Forgot railcard - being taken to court over regulation of railways act 1889 section 5(3)

[gray1404]

I would agree that a signature is not required for the validity of a railcard to be confirmed. TIL have simply chosen to disregard evidence for no valid reason. It is their blanket policy. They apply it to all situations and its not acceptable.

I once had my details demanded of me by a TIL person because they hadn't seen that sort of ticket before and when I questioned this the person became very rude and agressive. I was travelling with a friend who works for a TOC and he asserted himself and that was the end of the matter. The same person tried to claim to my friend that his PRIV boxes were not valid as he'd not travelled on the TOC he works for. I tried complaining to ATW but they wouldn't listen to a complaint about their contractor. I spoke to TIL and they rejected my complaint because it didn't contain a signature and was sent by email. The are hopeless. It was a complaint, not a legal case. I phoned them up and they insisted ALL correspondence needs a signature even if emailed.

 

[wsph]

If I post a signed letter to TIL with the railcard image on a separate sheet is that enough, or does the image itself have to be signed?

 

[gray1404]

The photocopy of the railcard along with a signed covering letter is enough. Be sure to include your name, address and any reference number.

I am not sure though if the file is sent back to Cross Country for a decision to be made by the train company themselves if the matter should be taken to court or not. So I am not sure if the file will still be with TIL.

That said, I would send this letter and copy of the railcard as a matter of urgency. I would request in the letter that the court case is withdrawn. I am thinking if you sent this first class today it might actually arrive Monday. Of course TIL might be closed until 2 January. It would be worth calling them on Monday to ask if they have received your letter. If they say the matter is no longer with them then try and get the details of who you need to speak to.

 

[najaB]

I once had my details demanded of me by a TIL person because they hadn't seen that sort of ticket before and when I questioned this the person became very rude and agressive.

In person? I wasn't aware that TIL did revenue protection as well.

 

[Puffing Devil]

If I post a signed letter to TIL with the railcard image on a separate sheet is that enough, or does the image itself have to be signed?

Call them. Don't speculate or guess. Ask them exactly what they need to drop the case. The ball is very much in their court. Did I say call them ASAP?

 

[wsph]

I posted the letter with proof and they haven't gotten back to me yet. It's friday, the court date is meant to be Tuesday and the TIL office isn't open on weekends. What do I do now? I'm thinking I should send back the guilty/not guilty letter to the court tomorrow morning so it arrives on Monday, and then also ring TIL on monday and try to hurry them up

 

[Hadders]

Get to the court early on Tuesday and seek out the prosecutor. Talk to them nicely, explain what has happened and they might agree to withdraw the case.

 

[Puffing Devil]

I posted the letter with proof and they haven't gotten back to me yet. It's friday, the court date is meant to be Tuesday and the TIL office isn't open on weekends. What do I do now? I'm thinking I should send back the guilty/not guilty letter to the court tomorrow morning so it arrives on Monday, and then also ring TIL on monday and try to hurry them up

Did you call them? What was the result of that call?

 

[gray1404]

Get to the court early on Tuesday and seek out the prosecutor. Talk to them nicely, explain what has happened and they might agree to withdraw the case.

If you phone call on Monday doesn't work. Then follow this advise and go on Tuesday early to the court. The Usher should be able to tell you ho the prosecutor for Cross Country is. Make sure you take paperwork and copies of things with you to back up what you are saying. If they ill not withdraw the case or agree to an absolute discharge, then it may still be possible for you to agree an out of court settlement with that person direct that their client may be willing to accept.

If the case does end up in court though make sure the court are aware of your income so that they can take this into account when deciding any fine, rather then amusing average earnings.

 

[Hadders]

Even if you are successful by phone on Monday I'd still go to the court on Tuesday and check the case has been withdrawn. The wheels of the legal system turn very slowly and it's quite possible that the case will go ahead even if they've agreed to withdraw it.

 

[nuts & bolts]

The lack of an "original signature" surely isn't an impediment to confirming the validity of a supplied photo of a railcard and adding the correspondence to the file. (Will they refund the cost of the stamp?)



Or of the company opting to disregard evidence presented to it in a timely manner (but not in the form of its choosing) that purports to show that the matter should be closed without the need for any court involvement.

A scan of both the railcard and attached signed cover letter confirming 'I am the bearer of railcard' surely would have been suffice as a declaration is being made if sent by email?

 

[najaB]

A scan of both the railcard and attached signed cover letter confirming 'I am the bearer of railcard' surely would have been suffice as a declaration is being made if sent by email?

Probably, yes. However the OP said that he just took a photo of the railcard and sent that.

 

[gray1404]

They are being unreasonable not just accepting the scanned copy. A railcard contains the holders name printed or written on it (by the booking office) too so it is clear that the railcard corresponds to the case file of the person they are investigating.

 

[Clip]

They are being unreasonable not just accepting the scanned copy. A railcard contains the holders name printed or written on it (by the booking office) too so it is clear that the railcard corresponds to the case file of the person they are investigating.

I could knock up a convincing railcard in a matter of seconds as a scan - would that be ok too?

 

[221129]

They are being unreasonable not just accepting the scanned copy. A railcard contains the holders name printed or written on it (by the booking office) too so it is clear that the railcard corresponds to the case file of the person they are investigating.

If they require a signature then that is the situation. Not sure how your post helps the OP.

 

[island]

The situation is that an offence is committed by joining a Train with a Railcard discounted ticket and without a valid Railcard.

The TOCs have, as a concession, offered to not prosecute the offence in certain circumstances if the Railcard is subsequently submitted. They can set whatever terms they wish to that concession, which can include submitting documents bearing the passenger’s actual signature. If the passenger wishes to avail of the concession, they need to abide by the prescribed process.

 

[najaB]

They are being unreasonable not just accepting the scanned copy.

According to the OP it wasn't even a scanned copy.

 

[323235]

Any news on this @wsph ?