d add in a pre-departure announcement about litter and feet. Throughout the journey I noticed a lot less feet on seats and later in the journey I noticed a marked reduction in the amount of litter left hanging around. Maybe the announcement worked!!
One thing I have noticed though, is that on board bins never seem to be big enough - either for volume or the width of the opening. One empty Costa cup makes the bin look full!
I’m guessing you work for Greater Anglia. The bins by the exit doors are minuscule and always stuffed. Presumably they were approved by the same people who thought tiny basins in the toilet, which always result in the floor getting wet, were a good idea.
 

Goldfish62

Veteran Member
Joined
14 Feb 2010
Messages
11,664
This, this, a million times this!

If you regularly travel on another TOC, you will eventually tune all the announcements out.

If you don't travel on SWR Class 444 trains with some regularity, you won't be able to appreciate that on these services, this tuning-out is impossible. The auto-announcements are an acceptable volume, but manual guard announcements are routinely 85 decibels plus. The manual announcements will often take almost two minutes each time, as well. After every stop yesterday, the guard announced, at over 85 decibel volume:

- Destination (the auto announcer said this 15 seconds ago)
- Calling Points (the auto announcer said this 15 seconds ago)
- Next Stop (the auto announcer said this 15 seconds ago)
- First class locations
- Quiet coach locations ("please keep noise down here"- the irony!)
- Safety notices are located in every coach (so they're everywhere then- does this need to be said?)
- If you see something unusual... (the auto announcer said this 15 seconds ago)
- Where the guard is located (potentially useful to be fair; only say this and let the auto-announcements cover everything else?)

The journeys are otherwise pleasant. This constant barraging of loud messaging really is a step-above what is experienced elsewhere.

(As an aside- I've never noticed passengers elsewhere muttering "shut up"(*) during announcements, apart from on SWR).

* or words not quite so polite!
Reading this, I'm thankful that on my part of the SWR network guards are much less vocal, or in some cases not at all! Of course in the latter case it's not so helpful when the auto announcements are also not working!
 

NickBucks

Member
Joined
17 May 2013
Messages
217
Given the multicultural nature of our society especially in major urban areas I am surprised that these announcements are not made in say the top five most spoken languages in the country. I think Chiltern did use Mandarin and Cantonese on the services to Bicester village, not sure if they still do. I assume TfW trains have English & Welsh announcements ? I would have thought this should be essential for Heathrow Express and Elizabeth line services to Heathrow. Once that is done we could of course look at dialects but that would be a separate topic. Au Revoir !
 

stadler

Established Member
Joined
5 Jun 2023
Messages
1,420
Location
Horsley
Given the multicultural nature of our society especially in major urban areas I am surprised that these announcements are not made in say the top five most spoken languages in the country. I think Chiltern did use Mandarin and Cantonese on the services to Bicester village, not sure if they still do. I assume TfW trains have English & Welsh announcements ? I would have thought this should be essential for Heathrow Express and Elizabeth line services to Heathrow. Once that is done we could of course look at dialects but that would be a separate topic. Au Revoir !
Chiltern Railways still have Arabic and Mandarin announcements on approach to Bicester Town station.

Transport For Wales have Welsh language announcements at all of their railway stations and onboard their 197/231/398/756/MK4 trains.

Gatwick Express have French and Spanish and Italian announcements on their 387s and on their 442s and 460s previously. They also used to have German but got rid of this on the 387s only a year after they entered service. I have no idea why they got rid of German but kept the others.

Stansted Express used to have Spanish and Italian announcements on their 379s but their current 720s and 745s and 755s have no foreign languages.

Eurostar have French announcements for all trains at London St Pancras and also at Ashford and Ebbsfleet before they closed. They also have Dutch announcements but only for the Amsterdam trains. Oddly for the Brussels trains the Dutch does not play.

There is nothing other than that. I am always surprised at how little foreign announcements we have compared to other countries Heathrow Airport has absolutely no foreign announcements on their trains or at their stations. But i suppose English is basically the global language and spoken by so many people. So it is less necessary compared to other countries.
 

Via Bank

Member
Joined
28 Mar 2010
Messages
740
Location
London
No-one who's had a few to drink or is determined to cause trouble is going to listen to an announcement warning them about body-worn cameras or being reported to the police. Meanwhile for the majority of normal people, it (a) adds additional verbal noise (b) creates the impression that the railway is infested with antisocial behaviour.

The announcement about penalty fares has at least doubled in length. Nothing about the old one was incorrect, but presumably someone decided they also wanted to threaten people with a scary figure of £100 or 'prosecution.' Again, no-one determined (or desperate enough) to avoid their fare is going to pay attention to it, and it creates the impression of a hostile environment for those who have paid.

As with so many things in this country, an announcement will not make everything better.
 

Parallel

Established Member
Joined
9 Dec 2013
Messages
4,107
The announcement about penalty fares has at least doubled in length. Nothing about the old one was incorrect, but presumably someone decided they also wanted to threaten people with a scary figure of £100 or 'prosecution.' Again, no-one determined (or desperate enough) to avoid their fare is going to pay attention to it, and it creates the impression of a hostile environment for those who have paid.

As with so many things in this country, an announcement will not make everything better.
I took a class 159 from Salisbury last week that had the message expanded even further, and started talking about only being able to use advance purchase tickets on booked trains only. It was tagged onto the end of the usual penalty fare announcement so I’m not sure if it was on a unit for a trial but I don’t think it was manually triggered.

SWR can’t do concise at all with any of their PA systems. They use their own customised scripts at the stations which are excessively wordy. It all adds up.
 

Taunton

Established Member
Joined
1 Aug 2013
Messages
11,093
It's not just audio announcements. The departure indicators on DLR platforms show the next three trains - or showed when they were installed, before the Message Overload Department got hold of them and interposed their own load of babble on them; lifts out of action at the other end of the system in the opposite direction, take care in wet weather; See It Say It ..., etc. A brief flash of the next three trains, then it's Next Train Approaching, as if you can't see it, which then flashes throughout its station stop.
 

43096

On Moderation
Joined
23 Nov 2015
Messages
16,709
Is there any evidence anyone can point to of this being an issue for the wider travelling public? For example do people regularly criticise the railway for having too many announcements in passenger surveys?
No, because the surveys have loaded questions.

Which question do you think gets used in the surveys:
- Were regular announcements made during your journey?
- Was the number of announcements: too few/just right/too many?
 

Horizon22

Established Member
Associate Staff
Jobs & Careers
Joined
8 Sep 2019
Messages
9,309
Location
London
I'll agree that the barrage of automated announcements at some stations does indeed seem rather excessive, although it's easy to see the arguments for why most of it is felt as necessary to have, so it would perhaps be difficult to significantly reduce this without omitting some information that one person feels is not needed but others may argue is important.

One of the problems I have found is a lack of knowledge on how the system will work in scheduling announcements.

In a Worldline CIS (probably the most common software used) when the operator schedules an announcement to plan every X minutes, a start and end time needs to be supplied (normally something like 0600-2200). For ease most people start it on the xx:00 but if there’s a clash (likely) the system auto-schedules it for 2 mins later. This leads to a barrage of announcements and then nothing for 20 minutes. I hear this a lot and can only presume this is what happens. It’s mostly just a lack of awareness of the implications and also no real precise way of knowing when best to do it (especially at varying schedules) without doing some extra maths. Most people naturally use the auto option for ease.

It's not just audio announcements. The departure indicators on DLR platforms show the next three trains - or showed when they were installed, before the Message Overload Department got hold of them and interposed their own load of babble on them; lifts out of action at the other end of the system in the opposite direction, take care in wet weather; See It Say It ..., etc. A brief flash of the next three trains, then it's Next Train Approaching, as if you can't see it, which then flashes throughout its station stop.

Lifts out of action must be displayed on TfL modes in some way or form at stations. This was after some high profile incidents of disabled passengers arriving at stations unaware of their status and some unfortunate - and sometimes nasty - interactions with station staff who can do very little to help.

“See it, say it, sorted” is mandated across the rail network both verbally and audibly. The fact that’s its almost become a meme is arguably a testament to its effectiveness.
 

Kite159

Veteran Member
Joined
27 Jan 2014
Messages
20,616
Location
West of Andover
I took a class 159 from Salisbury last week that had the message expanded even further, and started talking about only being able to use advance purchase tickets on booked trains only. It was tagged onto the end of the usual penalty fare announcement so I’m not sure if it was on a unit for a trial but I don’t think it was manually triggered.

SWR can’t do concise at all with any of their PA systems. They use their own customised scripts at the stations which are excessively wordy. It all adds up.
The advance ticket warning is automatic and on all the diesels.

Just a warning for those either willingly or unwillingly travelling on a different train to what they have booked. Some guards take a hard line whereas some are a bit more flexible.
 

Brush 4

Member
Joined
25 Nov 2018
Messages
576
Well, in May when the new firm takes over, that is the time to write to them and make your suggestions. Also, please ask as I will, for catering to be reinstated on the Exeter, Weymouth, Bournemouth and perhaps Portsmouth services.
 

Transilien

Member
Joined
10 Mar 2024
Messages
382
Location
Ayrshire
ScotRail is one of the few TOCs that seems to not overdo it with announcements. On the class 385s however, the announcements are a bit longer than other trains in the fleet.
 

Deepgreen

Established Member
Joined
12 Jun 2013
Messages
6,895
Location
Gomshall, Surrey
As a counter to this if people bothered to put rubbish in the bin and keep feet off the seats, chances are these announcements wouldn't happen.

Like with most things, the minority often spoil it for the majority.
However, those people are unlikely to take the slightest notice of announcements, making them pointless additions to the existing barrage. Even the announcements are not concise. Then add irritations like stations being called 'calling points' and other useless invented terms for existing, perfectly good words, plus staff cutting in over them to repeat them manually (and often badly), and it becomes almost irresistible to wear ear buds to block the rubbish out, this also making them pointless.

To those who think all these announcements are so necessary, consider how others do things and how we survived before people were paid to invent this nonsense. I have no statistics (and they almost certainly can't be produced, on the basis that you can't know what would have happened if...) but I bet the barrage of basic commonsense announcements makes no discernible difference to behaviour or safety.

Information is only of any use if it is absorbed - 95+% of this probably isn't.
 

Russel

Established Member
Joined
30 Jun 2022
Messages
2,292
Location
Whittington
Curently on a WMR 730 on the Cross City, it seems the code of conduct announcements about litter, feet on seats etc have been added to the 730s too, so maybe it's more widespread than just SWR.

Yet more verbal nonsense to enjoy...
 

J-2739

Established Member
Joined
30 Jul 2016
Messages
2,193
Location
London
ScotRail is one of the few TOCs that seems to not overdo it with announcements. On the class 385s however, the announcements are a bit longer than other trains in the fleet.
The class 385s are some of the worst in the country when it comes to verbal diarrhoea, so won't be letting ScotRail off the hook personally.
 

greaterwest

Established Member
Joined
23 Nov 2014
Messages
1,507
ScotRail have some quite horrendously long "customer information announcements" at their station voiced by one of their staff so I'd disagree about that too.

On topic of SWR, there is a new "Change here" announcement when you approach Farnborough advising that there is a "20 minute, 1300 metre walk with some gradient change to Farnborough North railway station"...
 
Joined
16 Aug 2017
Messages
362
SWR can’t do concise at all with any of their PA systems. They use their own customised scripts at the stations which are excessively wordy. It all adds up.
And they're illiterate. "I am currently located" and "On behalf of the driver and myself". Grating for decades since the beginning of the SWT days. The announcements should be for everyone, but nobody needs to be accused of being a violent fare-evader every time they travel. The 61016 announcement should be cut short to end with that number. The thank yous and take all your belongings (I haven't got all my belongings) is best done as a personal one from the guard I think but certainly doesn't need to be repeated. Try Southeastern, much quieter, although the Electrostar does fancy a list of every station in Kent after each stop.
 

Lockwood

Member
Joined
4 Apr 2013
Messages
1,129
Why is that illiterate?
Giving their location by telling you where they are located.
What should the other be? "On behalf of the crew?" "On behalf of us?" "On behalf of the driver and me?" This is one of the times where it is "and me" not "and I" - take the driver out of the equation. Though that would give "On behalf of myself" which is clunky.

Is that what you wanted to say? Clunky? Rather than illiterate?
 

stadler

Established Member
Joined
5 Jun 2023
Messages
1,420
Location
Horsley
Northern have just added a new announcement on approach to some large stations that says "for onward wayfinding Google Maps is available at this station". What a stupid announcement. Why do passengers need to be told that Google Maps is available. It is available at any station. In fact it is available at any location in any country. SWR are by far the worst but other TOCs seem to be adding more and more excessive useless announcements too.
 

crablab

Member
Joined
8 Feb 2020
Messages
1,001
Location
UK
In Germany and Austria it's just the next station announced on the approach to it (with some interchange info for key stations). Nothing more than that.
Same in the Netherlands - this is all that's required. The rest is extraneous noise.
 

DelW

Established Member
Joined
15 Jan 2015
Messages
4,690
Northern have just added a new announcement on approach to some large stations that says "for onward wayfinding Google Maps is available at this station". What a stupid announcement. Why do passengers need to be told that Google Maps is available. It is available at any station. In fact it is available at any location in any country.
I think it may mean that Google has done internal detailed mapping of the station. If you zoom in on New Street for instance, it will allow you to select from three levels: 1 = shops, G = concourse, B1 = platforms. I don't know how long that's been the case.

Screenshots of G and B1 views attached.

Screenshot_20250316-074236.png

Screenshot_20250316-074250.png
 

Brent Goose

Member
Joined
31 Jan 2025
Messages
105
Location
Hampshire
SWR guards are monitored and assessed. They’re expected to make manual welcome announcements after every major or interchange station, and if they don’t they’ll get written up. From memory the script includes drawing attention to safety and security notices, the calling pattern and short platforms.

I’m pretty sure the auto announcements for feet on seats and litter is a manually triggered message as opposed to being built into the auto messages.

Personally the auto announcements don’t bother me, but some of the guards come off script in an attempt to be funny and that comes across a bit cringy at times.

One guard’s announcements were full of Peter Pan sayings about happy thoughts for the train arriving on time and jokes about obtaining alcohol from the drinks trolley on the morning commute (going back a bit)

This became tedious rather quickly, never heard these again post COVID
 

Frontera2

Member
Joined
11 Dec 2007
Messages
235
One of the problems I have found is a lack of knowledge on how the system will work in scheduling announcements.

In a Worldline CIS (probably the most common software used) when the operator schedules an announcement to plan every X minutes, a start and end time needs to be supplied (normally something like 0600-2200). For ease most people start it on the xx:00 but if there’s a clash (likely) the system auto-schedules it for 2 mins later. This leads to a barrage of announcements and then nothing for 20 minutes. I hear this a lot and can only presume this is what happens. It’s mostly just a lack of awareness of the implications and also no real precise way of knowing when best to do it (especially at varying schedules) without doing some extra maths. Most people naturally use the auto option for ease.
There’s a set of changes coming to the system imminently to address this, which will allow much better targeting of announcements eg only make them within x minutes of a train departure time, to ensure there’s an audience etc. this should stop the barrage of announcements or at least provide the ability to do so.
 
Joined
16 Aug 2017
Messages
362
Giving their location by telling you where they are located.
I must have been in a bad mood last night! "I am in the middle of the train" still seems a lot better to me.

What should the other be? "On behalf of the crew?" "On behalf of us?" "On behalf of the driver and me?" This is one of the times where it is "and me" not "and I" - take the driver out of the equation. Though that would give "On behalf of myself" which is clunky.

Is that what you wanted to say? Clunky? Rather than illiterate?
"From the driver and me". It's more human, and more correct. But yes, clunky is a much better word for it.
 

Meerkat

Established Member
Joined
14 Jul 2018
Messages
9,174
Giving their location by telling you where they are located.
I guess you could argue that you don’t need ’located’, and only need ‘currently’ if you are planning on moving.
I am in the middle of the train (adding ‘at the moment’ if you want more chat).
I am currently in the middle and will be working my forward
 

TUC

Established Member
Joined
11 Nov 2010
Messages
4,242
Same with Elizabeth line. It’s a constant barrage of announcements .

Why, here in Uk do we have so many, yet when on European trains so few?
As ever, the kind of people who specify such announcements lack any common sense reference points such as these. They only work on an abstract concept of risk, which they probably lie awake in bed worrying about whilst the rest of us are soundly sleeping.
 

J-2739

Established Member
Joined
30 Jul 2016
Messages
2,193
Location
London
Same with Elizabeth line. It’s a constant barrage of announcements .

Why, here in Uk do we have so many, yet when on European trains so few?
The Elizabeth Line used to be really good with stripped back but meaningful announcements:

This is the train to *station*
Next station, *station*
Next station, *station*
*Station*
This is the train to *station*

Now it's:

This is the Elizabeth Line service to *station*
The next station is *station*
We are now arriving at *station*
*Station*
This is the Elizabeth Line service to *station*


What does the second version fundamentally add to the first?
 

Top